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Blood Pact

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  1. Everything FieserMoep said is pretty much spot on. Except its the Ordo Malleus that makes a habit of policing the Inquisitions ranks. Probably because it was around before the Ordo Hereticus by about 5000 years, and also probably because that rogue Inquisitors and Acolytes are not normal heretics, but the ones most likely to be wielding tainted warp energies, and consorting with the kind of dark powers that the Malleus specializes with. Also the simple fact that it's absolutely retarded for anyone to believe that an Ordo will only look for problems of their own specialty to deal with (demons, aliens, or heretics), and just pass a note on to their colleague, who will surely get around to it properly and in time, for anything outside. Or even more ludicrously, just ignore it.
  2. Well, depending on the form the pleasure world takes, it's probably not going to be too populated, to preserve whatever makes the world so appealing (building cities to house millions of people, not to mention the industry and agriculture needed for them, isn't going to keep a world beautiful and pristine). It wouldn't surprise me if the place has continent size game preserves, because that's just how humanity rolls when it finds something it really likes
  3. Well, one thing that Storm of Magic for Fantasy gave us was a big list of monsters that could be used by pretty much anyone. I could see 40K getting something similar, that features Zoats, Jokaero, and even Squats, but not something like an actual Codex: Mercenaries (that idea didn't work so well for fantasy afterall). Adeptus-B said: -And that frog-like thing pictured in close-up- is that a Slann? No! That's one of the Old Ones (yes, THOSE Old Ones, that created the Orks, Eldar, Jokaero, among others, and probably the Lizardmen from Fantasy). Way back, during Rogue Trader I think, they decided that the secret was they were actually Slann too, you could even buy models for them.
  4. Yeah, but aren't they still extinct? It's just that they're giving them a nod to their some umpteen years since the last official appearance in canon.
  5. The character in question was an excellent Astropath. And you're forgetting that he knew absolutely nothing of the specifics until he was told them by the Astropath assisting his recover, who was very much a senior one. And he was only being told to specifically encourage his case. It is a mistake to infer that such information is used as a goad on everyone who is training to be an Astropath.
  6. What a priviledged few in the high echelons of the Adeptus Astra Telepathica know, and what every choir Astropath and rogue psyker know are two vastly different things. Everyone knows that the Imperium has a dim view of psykers. There are Witchhunters by the score, not to mention the Inquisition, the Black Ships, and the general hostility of the populace. But that they send them to a big mountain where they scream away their soul to power the mighty beacon of the Astronomicon, is rather a bit less common knowledge.
  7. I know the feeling sometimes. The start of 3rd edition was still quite a long time ago. For what it's worth, I never really liked the old Dark Eldar, but the new models look wonderful.
  8. HappyDaze said: Obetor said: There is a lot of minor thinks like code of the incubus, they don’t get killed by their own if they kill an archon. The female archon (can’t remember her name) should be a Succubus, and the succubus in the group should be a Hekatrix, but the author thinks that noble houses only can be Kabals. Most of the above fits fairly well with the old Codex, excepting only the part about the Incubus. And the book had an ending? I thought it just fell apart at the end. The Disjunction describes what happened to the writer rather than to the characters… Yeah, the Incubus thing probably had less to do with killing his Archon, and more to do with breakinghis word (in such a very visible way, at least). Since the Incubi rely on their reputation as impartial, somewhat mercenary killers, to get by in the dark city. And on Disjunctions, it stands to reason that since the Webway has suffered damage and cataclysm before, it can happen again. And Commorragh isn't one domain, but the patchwork of multiple strands of the webway, rudely stiched together to make one collossal city. Not such an unreasonable premise. And as a side note, as old a part of the game as the Dark Eldar are, we don't really have enough information about them in general.
  9. Fresnel said: The Horus Heresy novel 'The Outcast Dead' features an Astropath protagonist. After becoming unable to function he is sent back to Terra to see if he can be salvaged by the experts there. It is mentioned many times that if the treatments are not successful he will end up in 'The Hollow Mountain'… According to this novel the knowledge of how the Astronomicon is fueled is common amongst astropaths. Even if you are selected for Astropathic training a proportion fail the training and serve in the the hollow mountain. This threat serves to motivate the students. If even so, it probably isn't a something astropaths discuss with others. Essentially the Black Ships and the Astronomicon can be likened to the holocost trains and the gas chambers. Some 'lucky' few are judged useful to the authorities and are given work - but they are hardly safe. However, it's made apparent that while they 'know' what happens in the Hollow Mountain, they don't know the specifics of it, just that it is a place where failures and the weak are taken to die, useful to some greater purpose. It doesn't actually say whether anyone knows this when they're just a student though. Or that it's used on the students as some form of motivational threat. The character in The Outcast Dead has been an Astropath for a long time, and is quite the powerful and respected one. They are the exception, not the rule. And while it is an apt comparison… I ALWAYS hate seeing people compare what the Imperium does to the holocaust. Considering that every untrained psyker is at risk of causing as much damage as a nuclear detonation (trained ones only marginally less so).
  10. Eh, it's hardly worse than how I see people frequently trying to quote Rogue Trader or 2nd Edition as if it were still some definitive authority.
  11. *sigh*… just because I know someone else will mention it… spoilers.. spoilers spoilers There's actually a rather similar situation in the 3rd Arbites novel., with a rogue psyker hiding in an astropathic communication nexus, for many years apparently. Able to get away with it (apparently) because they're just not noticed among all the background psychic static (with laying pretty low and 'friends' covering for you too). spoilers over… On the other hand, aside from what they picked up themself, they know nothing of psykery or the great secrets of the universe, ala the Golden Throne, sacrificing psykers, etc., etc…. Which really don't seem like things psykers would ever talk about anyway. Who has conversations about basically having your brain plugged in to God? Anywhere. Let alone where the servants can overhear. Or talk about the Astronomicon or the sacrifices to the Throne (both groups are likely sequestered away from the talented psykers anyway). While it is an event that millions have in common, the Soul Binding comes off as a deeply personal experience, the kind of thing you don't talk about, because you just don't.
  12. Cifer said: @Blood Pact And you think the majority of loyalist chapters wouldn't be retarded enough to keep to the 1000 marines rule? Fixed it for you. And yes, I do, because it's Guilleman's rule, not the Emperor's, which makes it just a suggestion at best. You're the one trying to say something as silly as a Chapter just stopping recruitment because it hit an arbitrary number. Oh noes, 1,001 would just be to horrible to countenance! And even so, geneseed doesn't spoil, not with cryogenic storage facilities, or stasis fields. Which actually means they can stockpile it for a rainy day, and not suffer too greatly, should they unexpectedly take mass casualties. Hell, the Traitor Legions don't even bother to collect the geneseed from their fallen all the time, let alone worry overly much about storing it.
  13. Cifer said: That being said, I fully believe there are more CSMs than Astartes because the CSMs are not bound by the 1000 marines per chapter, 1000 chapters rule. Noone is going to destroy your homeworld because you have a couple extra hundred Space Marines, even if you're not some prestigious First Founding Chapter. The Tyrant of Badab was brought down because he tripled the size of his Chapter through an aggressive program of expansion over several decades, and absorbing a few hundred Marines from an 'extinct' Chapter. And also built massed conventional forces. Most Chapters would likely suffer enough regular attrition that the 1,000 limit isn't an issue. With varying levels of tolerance granted by the Adeptus Terra, since the First and Second Founding Chapters generally act in concert often enough that they might as well be considered Legions in effect. Chaos really has everything going against them, compared to Loyalist Astartes. Their only real advantage being that they're dishonourable enough to steal geneseed. But everything else, from workable facilities and staff skilled enough to man them, to availability of equipment, and the just plain hostility toward all life of the places that Chaos Marines make their lairs. The once great Traitor Legions are a broken force that are a shadow of their former glory, just like the Imperium that birthed them.
  14. And you can't argue that Rogue Traders don't get to enjoy the habitual crushing of the masses.
  15. It's not as if the "psyker" trait is sacrosanct, any idiot can dabble in sorcery (and most of those idiots rightly go up in a ball of flame) nonetheless. And in a game that people are always gushing over being so much better cause it's free-form and classless (a matter of personal opinion, I find that I like the systems different, for different games, accross the board), I'm certainly not going to sit back and let the Archetype I chose at the begining determine whether or not I can eventually get some psychic powers. Especially since in Black Crusade, actual sorcery and psykery aren't differentiated, like they are in.. well, I guess Dark Heresy is the only one with Sorcery, but moving on… Now you're a member of the Pavoni, or one of the other more martial schools of psychic discipline that was concieved by Magnus. Your lesser psychic ability a result of your school's focus on a variety of martial pursuits, as opposed to the more esoteric disciplines, that involve seeing the future or telepathy, rather than smashing things with telekinesis or lighting them on fire (still hard, I know). Despite their reputation, it's not like every Thousand Son (whose not an empty suit of armour) is a master sorcerer extroidinaire. As a group they're the best, but with every group you find members all along the bell curve. Ahriman and his cabal would be at one end, while most everyone else would occupy the middle. And I'd hardly consider a starting character's (albeit a 6,000 xp one) place on that curve to be an accurate measurement of their power, or its limits. Though it seems likely that they'd always be a step behind any full sorcerer. All that said, you're right. It's all the more likely that the 'typical' Thousand Sons sorcerer would be represented by the standard Archetype, with the true masters by the one found in the book.
  16. I've always thought an Unaligned book was going to happen anyway, and since someone mentioned The Fallen earlier, it occurs to me they'd make a good Legion Archetype to include alongside the Black Legion. I've also come around to mind that the 'advanced Archetypes' aren't the end-all be-all representation of the Legions. And there's no reason you can't be an Alpha Legion Renegade, or a Thousand Sons Chosen. What we see in Tome of Fate can quite certainly be taken as an example of an eminent member of the Legion. Certainly not everyone from Q'sal is some master sorcerer. What wouldn't be bad is to have a way to 'buy in' to one of them. Just something shorthand. And whether it would be alright to keep the original Archetype ability, for the hassle.
  17. exseraph said: Fgdsfg said: Sacrifice to the Emperor? You mean the Astronomican? How would she even know about one of the Psykana's most guarded secrets? Well, she wouldn't have to know the specifics. She might have just noticed/heard that for every hundred psykers that go to Terra, only one comes back, and come to her own conclusions. There are a fair number of psykers who run from the black ships, so people must have at least some misgivings about them. Yeah… I'd say they have absolutely no right to know any of that. It doesn't mean they don't have the common sense to understand that turning themselves in might be a bad thing, though.
  18. There are warding symbols against daemons (Renegade's Handboo, natch), it stands to reason that there could be certain similar methods that can make skrying more difficult. Probably end up being a Forbidden Lore test of some kind. Knowledge of them could similarly be suppressed, as the runes to ward against daemons can be used for binding them, which the Inquisition is obviously against. Methods of blocking divination might be similarly suppressed, in addition to it already being occult in nature.
  19. Mjoellnir said: They live longer, they don't ruin the planets they inhabit and their souls don't dissipate upon death (well, that's kind of a problem now thanks to the Fall). They left humanity alone throughout the Dark Age of Technology and the Age of Strife. Trouble started with the Imperium. And sorry would you respect a species who is willing to destroy whole planets with billions of their own people just to get rid of a hidden chaos cult? In Warhammer 40k humanity as a whole is at its absolutely worst, I prefer Eldar. They at least assign a value to their own kind and their souls. A few points of order… Firstly, the fate of your soul, in 40K, counts for nothing. Whether it dissipates, gets absorbed by something else (benignly) or snacked on by a daemon, whatever happens to it doesn't really reflect upon whether you've been a good and virtuous person, or the scum of the galaxy. Next, who gives a crap about planets. So humanity, by base necessesity needs to stripmine planets for their resources, and generally lay them to waste. So what? For one thing, Eldar don't need to mine anymore because they conjure all their building materials from the Warp (wraithbone remember), or make them out of trees in the case of Exodites. It's easy to keep your planets pristine and beautiful, when you hardly need them for anything but a warm but shaded place to stand. Lastly. I very much doubt the ancient Eldar left humanity alone, during the 40,000 years or so of human history that took place before the Emperor's Great Crusade. It's just not written down anywhere, but it never explicitely says that the Eldar and humanity had no contact with one another. That the Eldar were content to let silly little primitive humanity do their thing in their little corner of the galaxy, while the Eldar ruled everything else. If we look at how the Eldar act now, and remember that the entire race was leaning toward being like the Dark Eldar (probably more like Corsairs, the Dark Eldar were apparently the descendents of the most depraved survivors, who liked living in the lawless 'international waters' of the Webway. So yeah, during those millenia, there were probably cullings, and bloody evictictions from Maiden Worlds (in the usual vein of ordering the evacuation of millions, or billions, in the space of a few days), and whole planets that were just plain made sport of just for bored Eldar.
  20. JuankiMan said: Very true, but a pair of nobles can be fast friends from the academy, two inquisitors be comrades in arms, specially if one was the other's mentor, and not all Munitorum agents are required to be spiteful bastards by law (its true!), etc… but such is not the case with a Dark Eldar on board. The question is not if it will betray you, but when. Perhaps you won't live to actually see it, but be assured that it wasn't because he wasn't plotting it.… Yes and no. They do fight, kill and torture to survive but they don't do it consciously anymore and are definitely not repentant in the least. They're so proud that they have convinced themselves that they're doing all that because they want to, because they are in their right to do so and they find it endlessly enjoyable and amusing. In your allegory, it would be like a guy who claimed he was slaughtering calf not because he was hungry, but because he wanted to feel the flesh tearing before his teeth, savor the smell of freshly spilled blood and taste it running down his throat. I don't know about you, but I'd call the nearest asylum A quick question, but you've never played Vampire before, have you? Or Mage? Or, to get a little fringy, Demon? Really… like half the game lines that White Wolf put out, would work here. My point is, that just because the player is playing a sadistic, bloodthirsty monster, doesn't mean they can't work with the rest of the group somehow. Some games work entirely around the concept of you playing one of those.
  21. That's assuming the Dark Eldar doesn't have plenty of good reasons to keep them alive and work with them. The kind of Rogue Trader who'd work with a Dark Eldar in the first place, would likely be a pretty cold hearted individual themself. The cunning ones will find ways to prosper together, and the same holds true for the Dark Eldar as well. Powerful and ruthless crew members hating each other isn't a new concept for a Rogue Trader game (or the background), but they can work together all the same. And the Dark Eldar manage that well enough in their own society, concerning Real-space Raids, where everyone is too focused on working like a well blood-oiled machine to stab each other in the back. And of course, a Dark Eldar whose forced to live among humans must be there by circumstances that preclude killing everyone for the evulz.
  22. JaunkiMan, while we disagree on the overall ability of a Dark Eldar of average cunning to be trusted amongst the crew of a Rogue Trader, I really can't fault your grasp of the general Dark Eldar temperment, and absolute sadism.
  23. So you're one of those people whose deluded themselves in to thinking Chaos just wouldn't be that bad if the Imperium wasn't around to always 'antagonize' them? Cause those people are complete fools. Cause yeah, franky humanity does have a pretty good claim, when it comes to which race is the 'most good'. But that doesn't mean JaunkiMan isn't wrong about this whole idea that Dark Eldar would never be able to work with the group (I've explained at length as to why I think Eldar would actually be more problems than Dark Eldar).
  24. Blood Pact


    A hooded scribe in dark robes shuffles forward, carrying a large tome seemingly unhindered by the great size of the ancient book. A cloud of dust kicks in to the air, a slam resonating around the room from the weighty slam it made against the top of the desk in front of you. Clawed, palsied hands open the cover and begin tracing along the lines scrawled upon the pages of scabbarous beastman hide, written in black blood. "Here! See!? You wish to know of the God Malal, Champion?" The acolyte hisses, hood falling back to reveal sinister eyes full of rage and hateful intent, the cold steel of the knife's edge already running accross your throat, the voice ringing in your eyes along with the sound of your heart. "The first lesson, is that Great Malal despises his four brothers, and all of the whoresons who follow them." Now that's pretty ancient fluff, and I'm not even sure of the accuracy of it. But I figured it might provide a little inspiration since you're on the subject of Malal. It's kinda Mary Sue-ish, reading it again after all these years, but I think it's fair to sare that "hatred" is a major part of the God's thing (especially of Chaos). And I still think an Alpha Legionaire would make an excellent follower though (not even using the new advance, just playing it by theme).
  25. JuankiMan said: Very true, but I just find it a lot harder to make a Dark Eldar "fit". Kroot are easy, as long as you disregard their distasteful eating habits they're loyal, pragmatic and completely unbiased, so they're perfect mercenaries. Orks are volatile, but at least they tend to be simple and unsubtle so at least you know where they're coming from and will remain loyal as long as you perform regular shows of force. But the Dark Eldar has personal habits more distasteful than the Kroot's, is almost as volatile than the Ork and is assured to be inherently disloyal. And worst of all, unlike the former, the Dark Eldar plots.…. Like you pointed out yourself, Dark Eldar are cunning and patient, so it will obviously not try to backstab him when he is in a position of strength surrounded by subordinates. He'll wait until he's weak, vulnerable and/or distracted. Perhaps when the rivals the Xenos sold him to are storming his house. As the saying goes "Fear the wrath of a patient man". … That's beyond the point. I see no reason why such a thing should prevent debate on the matter. But the thing is I'm personally amazed that so much effort is dedicated to what I initially believed to be a niche class. I specially find it odd that playable Dark Eldar appeared before regular Eldar, which carry their own amounts of baggage but at least understand the benefits of mutual cooperation. DISCLAIMER: This is not Eldar fanboyism. Personally I despise the Eldar as a race, but I still find the whole matter odd regardless. I'm not really an Eldar fan either. Go humanity! Virtually every other race in the Galaxy wants to kill or enslave humanity (even for 'good' reasons, like throwing us under the daemon engine to ultimately 'kill' Chaos), so nuts to them. But The Dark Eldar Codex was just so excellent, and the new models so nice, that it's just so fun to play them. I'm still collecting what will ultimately be a small army built around 18 Reaver Jetbikes and 2 Razorwings (with pretty much minimum for cores.. maybe an Inqubi bodyguard), cooked up a little background for it and everything. Which I'll be tying to the Dark Eldar character I really want to play some time. But getting to my core points… A Dark Eldar isn't necessarily likely to betray the Rogue Trader he's working with. Such a long lives race can afford to take their time and plan for the very long term, eschewing petty short term gains in their plots. While the Dark Eldar are a truly duplicitous, cold hearted, and cunning race there are reasons there that lend to why they wouldn't make sport of the ship and its crew. Being able to live eons with no help is certainly one advantage, to be noted early on. Just wait 200, maybe 400 years tops, and everyone you dealt with will be dead. Hell, wait 199 years and relish the horror in their eyes as they lay on their deathbed, savouring the agony as you lay waste to all their glories around them, before sending their soul wimpering to their Corpse-God. Or don't, whatever, what concerns do you have for the mayfly Mon-Keigh? Slip in to the Web-Way and disapeer when the ships lands on a world with an entrance. And it's not as if every Dark Eldar doesn't think they'll essentially live forever (acknowledging the possibility of death doesn't mean accepting it). Meanwhile, Kroot don't just eat their kills, they eat only meat and prefer the corpses of sentients, like a nice steak to a hotdog, the crew won't be too happy about a Xenos that literally eats people. And Orks, for all their lack of plotting, can still be very cunning, and tend to have very simplistic desires, fighting tough things, so they'll get tougher, is at the top of the list (the Rogue Trader and his officers are pretty tough…). It's how they were physicals and psychologicaly designed, fight to grow bigger and tougher, so they can eventually establish dominance over all the weaker things around them. Dark Eldar are smart enough to know when they have a good deal, and it can generally be assumed that PC's have good reasons for being on a Rogue Trader's crew, that don't include planning to stab them in the back at the first half decent opportunity. If he acts because the Rogue Trader is "weak", then obviously the Dark Eldar hasn't been doing his job either. A Kabalite Warrior knows how to work with his fellows while on a Realspace Raid, despite the fact that every last member of them is somehow trying to gain position on them within the Kabal. That 'losing' someone's body isn't a common occurence when returning from a raid, and they can be ressurected. It demonstrates that they can get their priorities in order when the situation calls for it. Working together they both can have more to gain, than the Dark Eldar would by being a retard and cutting the Captain's throat at the first opportunity.
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