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I think GrandClam is right on everything except Irina. I admit she isn't a really powerful character, but her liturgies make other characters stronger - okay, they effectively make Zor'ka stronger. With Irina, you can choose wheter you want to raise Zor'ka's combat, stamina or movement value. Furthermore, her tokens allow you to introduce a reinforcement and even introduce her again if she dies, effectively giving you more characters than your opponent has. On the other han, attacking a healthy character with Irina really doesn't make sense unless she took a useful weapon from a crate. Maybe attacking a wounded or weak character that Zor'ka doesn't want to chase down is okay.
In my opinion, Irina is pure support. She makes Zor'ka stronger, can introduce new Voivodes as reinforcements if Zor'ka needs them, can accomlish objectives or search crates while Zor'ka fights, and she can be sacrificed if the situation calls for it because she enters play again.
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I sent them several questions regarding other rules during the last weeks (even months) and didn't get any answers yet.
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Eiko is right, only the target that Zor'ka chose and characters within 3 circles of the target are attacked. The magnifier rules just state that circles adjacent to or containing a Smiljan Coil or Module are considered to be adjacent to Zor'ka and therefor may be attacked, the rules don't say that all characters on all those circles are automatically attacked.
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Simplifying the scenario, especially by making the passages immune to destruction, is a good idea. I'm looking forward to playing the scenario as soon as possible!
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PsychoWolf is right, she may only target one character- either one adjacent to her or one adjacent to a Voivode. But she attacks not only her target but every character that's standing near the target (up to three circles away I think). She also attacks friendly characters standing in this area, only Voivodes and Zor'ka herself are immune to these attacks.
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Yes we can! Sorry, SHE can.
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Wow! New characters, a new faction and now new boards with new types of circles. It's really cool that they announced almost everything the players had asked for. But it would be even cooler if they actually RELEASED something!
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I still think the player who completes the "Mechanics" objective will have a huge advantage because the other players don't have the possibility to accomplish all their objectives and collect the VPs. Furthermore, the rules still don't say how the Reich can destroy the secret passages. But whatever, I WILL play the revised scenario and report back as soon as I have the time.
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She doesn't fit my "sneaky attacks from out of path"-style of play either. If I want to have a close combat fighter, I usually take the Stosstruppen. When I actually played Yula, I always equipped her stamina pack. I have to admit I thought Yula's close combat bar wasn't worth it because no opponent would enter a circle adjacend to her, but I will give her and maybe even her medal another try. After all, it's no fun playing the same teams over and over again.
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I can understand that somebody wants to have Yula because she's hard to find and he wants to have a complete set of characters, but i just have to ask: Do you actually PLAY Yula? I bought her too and even played her in a few games, but I think she's quite weak. I wouldn't choose her anymore instead of any of the Reich characters in the base set and certainly not instead of Hoss Harbinger. We even have mercenaries to include in a Reich team. I just don't see a point in including Yula because there are better options. Am I missing something?
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Miah999 said:
For the last time H-to-H weapons require LOS, it's on page 17 of the Revised Rules.
Maybe you wanted to post this in another topic?
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Zor'ka is really powerful and hard to kill or even to damage. If playing objective mode, I normally don't even bother to attack her. Instead, I run from her and try to complete objectives as fast as possible. That was the Reich's tactic in my game, and it gave them 5 VP quickly.
I think you should at least change the rule about the sneak objective. It should be possible to solve it more than once, so that every faction at least has a chance to accomplish all of their objective. As there are three sneak objectives on the two boards (one primary and two secondary), maybe you could give each faction a different sneak objective. The first faction to accomplish their objective gets the document token in addition to the VP.
Whatever changes you work out, I hope you post them again. It's cool to have a three player scenario.
And concerning your rules question: I think Zor'ka with presence ignores all mental duels, so she walks on Heizingers path without any problems. As you said, she's almost untouchable.
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I played the scenario yesterday. It took half an hour to set it up and at least two and a half hours to play it. The setup is time-consuming because of the secret doors and the objectives that aren't on objective circles or don't match the symbols on the board.
The game ended in a draw between the Reich and the Matriarchy. Both had 6 VP when the Matriarchy accomplished their 4th objective. The Reich had recovered the documents and accomplished 1 primary and 2 secondary objectives. I ruled that the sneak objective in the crypt could be accomplished several times in the game because without this change only the Reich would have had a chance to win.
The Reich won the setup role, placed the document token in the crypt and rushed in to recover the token and to accomplish both of their objectives in the crypt, including the sneak objective. The other factions opened the secret passages and raced through them as fast as they could, but they had no chance to stop the Reich from accomplishing the sneak objective or saving the document. If I hadn't changed the rule about the sneak objective, only the Reich could have won the scenario at this point.
The Reich characters now tried to enter the castle map and accomplish their objectives there, while the other factions had to split their attention between stopping the Reich, entering the crypt to accomplish some objectives and stopping the third faction from doing the same. The Reich entered the castle at their athletics objective and immediately accomplished it. It was obvious they would move in force to their last objective on the board and win, so the Matriarchy quickly moved all of their characters to their objectives in the crypt and accomlished them, making the game a draw with the Union being the only loser. It was the smartest move the Matriarchy could do in this situation.
Really cool about this three player scenario is that each player really has to think about his actions and their consequences. Attacking one of the other factions in force would only help the third faction to win the game. Not attacking enemy characters could leave them in a position to attack and wound characters of the third faction. Even accomplishing your own objectives could actually help your enemies to win the game.
In short: It's a challenge to play and quite different from normal two player games, but it's quite difficult because of all the special rules. Furthermore, I think the Reich has the biggest chance to win because of their starting position.
And a small off-topic note again: I'll send word if I ever make it to munich or saarbrücken. Just remember: Braunschweig is a nice city too - okay, it isn't, but at least it's a city and not some small village in Ostfriesland.
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I always thought the special ability of Strafe was the ability to make a hand to hand attack at range 2. As Strafe states that it is a hand to hand weapon, all attacks made with it should be hand to hand, not ranged. And if the attack IS hand to hand, it doesn't need line of sight and should be unaffected by smoke.
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When I play Zermann, I always wonder if I should use the stamina pack or the command pack because both are quite good. I think rolling 5 dice is an important advantage of Zermann, so I often use the command pack. As a bonus token, I think the obscura korps badge or the Countess Bathory (unable to check if this is spelled right) fit Zermann better then the Masque. The badge can increase his attack or mental value (that's also his range), the Countess can heal him if he kills another character.
Although the stosstruppen are very cool, I discovered that the sckocktruppen with command pack are quite good in the suggested team. They have a high attack value because the team tends to be concentrated on one path, they can set on overwatch without point cost, and they roll many dice.
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The rules for Delta's AN-M11 "flame grenade" state that characters ENTERING circles on the same path as a Fire token suffer 3 Automatic Successes, so I think that characters just standing in those circles are not affected at all. So, when the grenade is thrown and the fire tokes are placed, the characters on the affected path don't suffer any wounds. Even during their activations, they are unaffected if they attack without moving or immediately leave the path, they just suffer the automatic successes if they move into another circle on the affected path. It seems like standing in fire is okay, only walking into the fire is dangerous.
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Although I didn't have the time to actually set up and play your scenario, I have at least read your description and the special rules. In my opinion, there are too many special rules to consider when playing your scenario. Three factions, two boards, special starting points, objectives that don't fit the symbols on the objective circles, secret doors that are only usable after special objectives have been accomplished, troopers with new skills, a document token that has to be recovered - I really think it's a bit too much for one scenario.
Additionally, I have some questions regarding the setup and rules. The rules say the reich can destroy the secret passages. How can they actually be destoyed? Are the reich characters able to get from the crypt map to the castle map before the secret passages are open, or do they have to stay in the crypt? Is the document token placed on the board just like a flag token? If the answer is yes, then at least one of the factions won't have any access to the token at the start of the game because it simply starts on the wrong board.
I'm really sorry because this post sounds quite negative, but these are my thoughts after reading the scenario rules.
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She looks very cool indeed, and I think it's only fair that a great character is announced for the union / matriarchy faction after several shogunate characters have been announced and even released for the reich / shogunate faction. I only hope that her "loyalty to Oksana" really translates into "She may not be in the same team with Zor'ka". The team would be way to powerful otherwise. On the other hand, if she joins a union team with characters like MacNeal, Barry or Hoax, the resulting team would also be powerful. Just forget it - I want her! Soon!
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Sebastian DuArgo said:
Here is another invisibility question. If hermann has is Hermetica Occulta equipped and invisible hoax loses her mental duel to enter the path, could another invisible hoax attempt to enter the path during the same activation?
I don't think she could, because the Hermetica states: "A given CHARACTER may only iniciate this Mental duel once per activation." Hoax is still only one character, although there are several invisible figures on the board. But probably this question is one of many "invisibility questions" that should be answered officially. By the way, has anyone recieved ANY official answer lately?
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Thanks to both of you for posting pictures and information! I want shogunate characters!!!!
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Hi PsychoWolf! Bevor hier gar keiner antwortet: Ich werde das Szenario auf jeden Fall ausprobieren, sobald ich genug Zeit habe. Das Ganze sieht ja nach einer größeren Sache über zwei Spielfelder aus. Ganz nebenbei: Wohnst du zufällig in der Umgebung von Braunschweig?
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I thought about a pack with mercenary troopers too. One of the troopers could be a fighter, with one equipment pack focussing on ranged combat (powerful automatic gun) and one focussing on meele combat (weak gun or no gun at all, but powerful meele abilities). The third pack could include a sort of bodyguard ability, maybe taking wounds for another character or being the target of attacks instead of another character.
The other trooper could be more of a support personnel with only a pistol as his main weapon. One of his equipment packs would focus on healing other characters (first aid kit etc.) and another would focus on completing objectives (maybe a token that gives him selected skills like wolf's jack of all trades) and winning initiative. The third pack should include a grenade and a smoke grenade.
By the way, I really like the idea to have a werewolf character for the Reich. Maybe he would be playable as either human or monster by choosing another equipment pack, say monster-like abilities if you choose the combat pack and completely different, more human-like abilities if you choose the stamina pack. Or his special object could be an ability token you can "switch" from human to wolf and back.
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Sorry dieased, I think you are wrong. If a character successfully Bull Rushes one of the invisible Hoax figures, the player controlling Hoax can't decide whether this figure is the actual Hoax or not. Instead, the figure that was Bull Rushed has to be replaced with the visible Hoax figure and all other invisible figures are removed from the board. The same applies if Hoax suffers a wound after a grenade was thrown at one of the invisible figures. The figure that was the "target" of the grenade has to be replaced with the real Hoax, other invisible figures have to be removed from the board.
The player controlling Hoax may only choose which invisible figure becomes the actual Hoax if Hoax spends an action to become visible or several invisible figures are forced to become visible at the same time (both are affected by smoke or a grenade, for example).
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Attacks with Strafe are hand to hand attacks and don't need line of sight, even if attacking at range 2. Furthermore, it was officially ruled that attacks that don't need line of sight aren't affected by smoke, so it should be possible to attack with Strafe at range 2 in the smoke.
By the way, I don't see anything "noob" here. Especially the different rulings concerning smoke are somewhat contradicting.
3 Player Scenario
in Tannhauser
Posted
I finally managed to play the revised scenario. It took about half an hour to set up and about to hours to play. The Union team included Hoax, Brown, MacNeal and two Alpha troopers, the Reich team included Hoss, Eva, Karl and two Stosstruppen, the Matriarchy team included Zor'ka, Irina, Isishka and four Voivodes (Who else?).
Following the strategy hints given by PsychoWolf, the Union and Matriarchy teams raced towards the secret passages while sending out single characters to accomplish objectives in the castle. The Union successfully accomlished objectives en passant while moving towards the passage before it got into a shootout with the Matriachy team moving in the opposite direction. The Union destroyed several Voivodes. Meanwhile in the crypt, Eva and Karl moved towards their objectives as fast as possible while Hoss and the troopers covered the secret passages.
Every team quickly accomplished the matching objectives on the starting map (so the Reich got the Mechanics objective again), but the Union and Matriachy teams prepared themselves to move through the passages in full force. Irina, who had accomplished an objective, was separated from the rest of her team so Hoss switched places with her using his equipment. He even came into a position near a Reich objective in the castle.
Hoss moved towards the objective. The Union tried to attack him but failed because of his prescience ability and the Helm of Diomedes, so Zor'ka moved back towards Hoss but failed to damage him enough to stop him from accomplishing the objective. The Union moved through the passage to attack the Reich characters in the crypt.
Irina, who had been transferred to the crypt, tried to accomplish the Matriarchy objective there but had to roll a die because she lacked the needed skills and had to handle attacks made by Eva and Karl. A Stosstruppen managed to move through the secret passage near the remaining Reich objective and accomlish it, Irishka and a Voivode failing to kill the Stoss in time. So the Reich won by accomplishing all of their objective, the Matriarchy managed to complete their objectives in the castle and one half of their primary objective in the crypt. The Union only completed their objectives in the castle.
Conclusion: I still think the Reich has an advantage because they can get to the Mechanics objective fast. The other factions have to enter the crypt as fast as possible, probably even avoid each other in the castle. They have to stop the Reich before it even enters the castle. The Reich, on the other hand, has to make a push through at least one of the other factions to enter the castle. This is quite cool because it offers a difficult tactical situation for everybody.