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  1. PlayerFlayer

    Map Scale and the River Reik

  2. @Yepesnopes: Yes, Characteristic dice are more valuable than Fortune dice for a list of reasons. Yes, two Fortune dice produce both a greater probability for success and a chance for more successes when compared to a single characteristic die. At average characteristic levels (Like Str 3) the small number of Fortune dice involved in the exchange(2) make the transition of nominal effect, out-of-game mechanical loss smoothed out by the few mechanical gains. In-game it's a barely noticed growing pain. However when you get up into above average characteristics the cost of characteristic advancement becomes much greater. From 4[3] it can really be a tough decision to advance to 5[0]. 5[0] can do things 4[3] can't, in addition to being able to gain more future Fortune dice in that characteristic in total. The increasing difficulty to advance a characteristic was by the original rules illustrated by the fact that it cost more and more advances to gain the next level in a characteristic. That way may seem preferable to having to take on a statistical alteration(or partial penalty if you look at it strictly in terms of successes in the dice pool) but not only in my own experience but also in the experiences shared with me on sites like this, Players are not interested in spending those high numbered advances to increase their characteristics. This way gives them the option to do so at reduced advancement costs while eliminating fortune dice overkill, or to keep their 3[2] and work on another characteristic instead of paying the cost of trying to be so specialized. Kind of like the exponential curve in a point-buy mixed with a sort of off set level ajustment like the 'Bloodlines' in 'Unearthed Arcana 3E'. Maxed out Fortune dice in both Career related characteristics? Might want to diversify your career path. Or not, and pay the costs to really become focused and follow all related careers and have all related characteristics climb to their maximum heights. If that's the case, the player needs to keep in mind the characteristic scale. Roughly 1 through 6 with a few exceptions. That means theres more of a power gap than systems with a broader scale. There is a huge difference between someone with Str 3 and someone with a Str 4, not just mechanically but especially in in-game rarity. It's exceptionally rare for a human to have any characteristic score a 5. A 6[+] should be Legendary for a human, even at PC rank 5. Back to the out of game mechanics of it. In coming up with this I thought about these main points. 1-Fortune dice need to be limited. 2-In order to not run into a dead-end during career advancement Fortune dice need to be limited by something that increases. 3-Limiting the Fortune dice by character rank does not add up without other rule changes, some of which I think take away thematically from the careers, like letting them put Fortune dice into characteristics that are not associated with that career. 4-It seemed natural that the sub parts of a characteristic should be governed by the greater part. 5-With the limitations on Fortune dice being based on Characteristic dice in a corresponding Characteristic the need for that characteristic to advance becomes much greater, with the extremely steep advancement cost for characteristics this can put a dead-end in front of a character. That's why the cost of advancing characteristics is now included in the cost of purchasing Fortune dice. 6-With characteristic advancement now at a reduced cost, PC characteristics raise in level far too quickly. 7-'Resetting' the Fortune dice allows for a steady progression of advancements the reward the PC along the way instead of requiring them to accumulate several advancements before purchasing an increased characteristic. The problem that you are saying is that there is a sort of shift-shock. And there is. However the alternative is still available to the PC. Save up your advancements just as you would if you were trying to increase your Characteristic using the normal rules, then spend them in whole or in part between Characteristic dice advancement and Fortune dice advancement. The more they save up the smoother the transition. But no one's stuck with the dead-end with their career advancements.
  3. Ok, just read everyone else's posts. I agree with Gruntl. Moreover 5[3] seems like a perfectly fine characteristic/fortune dice combination for any given characteristic, even Int. The number of skills associated with a single characteristic is still only relative to the characteristic being used at the moment. Intelligence governing the largest number of skills still does not mean that those skills are the ones used most often, that is in large part up to the GM, and it seems natural in my opinion for the more intelligent character to be the more skilled character. As far as unrealistic, 3[6] and combinations like that are the problem for me, and the dice pool they create are also unwieldy. I love the 'deadliness of combat' aspect of this system. With most of the other popular systems the character's health or hit points became so high that they can fall from a plane and get up without even being half dead. What a childish movie that is. Realism is something that can make a fantasy setting believably interesting for an adult, and I think Warhammer has taken more to that audience. Who is really held in suspense reading a story or watching a movie where they know who is and who isn't going to die, or where main characters pull off rediculusly difficult or impossible stunts without any believable explanation whatsoever? I mean if you want to play Mutants and Masterminds at least there's some explanation there, albeit a bit more of a childish one in my opinion. With other systems, like D&D for example, there's no mechanically realistic explanation for the survivability of say, a 15th Lv human Fighter. Trying against the odds to use smart tactics so as to 'Not get killed' is the backbone of any realistic and exciting action. Even a brute Orc or Gor should have to be shrewd if he wants to be long-lived and combative at the same time. This system has that part down I think.
  4. This response is only to the "Max fortune dice with characteristics" portion of the question. Sorry ahead of time if I'm being redundant, as I did not read everyone else's posts before I wrote this. Let me also say that I really do not like "House Rules" but with this issue, at least as I understand it, there seems a need to be addressed in my opinion. I've made the following adjustments: • Fortune dice associated with a characteristic must be less than the characteristic itself. For example Str 3 may have up to 2 Fortune dice associated with that characteristic, a Str 4 may have up to 3 Fortune dies associated with that characteristic, ect.. • In order to advance a characteristic you must first fully advance the Fortune dice associated with that characteristic. For example if you wish to advance a Str 3 to a Str 4 you must first have 2 Fortune dice associated with the Str characteristic to do so. •The number of advances needed to raise a characteristic is reduced by the number of Fortune dice associated with that characteristic. For example if you have already maxed out your Fortune dice associated with a Str 3[2] and wish to advance to Str 4 it would cost the normal number of advances(4) minus the number of Fortune dice associated with the Str characteristic(2), making the total number of advances needed 4-2=2. This off sets the extremely high advancement cost of increasing characteristics. Characteristics still have their normal maximum value by character race. •When a characteristic is increased all Fortune dice associated with that characteristic are reset to 0. For example if you have already maxed out your Fortune dice associated with a Str 3[2] and wish to advance to Str 4 you would pay the above-mentioned reduced advancement cost of 2 advances and reset your fortune dice total associated with Str back to zero giving you a Str 4[0]. If you then wish to advance to Str 5 you must first advance the fortune dice associated with that characteristic to 4[3]. This may all seem complicated when reading it but the idea is actually very simple and straightforward. The math works out well from rank 1 all the way through rank 5. It also makes for some more interesting character advancement choices when trying to balance career and noncareer completion advancements, prompting a more diversified career path.
  5. PlayerFlayer

    How many times can a skill be trained?

    Good luck to a player trying to stay alive out the gate with no skill training.
  6. I've looked all over the site and can't seem to figure it out. Does anyone know?
  7. Let me start by saying that I've already purchased every single WHFR 3rd ed product sold so far. I'm a fan. Even more so, I'm a fan of the setting it self. One of the things that has made the WH setting so popular is the way it allows and encourages players to not only play as fantasy personas such as Dwarves & Elves, but also as the fantasy villains- Skaven, Vampire Counts, Orcs, Goblins and more. WHFR 3rd needs this. To play as a Clan Eshin Skaven Assassin, A Blood Dragon, an Orc Warboss, or a crafty Night Goblin Shaman, that's a huge part of what makes Warhammer so unique… And fun!