# NewTroski

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1. ## Super Star Destroyer discussion thread

Great question, thank you for asking! The simple explanation is logarithmic scale. Logarithmic scales are used when you have a large disparity (i.e. orders of magnitude) in the values of the data set. For example, the CR-90 is 150m long, while the ISD is 1600m long. The ISD is an order of magnitude larger than the CR-90. We want to have both of these ships in the game, but if we used the ISD scale, the CR-90 would be tiny - less than an inch. If we used the CR-90 scale, the ISD would be huge - almost two feet. So, obviously we cannot use the same scale for all of the ships in the game. What can we do? What if we pick an arbitrary "feels good" size for both ships? Let us assume that we have chosen the actual sizes of the Armada models - 58mm for the CR-90 and ~190mm for the ISD (current estimates are betwen 7-8 inches, I split the difference). Now that we have these two points, we can draw a line between them, and use this line to scale all of the other ships. This is called linear interpolation. On this page you can see how it would work. Put in the end points; 150 for x1, 1600 for x2, 58 for y1, 190 for y2. Now if you put in the length of the ship in meters into x2 and press calculate, y2 will be that ship's model length in mm. This formula gives us a length of 126mm for the VSD and 71mm for the Nebulon-B. These are not the correct values so obviously, this method is not being used in Armada. One of the problems with this method is that it will only produce reasonably scaled models for a fairly narrow range of inputs. What we want is something that can take a large range of inputs, but give us a "flattened" output, so that all of the models are still of a practical size. Luckily, the logarithmic function is well suited for this, and in fact is the number one go to solution when talking about modelling data that covers several orders of magnitude. Here is a graph with the known ships sizes (and ISD estimate) - it conforms quite well to the logarithmic curve. Notice how the curve is flattening out? That means as you travel along the x-axis (bigger ships) the y-value (scaled model size) increases only gradually - exactly what we want. There are some things that further complicate the situation - models will need to fit on one of the base sizes and artistic license to make an attractive game piece will both effect the actual scale used and bump individual values off of the curve, but hopefully this illustrates the concept.
2. ## Super Star Destroyer discussion thread

Edit: If you saw crazy stuff here, I tried to paste a table from Word. It did not work. XWM Dimensions Area % of 836127.36 Small base 41 x 41 1681 0.201045926 Large base 82 x 82 6724 0.804183707 Huge 82 x 227 18614 2.226215872 Armada Dimensions Area % of 1672254.72 Small 41 x 71 2911 0.1740763512 Medium 61 x 102 6222 0.3720725034 Large 76 x 129 9804 0.5862743206 Epic 114 x 254 28956 1.7315543890 Description: The size of each of the bases in XWM and SW:A converted to millimeters, the area of each base (square millimeters), and the percentage that base takes up of the standard play size for that game (listed in square millimeters at the top). Method: The XWM numbers are taken from some bases I had that I measured, and may not be the official numbers due to manufacturing tolerances, or bad measurements by me. The Armada pieces were taken from the official list. The Epic entry is the most recent size proposed, about 4.5"x10". Conclusion: Armada ships are smaller on the Armada board than XWM ships are on the XWM board.
3. ## Super Star Destroyer discussion thread

Well, the MSRP of the CR-90 is \$90. We are basing a lot of our assumptions off the precedents set by Epic XWM. A lot of people have been clamoring for an Imperial Huge ship for XWM, specifically so that they could have two "super ships" duke it out with each other - and they are now close to getting one. So it seems to me pretty reasonable to imagine that people will want something similar, in a game that is roughly similar.
4. ## Super Star Destroyer discussion thread

Follow up thought: We know the small base covers ships from 150m-500m, and the medium base 700m-900m. The ranges could be greater. At 1.6km for an ISD on a large, it doesn't seem totally unreasonable to fit a ~2km ship on the same base. So what I'm saying is the Secutor, Bulwark, and Allegiance are too small
5. ## Super Star Destroyer discussion thread

First, thanks to jonnyboy0121 for providing such excellent diagrams and indulging some of our ideas! Second, I would be totally fine if they ended up going for something in a more intermediate size. (If they go with any larger format at all!) However, obviously I and others are interested in continuing discussion about ideas for the Executor-class. Even if there is not an official FFG addition, I think there will be people trying to make some house-rule stuff. I will most likely start by proxying with an Imperial Raider In regards to maneuvering space, I think if the CR-90 can fit in XWM, then something slightly larger can fit in Armada. One thing we've been basing things off of is an 8" ISD. However, if the ISD has the same proportion to the large base as the VSD to the medium, it will be closer to 7". Then the SSD would need be 17.5" to meet the width requirement. I totally agree that the 16x6 base is way too big, but I think we could get by with a base size of around 4.5"x10". At that point in terms of percentage area, the SSD is now smaller in its nominal play space than the CR-90. So for more model size discussion, I think we need to get some tangible measurements of the ISD since we are basing things on the concept of relative size. If we continue to go with the XWM Huge ship paradigm, and assume that Huge Armada ships will also have two bases, should each base have one broadside hull zone or two? For the Executor-class I could definitely see four hull zones down each side, and possibly two front and two back as well.
6. ## FFG Trailer for Armada..

The ISD isn't just a battleship, it's a battleship and carrier and amphibious assault ship (umm... spacephibious?), and carries 20 AT-AT standard - the AT-AT is already in the game. Therefore, Half-Life 3 Super Star Destroyer confirmed! Also, there was that episode of Clone Wars in which AT-TEs were deployed on asteroids...
7. ## Super Star Destroyer discussion thread

I took the image of the SSD and scaled it down until it is just a smidge wider than the ISD. From the pixel length, I got the multiplier to be about 2.5 or 20 inches. Previously, based on the CR-90 size in relation to the X-Wing map size, I estimated a size of 16x6. If we use the 16x6 for the size of the base (or slightly smaller perhaps), I think a 20 inch SSD model could be workable. If it is then on higher stands, it will both look bigger and easily use the smaller area of the base for game mechanics interactions.
8. ## Rampant wave 2 speculation.

Ackbar's ability could be to Concentrate Firepower, so you could use it to shoot down the enemy super... wait for it... high priority targets.
9. ## Super Star Destroyer discussion thread

There's one that looks exactly like the ISD, just bigger. I don't think that one should be made because the miniatures should be visually distinct, which is hard enough with Star Destroyers already. Yes, I still think that FFG is capable of making the Executor balanced and of an appropriate size for a logarithmic scale, but I'd be down with whatever ships as long as they're cool In Empire at War, the SSD could launch a squadron of TIEs as an in-game ability. Could a similar ability work in Armada on these big ships? Perhaps there could be a Carrier rule - X squadrons that must remain within distance 1 of their carrier, but they get to move and fire every turn. In general, I think giving the huge ships powers or abilities outside of just "more guns, more armor" will make them easier to balance.
10. ## What Sub-forums do we want?

I can't believe no one has mentioned the most obvious, required sub-forum: SSD Discussion EDIT: Realized that I missed the previous SSD joke within seconds after clicking post. I'm going to have to use Leia's ability to change my orders...
11. ## ISD Size?

I thought we were keeping the SSD talk in the SSD thread, it was supposed to be the chosen one! It was supposed to bring balance to the forums! Although it is getting a little ungainly, maybe we should cut some limbs off and start anew
12. ## Core Set Mini Size

I measured mine to be: VSD: 140mm Nebulon-B: 93mm CR-90: 58mm Also, when I measure my bases they appear to be 1-3mm large than the sizes listed in the reference manual. Anybody else notice this or did I get the edge of the manufacturing tolerances?
13. ## ISD Size?

I measured my VSD model at 140mm. Medium bases are listed at 102mm in length, giving the VSD a factor of ~1.37x the base. If the ISD has the same factor, then it will be 177mm / 8 inches. From the one picture we have to go off of, I think the ISD overhangs a little bit more, so 8.25" is a pretty reasonable estimate.
14. ## ISD Size?

If we knew the size of the ISD, what would we post about? The large base size is listed as 129mm long. Measuring the small and medium bases in my set, the actual items are 1-3mm larger than the listed size (maybe the listed size is for the cardboard counter that goes on the base?). I measured my VSD model at 140mm. Based on all this, estimates for the ISD model range from about 170mm - <250mm, so yeah right in the 8 to 9 inch range. My current estimate is 193mm... but no, the player community does not yet know for sure how big any of the Wave 2 models are.
15. ## It seems 400 points will be standard.

I thought they were going to go with things easily divisible by 3... but 134 point fighter total it is, I suppose.
16. ## I think you overestimate their chances... A-Wings v Ships

Your quote has the answer in it though. For each crit rolled, we do two things if the attacker and defender are both ships: 1. suffer one damage 2. the first damage card is dealt face up No matter how many crits there are, there is only one first damage card dealt. You just rolled a zillion crits? That's fine, there's still only one FIRST damage card.
17. ## Super Star Destroyer discussion thread

If you just scale things properly, wave 1 will only be like... 24cm away
18. ## Initiative, squadrons, and you.

I could honestly have seen it going either way before, but after reading some of the good points made here, I think the Y-Wings would have to attack. Wording aside, from a game mechanics perspective I think it makes more sense. Keeping players active and keeping the game moving are important, and having a squadron just sit there and skip a turn is rather passive.
19. ## This will get you pumped for armada especially for imp players

I think they already did that... if by "kick" you mean "lightsaber" and by "kid with crutches" you mean "youngling". The Empire isn't really interested in fair fights
20. ## This will get you pumped for armada especially for imp players

It's not in the style we are accustomed to seeing Star Wars, but just like the CG series are one artistic interpretation, this is another. This short reminds me of Robotech, and in that sort of anime style, I think it is absolutely fantastic.
21. ## Thoughts on an Armada Game Mat

Has anyone tried a GripMat? I saw these a while ago, and they seem pretty cool. They're a little pricey, but not crazy, and it would be a lot less effort than weighting all the bases or something. Video on their old kickstarter page, it's a little cheesy but the product looks impressive.
22. ## Initiative, squadrons, and you.

From my reading, squadron activation is not optional. On page 10 of LTP; "He chooses on of his squadrons and activates it.", "...the player must activate a second unactivated squadron, if able.", "This process continues until all squadrons are activated." Once activated, "Each squadron that activates during this phase may either move or attack, but not both.", and the rules reference says "... it can move or attack, but not both." So it appears to me that you are required to activate the squadron, but not required to actually do anything during the activation.
23. ## Super Star Destroyer discussion thread

The picture I was referencing is from the BoLS article here. I hadn't seen the pic of the Victory next to the Imperial before. It also has some alternate views of some of the other ships.
24. ## Super Star Destroyer discussion thread

Did you see the new picture in the ISD thread Maverick? (ISD next to VSD) I'll admit, my previous estimate of 15cm is too low, but I still think 24cm is a bit high. I used paint.net and drew some lines, based on the reported VSD length of 13cm I got an estimate of 19.5cm for the ISD. To the problem of the "tail-whip": What if the notch for attaching the maneuver tool was in the middle of the base instead of the leading edge? Some turns might be restricted from having the base in the way, but that could represent the lumbering nature of the huge ships.
25. ## Super Star Destroyer discussion thread

I was getting worried that the forum might implode or something if SSD talk wasn't near the top Some good points have been made for both sides. I still think that it's possible. We'll just have to wait at this point, at least until we see the ISD in relation to the VSD... then the speculation can begin anew!
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