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xris

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  1. This had been noticed before, there's was a thread about it on BGG that drifted onto the topic, Doom as a reward… which I made the following comment. Elder Sign is the name of the Adventure card that has the Doom icon as a Reward. It is the only Adventure card of the boardgame that has this as a Reward. There are four Other World Adventure cards with a Doom token as a Reward but they are Other World, not normal Adventure cards. I wouldn't be at all surprised that FFG simply got this incorrect in the original rules. We have seen plenty of other errors in the rulebook (such as the Wildcard icon on the red die can be used as a 4 Investigation, not as a 1 Investigation). It might be only now that the app designers noticed this (or at least highlighted the issue) and have now taken steps to correct this. Admittedly, it does make the game easier but so did most of the other correction in the FAQ. Maybe we will see this added to a future FAQ, that Doom icons as a Reward means you remove a Doom token on the Doom track. It doesn't break the game if this is implemented, certain clarifications will be needed but it can work. Yes, it makes the game easier but it makes those four Other World Adventure cards worthwhile because currently they aren't much of a reward considering you need to complete two Adventure cards to obtain the Reward (the original Adventure card that has an Other World icon as well as the OW Adventure card). I do think it was most likely a mistake and the intent was that a Doom token should be removed. It makes those 4 Other World Adventure cards worthwhile to complete with this change.
  2. shattering said: My question: After completing a task, do you have to re-roll the dice or is it ok to fail the adventure right after that?It happened in a game yesterday. So a monster was holding my yellow dice and it was on an adventure where it was impossible to clear (it needs 8 dice so I need to unlock the yellow dice first) So I decided to just kill the monster to get my dice back and quickly fail the adventure. The problem was, there was a terror effect on the adventure card and I don't want to roll an impossible adventure just to get the terror effect. Well, the rules tell us… Regardless of whether or not the active player resolved any Terror effects, he must then do one of the following: 1. Attempt again to complete a task. 2. Fail to resolve the Adventure card. This seems to suggest you have a choice, i.e. you can decide to make another attempt or you decide that you have failed. So I would say in your case you can decide to fail the Adventure if you so wish.
  3. Not sure what kind of help anyone can give but for a start it would be better if you posted this in the correct forum! This is the Elder Sign boardgame forum, what you want is the Elder Sign Omens forum
  4. xris

    Expansions

    If you want new Investigators, Ancient Ones, Heralds, Guardians, Mythos Cards and more then they are already available, at least unofficial fan-created versions I made are available on BGG Investigators > Unofficial Investigator cards (converted from all AH expansions) Ancient Ones > New Ancient Ones, 4 from Dunwich Horror Heralds and Guardians > Elder Sign: Abominations - Game Expansion Herald - Great Old Ones Herald - Shudde M'ell Herald - Bokrug Guardian - Nodens Guardian, Hypnos Mythos Cards > Elder Sign: Abominations - Game Expansion (Abominations) Adventure Cards > Elder Sign: Abominations
  5. Isildróin said: Thank you both very much, Mad and Xris. Much more clear for me now And…, since this moment… Cthulhu doesn't disappoint me so much, now I have the probabilistic mathematical analysis that Xris made: Great! (Have you thoght to create a fan made investigator based on you? "Xris, the mathematician"…) Seriously, thanks a lot for the help. Well, it's clear that the point to defeat Cthulhu, if you can't avoid the final confrontation is to get enough items to assure the "luck-probability" plays on your side… Now I must leave you… I have an Ancient One waiting for me in the living room… I'm glad that Cthulhu may now seem more of a threat to you I think he is one of the "better" AO designs for Elder Sign in as much that without preparation you are toast. If you are wondering how much the Yellow and / or Red dice will help then here are the figures. 6 Green dice 43.2% chance per turn of removing one Doom token. Number of turns to remove 11 Doom tokens = 60 Yellow + 6 Green dice 56.4% chance per turn of removing one Doom token. Number of turns to remove 11 Doom tokens = 35* Red + 6 Green dice 71.6% chance per turn of removing one Doom token. Number of turns to remove 11 Doom tokens = 24** Red + Yellow + 6 Green dice 80.5% per turn of removing one Doom token. Number of turns to remove 11 Doom tokens = 20*** * Please note that there are only 9 Items that add the Yellow dice! The figure of 35 turns assumes you are playing an Item every one of those 35 turns (which of course is not possible) ** Please note that there are only 11 Items that add the Red dice! The figure of 24 turns assumes you are playing an Item every one of those 24 turns (which of course is not possible) *** Please note that there are only a total of 18 Items that add the Red and Yellow dice! So, 9 turns at the most, not 20! BTW, these figures do take into account that if you fail with 6 dice, then you try again with 5 dice, and 4 dice, and 3 dice. Of course these figures do not take into account for Clue tokens or Spells, either of which will improve your chances of defeating Cthulhu, as will Allies and Investigator's Special Abilities. And no, I am not going to release figures for those as well So, going into Final Battle armed with all the 11 Red dice cards means you most likely will still fail! While you might be able to remove 2 Doom tokens in one turn when rolling 8 dice (6 Green plus Red plus Yellow), it is still not clear that with all 18 Yellow / Red Items you can defeat Cthulhu armed with just those 18 Items. Isildróin said: (Have you thoght to create a fan made investigator based on you? "Xris, the mathematician"…) Heh. No, not yet but I have made new Elder Sign Investigator cards for all the other 32 Investigator featured from the Arkham Horror expansions. You can find them here. Unofficial Investigator cards (converted from all AH expansions) I also play Elder Sign with at minimum the Great Old One Herald, which makes the game more interesting for me (otherwise it is far too easy). I've created a whole bunch of new features for Elder sign, most of which don't actually add any new rules so it is very easy to introduce them to new players without having to explain exceptions to the rules or mixing old and new components. Elder Sign: Abominations - Game Expansion
  6. Isildróin said: From quite far from Arkham, New England: Spain. Hey pals! Don't you think that combat Cthulhu isn't so hard as this Ancient One deserves? I mean, it doesn't matter how many "points" of stamina or sanity, It atacks the maximun level; so, if you have an standard 5-5 investigator, 4-4 resolving the permanent effect of Cthulhu, you have 6 times receiving Cthulhu's atacks before you die… I find it a bit dissappointing, and you? One doubt: An investigator can try to complete the task any time he/she wants, but I assume that if you can complete one time those dice are fixed each one in the part of the task, I mean: you haven't all the dice to try to complete the task again, have you? (is it my English enough clear?) Lovecraft's lovers: a hug from this side of the ocean Welcome from England, Mad is in Germany if I remember correctly First, let's address your question concerning how many times you can complete the task during your turn. If you roll the 6 green dice and manage to roll Law, Peril and Terror on three of them, then those three dice are set aside (i.e.placed on the task on the AO card). You now have three green dice left which you can roll again, so in theory it is possible to succeed twice during your turn (as a matter of interest, you only have a 1 in 36 chance of rolling Law, Peril and Terror with three green dice). Even if you add the Yellow and Red dice to your dice pool, you can never manage to succeed more than twice during one turn (because to succeed a third time would require a total of 9 dice). Of course it will be easier to succeed once or twice using 8 dice than just using 6 dice but the point is that each time you manage to roll the requirement (i.e. Law, Peril and Terror), then those dice are set aside (just as when you attempt a normal task on an Adventure card). Cthulhu is easy but only if you have Items, Spells and / or Clues (plus any Special Abilities the Investigator may have).. If you use just the 6 green dice, then you have a 43.2% of rolling the required Law, Peril and Terror during your turn. You do have a chance of succeeding twice but as mentioned, you would be rather lucky if you did. Given that you have a 43.2% of succeeding, then on average you will take something like 25 to 26 turns to succeed 11 times (11 because you are required to remove 11 Doom tokens to defeat Cthulhu). Trouble is, Cthulhu adds a Doom token every 4 turns (i.e. every time he attacks a Doom token is added to the Doom track). So during those 25 turns it takes to remove the original 11 Doom tokens, Cthulhu would have added a further 6 Doom tokens! To remove these additional 6 Doom tokens will take a further 14 or so turns! This means we are already at 40 turns and we have established that at best you only have 28 turns maximum to defeat Cthulhu (if you are wondering why 28 turns max, then please have a read of my post on BGG, Unfair devouring against Cthulhu?). So in summary, if you are only using the 6 green dice, there is little hope in defeating Cthulhu. If you can add an Item or two each turn then it becomes much easier. Of course there are only 18 Item cards that allow you to add the Yellow and / or Red dice but given that the investigators have a fair number of these along with Clue tokens and Spells, it does become easier to defeat Cthulhu. The more you have the easier it becomes. Going into Final Battle with only a few of these will most likely end in defeat.
  7. Just a quick reply to Mad, I will address the OP post a bit later when I have more time. Sorry Mad, you are incorrect on how to handle the Final Battle against Cthulhu Please have a read of the post I made on BGG that gives more detail on how the Final Battle is intended to work. Unfair devouring against Cthulhu? The point to note is that you use your maximum Sanity / Stamina, not your actual Sanity / Stamina. Isildróin is correct, the investigators will typically have only 6 Midnights before they are devoured on the 7th (you should have somewhere between 25 to 28 turns to dispose of Cthulhu).
  8. Just as a reminder, this is the forum for Elder Sign, the boardgame. For any discussion concernng Elder Sign: Omens, the app, please use the appropriate message board, found here Elder Sign: Omens forum
  9. You can navigate to the Elder Sign: Omens forum following these links (from any page). Catalog > Media > Elder Signs: Omens > Message Board
  10. I replied to the BGG thread but here is a copy of the reply for those here that might be interested. As the rules stand, it is not clear how this should be resolved. Both methods have merit, both methods can be "justified" thematically one way or the other. In my previous post So a die could be removed from the Spell and added to your dice pool but, if it is the yellow or red die then you will need to "pay" for it by discarding the appropriate Common or Unique Item. I should have added that there is an alternate interpretation and that was when removing a yellow or red dice from a Spell it doesn't need to be "paid" for again. My bad. Before we go on, lets make sure we are talking about the same situation. Note: I changed the example so the die in question doesn't show a Wildcard result, it wouldn't make much sense to discard such a die During Player A's turn he had spent an Item (e.g. Dynamite) and added the red die to his die pool. After rolling the dice, the red die was showing a Peril result. Player A then plays a Spell card (e.g. Enchant Weapon) and places the red die (Peril face up) on the Spell card. Player A's turn has now ended and it is Player B's turn. Player B doesn't want the Peril result for the Adventure he wants to try (perhaps a more important Adventure has appeared and needs to be attempted right now, e.g. Transported by Magic). For whatever reason, Player B decides to remove the red die from the Spell. The FAQ makes it clear that he is allowed to do this. Before any roll, a player may remove some or all of the dice held on spells in order to roll them. Any spell that has no dice remaining on it is discarded. New dice cannot be added to a spell to replace those that were removed from it. The question is if the red die is now part of Player B's dice pool? One viewpoint says that since the red die has been paid for during Player A's turn then it was part of the dice pool then and is still part of the dice pool now. The fact that it had been placed on a Spell doesn't change this. Since Player B is allowed to remove dice held on Spells then is returns to the dice pool. Another viewpoint says that as soon as the red die is removed from the Spell card then the Spell has been cancelled and the red die is simply available to be used again. Yellow and red die do not remain in the dice pool between player's turns (as stated on page 9 of the rules "In any event, the die is removed from the dice pool at the end of the active player's turn"). If Player B want to use the red die then he needs to spend an Item to add it to his dice pool. Which viewpoint is correct? I don't really think there is a "correct" answer. Both methods work. Even if FFG officially rule this one way or the other, either method would be fine. Personally, I think that the first method makes the game a little easier therefore that's a reason not to use it. I prefer the consistency of saying that the dice pool doesn't "carry over" to the next player's turn. Thematically, the Spell has been broken so it disperses to no effect. Whatever cost that had been paid is now lost. An alternative viewpoint is that since the red dice has been paid for twice (with the Item that originally added it to the dice pool, and with a Spell) then there is no need to pay for it a third time. It also allows some player interaction as it is a nice way for Player A to "pay" for a die to be used in Player B's turn. Elder Sign doesn't have much interaction so it would be a shame to remove this as well. One final note: All this only applies to the red and yellow dice. Green dice are always part of your dice pool so if it was a green die being removed from the Spell, then the player would be allowed to roll it for no cost (since you don't need to "pay" for green dice in the first place). I'm sure there are many other options, logic and theme that could be applied to push your choice one way or the other. Feel free to play which ever way you are more comfortable with.
  11. MaddockKrug said: This would mean that player A uses a unique item to roll the red die; player A then plays a spell in order to put the Wildcard die result on this spell. And any player B, C, D or even A in another, later turn may use this spell-bound red die with the Wildcard as a joker, right? That is correct. MaddockKrug said: Or does this rule about the red die interfere: In any event, the die is removed from the dice pool at the end of the active player's turn. (pg 9) The die placed on the Spell is no longer part of your dice pool, so that doesn't apply. In addition, don't forget (as stated in the FAQ). "Before any roll, a player may remove some or all of the dice held on spells in order to roll them." So a die could be removed from the Spell and added to your dice pool BUT, if it is the yellow or red die then you will need to "pay" for it by discarding the appropriate Common or Unique Item. If it was a green die on the Spell, then you can just remove it and add it to your dice pool. Of course, as your example was a Joker, I can't see any reason why you would want to do this but in general this is true.
  12. MaddockKrug said: I agree with xris: The rules don't specifically mention what would happen with the spell.I would argue: Since the spell is already cast and in power for as long as the die is not being used, as long it is part of the play area, so it does not belong to the original owner of this spell anymore. Yup, that is the exact line of logic I would use as well.
  13. mborda said: What happen to casted spells when a player is devoured? Do they get discarded? Or they remain played with the dice on it? Thanks! The rules do not say one way or the other. You will have to decide for yourself how to play this. Personally, I would say the Spell remains until used.
  14. xris

    Multiple assist?

    mborda said: 1) Can you assist more than once in an adventure? (if there's 3 or more investigators in the same adventure) If you can... 2) Can you assist more than once in the same roll? (the rules are especific between focus and assist, but not regarding multiple assist...) You can assist or focus once after each failed dice roll. So while you are trying to resolve an Adventure card, you will roll the dice several times. After each failure to resolve a task, you are allowed to Focus or Assist. You can only focus a total of once per Adventure. Each other investigator in your location can assist you once per Adventure. So, if there are three investigators in your location you can be assisted three times. Bear in mind that you will not have many dice left in this case because you need to set aside one die each time you assist. You can only be assisted by one other investigator per roll. That is, you may only place one die by the investigator who is assisting. You may not be assisted by more than one investigator after each roll.
  15. Drow said: Rince said: Drow said: ...In Elder Sign "boardgame", after conjuring glyphs, you can assign some of them to partially fulfill a task... Actually, you can't. The rulebook clearly states on page 6 that "a player may only complete a single task with each roll of the dice, even if the results allow him to meet the requirements of 2 or more tasks combined." There is no difference between the digital and board game version in this regard. Apparently you've been playing the board game wrong all this time. Maybe it's me.. But what you've cited says only that you can complete only one task with one dice roll (not 2 or more with the same dice roll)), there's nothing saying about partially completing a single task with one or more rolls. EDIT: example I'm talking about: Say you have to roll four investigations and a peril. - dice roll gives peril, terror, terror, peril, two investigations and lore - I assign peril and 2xinvestigations to a task, partially fulfilling it - I discard one dice and roll the other three left until I fulfill this current task or until I have no more dices to resolve the entire anventure card. Sorry but you are totally incorrect with this. The app and the board game are exactly the same in this regard. You are not allowed to "partially fulfill" a task, you must either (i) complete a task or (ii) fail and set aside a die. The rules (for the boardgame) are clear on this, see page 6, Rolling the Dice. After rolling the dice, the player compares the results to the requirements listed for each task on the Adventure card his Investigator marker is on. If the player is able and willing to meet all of the requirements for a single task, he completes that task. If the player cannot or does not wish to meet the requirements of at least one of the tasks on the Adventure card, he fails to complete a task. Nowhere does it say you may partially fulfill a task and come back to it later. It is clear that you must complete all requirements of a task or fail. "If the player cannot or does not wish to meet the requirements of at least one of the tasks on the Adventure card, he fails to complete a task." Based on your example alone, it is clear that you have this incorrect. Playing it like that makes the game soooo much easier. The board game is easy enough playing with the correct rules, playing that you may partially fulfill tasks makes it a cake-walk.
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