Jump to content

awp832

Members
  • Content Count

    945
  • Joined

  • Last visited

Posts posted by awp832


  1. Yeah, i've wondered that myself.  I can see it both ways, i suppose in the most technical sense, location abilities replace one's encounter.   But I guess I always thought of them more as 'alternate encounters'..    I dunno,  I think leaving the science building open to her might be okay.  It's just so tough to complete her story without it.   I've lost her story at least 3 times by the second mythos card, and 2 of those 3 times were with Dagon, before Trish even got a turn. 

     

    Bitchiness aside,  why should getting Anna Kaslow via encounter at Independence win Trish's mission, but picking Anna up at the boarding house doesn't give you the same benifit? 

     

    and aside from that,  where is the best location to pick up multiple clues at once?  I'm thinking possibly Hibbs Roadhouse?


  2. hm, as far as what?  In final combat, during gameplay, or just in general?

     

    I'm assuming the last, so I'll base my comments on general impossibility of winning final combat coupled with difficult game mechanics.    Of the base set, Yog-Sototh pretty much fits that  bill.   I dunno if I've ever beating Yog in final combat, and devourings in LiTS and double sucess to seal a gate is pretty harsh.

     

    From Dunwich, Tsothaggua is really tough, another impossible final combat, but he has a long doom track so he's not too impossible to seal.   Malaise is annoying, and you can find yourself clue-screwed.  Overall though both Aboth and Glaaki are tougher than him.   Glaaki's servants can just be rediculous, but so long as your terror is down, you can do allright against him.   I think Aboth might be the toughest of the Dunwich set, though many will disagree I'm sure.  Tough, but beatable in final combat.   Still, the Children are all super-tough, he has a fast doom track, and takes out the easiest monsters in the cup, ouch.  

     

    Haven't actually played kingsport, but I'm confident in saying Alatch-Nacha is the beeatch in that set.   All gates are gate bursts and a pretty rediculous final combat.   Might well be the hardest AO yet.

     

    From the Innsmouth set, hmm.. probably Ghantanotha is the hardest.   A long doom track might be his saving grace, but a pretty deadly fight.   Sure you'll last a few rounds, but each investigators attack dealing -1 succes, along with a neg six combat mod makes it pretty harsh to take him down.  He makes you paranoid about collecting clues, and that's critical to the game.  Plus I'm always unlucky with that sort of thing, just wrecks my day.     Some might say Quachil Uttaus is the toughest of the IH set, but i respectfully disagree.  I don't find the Dust deck alltogether much of a problem.  With the dust deck, you know who is vulnerable to getting devourered, with Ghantanotha it can be anybody, any time.  Pretty vicious final combat on Q-U though, I'll admit.

     

    Overall, what's my pick for the toughest AO?   I'll discard Alatch-Nacha because I havent played against  her.   Aboth is eminently beatable in final combat,  tough, but not impossible, so he's out.    I'd have to say it's between Yog-Sothoth and Ghantanotha, with Ghantanotha pulling ahead.   At least, that's the way i see it right now.  Maybe that will change if I get a Ghantanotha strategy worked out.


  3. Unfortunatley, if all you do is close+close at the very beginning of the game, those gates (depending on where they are of course) might open again.    Given that the common gates are the most likely to be drawn at the beginning of the game (duh, I know, but it made the sentence make more sense), probably you're weighing the consequences of +1 gate to awaken the ancient one vs +2 doom.   I'm not even sure if that's a mission that should be attempted.    Certainly not against the 'fast' AOs, maybe not even against the others.   If an Elder sign were involved or like a KiY or some other way for kate to easily aquire sealing ability, it might be tempting.  Otherwise...

     

    Edit:   Ironically, Kate attempting her mission makes it more likely for the doom track to rise *faster* and make her fail.  (if the first gate she closes opens while she has not yet completed her mission, and otherwise would have been a monster surge).


  4. @mageith:  I use only IH and AH for the mythos deck, and run 4 investigator teams as well.  I went ahead and mixed in the DH investigators and investigator cards though.   In any case, dillution shouldn't be a problem, and Innsmouth itself sees more than plenty of it's share of gates.  

    And yes, the worst games as far as the DOR track is concerned seem to be with Dagon where the first gate is at Devil's reef, which I've had happen several times.

     

    Sigh, as a side point, the one thing that makes me cry myself to sleep about IH is Kate Winthrop, who used to be one of my favorite investigators (just liked her).  Her ability rarely came into  play, but when it did it was awesome, and she could go get those clues on the Witch House and other highly unstable locations with relatively little worry.    When using IH, Kate just isn't very good at all.  In many cases it's almost preferable to allow the gate to open than to add a token to the DOR track.  I just think that Kate's ability was something that was amazing, but might only happen once a game if you're lucky....  but now, it still might only happen once per game, and it's not so amazing.    To me,  this drops Kate down to the bottom of the list as far as investigator abilities are concerned.   Her personal story doesn't help much either,   two gate trophies before the doom hits 6?  are you mad?  A sad, sad, sad day for Kate Winthrop.


  5. Well,  I believe the thing to do is to post on the Comprehensive FAQ Project thread. 

     

    However, most of the time the Community will come to a consensus.   Sometimes for those really tough rules querries, we don't.     Occasionally Kevin Wilson will post something on BoardGameGeek regarding a rules question, and then we take that as about as official as it can get.    Why does he post on BoardGameGeek and not here?   Well, I have no idea!   But, so it goes. 


  6. Played with IH quite  a bit now,  a mix of using it with heralds and no heralds, different AOs, etc.  

     

    Haven't seen much of a discussion of the DOR track, at least, not directly.  So let's discuss.    Here's my thoughts:

     

    Where to start.  Maybe by saying that I hate "The Streets Are Flooded!" Card, which opens a gate at Devil's Reef and moves all monsters at the same time.   So, unless you're lucky to draw the non-vortex type of monsters, virtually some garunteed DOR tokens right there depending on how many players or if it's, Bast forbid, a monster surge (even worse with Hydra).  Gates on Devil's Reef and Yha'Netheli really must be closed or sealed as quickly as possible.  Being 'one move' away from a vortex is very harsh indeed.

     

    By contrast, gates at the Esoteric Order of Dagon and at Marsh's Refinery seem to have little effect on the DOR track.  I've had monsters parade back and forth from Factory District to Church Green streets for several turns.  Eventually of course, someone needs to go up and deal with them, but Esoteric Order of Dagon is 3 'move' (along the quickest path) away from a vortex, and Marsh's Refinery is 4!  Naturally the real bugger here is when the Innsmouth Cops are out to get you, but if you use the right Investigator for the job, things aren't so bad.  Items that bump up move or sneak are very helpful in Innsmouth for monster assasinations,  other items do the trick nicely as well, Mists of R'lyeh, for one!  

     

    The other typical source of DOR tokens then, is gate blocks.  Maybe I've just been (un)lucky, but I have only had one or two blocked gates per game for my last several games. 

     

    It's strange,   when I first got Innsmouth, I had the DOR track filling up over and over (look at my first couple reports with IH,  How does the AO awaken?  DOR track, DOR track, DOR track, DOR track!), but recently I have been able to win fast enough so that it's not much of a problem.

     

    Which brings me to the main point of this post which is:   So... Is it worth it to put clue tokens on the Feds track?    I haven't decided,  probably the answer is  "sometimes".    While it takes time and (obviously) precious clues, preventing the AO from waking up is always a good thing.  Still, sometimes I find myself looking over at the Federals track and thinking "If only I still had those clues!". 

     

    Herald-wise, Dagon and Hydra affect the DOR track in the same way, although Dagon is in general, a far meaner herald IMO.  Used them both at once in just one game so far,  but that was a game when the track just wasn't active thanks to agressive monster killing and a bit of (un)luck with the mythos, and I think the game ended with just the 2 DOR tokens on it.

     

    But enough about me,  I wanna hear your experiences with the DOR track!  Is it effective?  Not so?  Is it fun?  Do you bother putting clues up there?  Which investigators seem the best suited to being Innsmouth patrolers?


  7. I disagree.

     

    First, there is the problem of tough monsters.   I'm sure we agree that failing the rumor has disasterous consequences.  Sometimes a monster is drawn for the experiment that no investigator has reasonable odds of defeating.  The earlier in the game the rumor is drawn, the higher the chance of this occuring.  I suppose you could say that offsets the 'advantages' of drawing it early, point-wise.  Bad rolls can be damning on the experiment as well, in addition to being threatened to go unconscious or insane, many monsters have harsher penalties.   A bad roll against a dimensional shambler, a Servitor of the Outer Gods, an Elder Thing, or many others, can do far more damage than just KO-ing your investigator.

     

    Most of the time a co-operative effort is needed to take down the experiment.  Someone doesn't have  a magical weapon, or can't take the sanity loss, etc, etc,  usually you need to bring in more than one investigator to finish the job.  This occupies several investigators for several turns, turns that they *arent* doing things like gathering clues and sealing gates.    It is in this way that the experiment is particularly damning.   The experiment eats time,  and time is never on your side in A-H. 

     

    If you don't defeat the rumor quickly, by choosing not to, or if you simply can not, the experiment will continue to take up investigator turns as investigators try to kill some monsters to prevent the rumor from failing.  This is a very bad thing indeed, the more time you have to spend on the experiment, the more likely you are to awaken the ancient one via things like too many open gates, DOR track, etc.


  8. Perhaps we are underestimating the importance of the one less clue token to seal thing.    It's a clue saver ability, so what other characters are clue-savers?

     

     

    But first,  why does it matter?  Well, clues are what we use to seal gates, sealing gates is the primary road to victory.  Duh.   Why else?  Because any character who saves clues saves time.   Time is the most precious resource in Arkham Horror.  Enough mythos cards and the investigators will be wrecked.  This is why I feel that Find Gate is possibly the most powerful spell in the game.   Everyone can at least agree, it's really frakking good to save yourself a turn.  And *that* is why Akachi's one-less clue to seal is great. 

    Patrice, Joe, and Roland are the  other clue-savers I can think of.

     

    Patrice is a clue generator.   She's a beast, so we won't go into her.

    Joe is a clue-saver, in a way, in that he has to spend less of them to get the results he wants.   But this doesn't help him seal gates, which obviously, is Akachi's primary role.   I hesitated to even include him in this list,  I don't think his ability is really comperable, because it doesn't really save time.

    Roland is a clue generator.   He's an interesting one.  His ability as-is is nice, but it really shines with his story complete, however, since story's aren't always compareable and Akachi's story is just as awesome, we won't take abilities into account.   Pretty much, Roland easily aquires 2 clue tokens.  From 0-clue tokens to sealing clues, it takes Akachi 4 turns, assuming 1-at-a-time aquisition, to get seal clues.   It takes Roland 4 turns as well, (but only 3 with his story complete).    Er, however, this requires non-optimization on Rolands ability, as you will be both generating clues for yourself and picking them off the board at the same time in order to get the clues as fast as possible.   Also, if 2-at-a-time aquisition is available (like Science building, or a location with 2 clues, even a clue-giving encounter), Akachi will get sealing clues as fast or faster than Roland.  Generally, I find Roland isn't a gate-closer, as he has only 4's in closing stats.   He is far better, I think, up in Innsmouth  (he is the Fed, after all).   Akachi is also a better choice with Illuminated Manuscripts/True Magic or other clue-generating items than roland because of her higher lore, sanity, and move.    

     

    Point I've been trying to make is that yes, although there are other investigators who save or generate clues, aside from Patrice, none of them really work in quite the same way as Akachi's.  It's quite a good ability, and maybe it is enough to be a primary ability after all, and maybe we should just settle for Akachi's secondary being only when No one (else) can help you now.


  9. funny thing about the science building encounter:  it doesn't *say* gates closed via that encounter can't be sealed.   It says you don't get the gate trophy.   So Akachi's ability really doesn't come into play there at all, it's just interpretation of the encounter.

    Even though it doesnt come up much, the chance to seal a gate without exploring it is powerful stuff.  I'm still on the fence about all this.  Still, yeah, it would be nice if her ability wasn't restricted to 1-2 mythos cards.  

     


  10. Can Akachi seal a gate she closes using de Vermis Mysteris?  I played 'no' (not that it mattered at all in the game it happened in, Used Vermis Mysteris to win by closing instead of sealing).    Still,  Akachi says she can always seal, 'regardless of other game effects', where Vermis Mysteris says the gate can't be sealed.


  11. This game was against Yig.   I did however, beat Zhar in final combat once.

     

    I think the team was Norman, Harvey, Trish, and Tommy.   Norman had completed his personal mission and was blessed, beyond that a lucky roll let him remove the maximum of 4 doom tokens from the AO, When Tommy eventually died he removed another.   I had another blessed investigator as well, I think it was Harvey.  Anyway, Trish and Tommy got killed first, which was in many respects optimal, and that helped take down the Maj Immune Zhar.   Phys immune zhar was pointed by dread curses for a bit while sanity and free hands permitted, eventually sword of glory, then enchanted knife and whither.  Victory came when Norman had 1 hand remaining, everyone else was dead.  Moral of the story, unless you're sitting at nearly optimal conditions, don't fight Zhar.


  12. Yikes, I've played the game  a whole bunch myself, and I find Innsmouth to be the hardest expansion yet ('cept I haven't played Kingsport).

     

    This is what I've done to lose some games.   1  Strip out all the mythos cards except IH and AH.  Gate frequency in IH adds difficulty.  Play with Dagon as the Herald.   Hydra can get annoying, but is ultimately allright.   Dagon is a  beast.   It might not seem like it at first, but plans in motion can be absolutely unforgiving.   If you want more challenge yet, play with Dagon and Hydra both. 

     

    Very little time right now, so I migh comment more later.    But suffice it to say, 6p game, 1st gate Devil's reef, second gate Innsmouth plague (all monsters move).   Dagon rips apart your clues, It's turn one,  you have 4 doom, a rumor going on, and the DOR track is at four.   Start. 


  13. hey,  I'm just a guy who hates contradictions.   FF makes fantastic games, and Arkham is one of the best, but when you start introducing as many expansions as Arkham has, you run into things that you didn't expect.  Particularly, my gripe is that words like "delayed, cost, spend, loss, discard, and draw" have become technical terms in Arkham games.  When the words are thrown around willy-nilly, sometimes for artistic flare, sometimes for other reasons, things get all booped up.

     

    This thread is a perfect example.    To clarify my point for those who have missed out, let's take Dexter Drake whose ability, which you probably already have memorized if you're reading this, is:  Whenever "The Great" Drake draws one of more cards from the spell deck, he draws one extra card and discards  one of the cards.

     

    I think most of us have been playing that Dexter gets dealt 3 random spells for starting equipment, and discards one of them, so he gets to use his ability at the start of the game, basically.  But it doesn't seem fair to say that when Dexter recieves his beginning spells, they are "drawn" and when he recieves his beginning unique item, it isn't "drawn".

     

    So either.

    1.  Starting equipment isn't "drawn".  Dexter and Company don't get to choose their items for setup, which to me makes the already weaker investigators Jack/Dexter/Bob positively lame.

    2.  Starting equipment is "drawn".   Patrice auto-wins her mission and instantly gets 5 more clue tokens.

    3.  We live with the contradiction, which grinds my gears, but it might be what I end up doing.


  14. Does starting equipment count as being 'drawn' for the purposes of missions? 

     

    I'm leaning towards no, because I think Patrice would auto-complete her mission if that were the case.   However, things like Monterey Jack's/ Bob Jenkin's/ Dexter Drake's  ability *do* work for starting equipment, and are phrased nearly identically.   


  15. Highlights of an interesting game.   Roland, Mary, Silas, and Yorrick vs. Father Dagon and Yig.  IH only.

     

    First part of the game went relatively according to plan, some luck with starting equipment yeilded 2 Elder Signs.   Yorrick went ahead and spent his trophies on turn 1 to bless himself (mission complete) and put a clue token on Mary's mission.  Next couple of turns yeilded horrible dice rolls by my  investigators, landing mary in the hospital (unable to take down a shoggoth while blessed with her holy water), and Silas there too, (silly bastard thought he could take on a Cthonian that spawned on an Aquatic street,  huurk).   

     

    The Stars are Right came up on the 3rd turn, Roland pitched Anna Kaslow to end it immidiately,  she had done her job, her two bonus clues at the start of the game allowed Roland to easily complete his mission.  The Gate in the Science Building was to R'lyeh, so I send Mary in with an Elder sign to deal with it. 

    Game progressed fairly well, Mary sealed with her Elder Sign, Roland sealed a gate at the Unnameable as well.  Unfortunately a gate had opened at Devil's reef and started to annoy me with Uprising tokens.  With Silas unable to get to his boat due to a lack of magic weapons and a formless spawn blocking the way to the docks, it seemed I was just going to have to grin and bear it for a few turns.

     

    Environments strike at the worst times,  Roland was in another gate to seal (having the clue tokens), Yorrick and Mary were ready to seal as well,  Mary had gotten some clues via an old journal given to her after defeating The Stars are Right, and Yorrick had a couple of clues and enough monster trophies to make a seal between them.  It was at that time that the game decided it would be fun to have No One Can Help You Now.    But that was okay,  I looked at the board.   2 seals, Roland, Mary, and Yorrick all with sealing clues.   That's 5, if I could get Silas to rush through a gate, close it, and sacrifice himself for the mission that would put the last seal on the board.   I hoped the environment would change and sent my invesitgators in anyway, Silas sailing to the Devil's Reef gate that had been causing so many problems.

     

    In gates nothing too intimidating happened in general, some investigators got hurt, but overall nothing major.   Unfortunately the environment didn't change, and a gate block brought the DOR track up to 5.  Due to Yorrick getting delayed, he and mary didn't come out on the same turn.  Roland sat on his gate waiting for the environment, Mary did likewise, Silas closed the gate on Devil's Reef and Yorrick scooted over.

     

    Allright...   I thought to myself as I prepared the mythos card for the turn.   If this is an environment card that isn't on one of my two seals (one of those on the Science building) , I'm going to win, as no monsters are threatening Vorticies.   Draw.   It's an environment!  What luck!...     The gate is at Devil's Reef,   the one that Silas just closed the previous turn.   Allright.   Well, that's grim, but okay.   Hopefully the monster doesn't move.  Anxious to see what it is, I draw a monster.   A Mi-Goh!   Score!!!!!!   At this point I'm sure I'm safe.   Just for kicks I draw the gate to see where Silas gets carted off to.   

     

     It's the other R'lyeh gate.     AAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!    Silas is drawn through the gate and devourered.   Silas has the Innsmouth Look, draw a deep one and place it on his location, also add a DOR token to the track.    Could there possibly be a more obscure and unlikely way to wake up the AO?   Defeat via personal story!  Curse you, Silas Marsh!  Curse you and Dagon both!!!!!!!

     

    Well, that's the end of the fun part of the game,   although I was left with a connumdrum.   Do I replace the unfortunate Silas Marsh with another investigator?   Upon checking the rules I discovered that you replace the devourered investigator "immidiately", also the ancient one awakens "immidiately".  Since the answer to this question depends entirely on whether or not we're in final combat, I was left scratching my head.  Ultimately I went with the ruling, that the first player decides when two things happen simultaneously, and replaced Silas with Norman Withers.   Ended up winning the game via final combat (mary and Yorrick having retained their blessings helped) and I doubt the absence of Norman would have made much difference, as he was cursed the whole time and got only a few successes.


  16. I disagree with you about Red Sign, Dam.  The AO's toughness obviously can't be lowered, but you can still ignore one of it's abilities.  

     

    Evidence to support this comes from Red Sign vs Bind Monster.   Both mention monsters and monster toughness specifically.    Bind monster has the added line of text that specifically states that it doesn't work on Ancient Ones,  Red Sign does not have that text.


  17. I've noticed a whole lot of things in Innsmouth where order is pretty unclear.   I believe the last I heard was that if there was a timing dispute, the first player decides.  

     

     The Ancient One is at 1 doom in final combat,  all investigators including Tommy Muldoon (who removes a doom, among other things, when devourered), are devourered (say, by Glaaki).  Who wins?

     There are 5 elder signs on the board.  A 'gate block' adds the last uprising token to the track, but is also the 5th 'block' for Mandy's mission.  AO woken up or no?

     

     

    Scenario 2 actually happened to us, we played it that the investigators won.


  18. otoh,  and Uttanis is a prime example here:   As invesitgators are Devourerded, the remaining equipment available to investigators is better.   Example,  poor wilson is 1st player in final combat against Uttanis, so he hands his shotgun over to someone else, since he knows he is gonna be doomed.

     

    Similar against Zhar, Chaugnar Faugn, Rhan-Tegoth, Ghantanothoa and Nygotha, where the investigator who is in danger of being devourered will know so, and therefore have an oppurtunity to pas equipment off to other players, thereby preserving good stuff.  Therefore, I agree with the OP in their assessment that most of the new AOs get much easier with larger teams.

×
×
  • Create New...