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Everything posted by Lightbringer

  1. A thought that occurred to me the other day was the idea that perhaps the Emperor engineered an Astartes lifespan that fitted in with his view of how long the Great Crusade would last. At the time of the Heresy, the Great Crusade had been going for about 250 years. It was clear that Ullanor was a major victory, and following this victory the Emperor felt able to put Horus in charge of military operations and retire to the Imperial Palace. Perhaps the Emperor felt that at the 250-year mark, the hardest part of the Great Crusade was over? That two thirds of the work was done? The Emperor is always portrayed as the ultimate conquerer, one with an almost prescient ability to read events. What if he had estimated that it would take 3-400 years to conquer the Galaxy? This means that if the Imperium had, around the time of Ullanor, gradually stopped recruiting Astartes on the same scale, the first Astartes veterans, the ones recruited to conquer the Galaxy, would start dying of old age by the end of the crusade. Perhaps the Emperor didn't WANT the Astartes living into the age of the new Imperium. They were intended to usher in the new age and then gradually fade into history. Perhaps the Emperor built in obsolescence into the Astartes...like washing machines, or iPhones. After all, he'd had problems with the Thunder Warriors who'd preceded them; there are references in the novels to rebellions and massacres of those troops. Perhaps, to avoid that, the Emperor, with his latest super warriors, the Astartes, designed them to live and die within the span of the Great Crusade. Taking this further, perhaps he engineered different lifespans for different legions according to predicted casualty rates. Some legions ( particularly ones who were more mentally unstable like the world eaters or night lords) conceivably were able to replace casualties faster, but traded off a longer lifespan. Perhaps also the Emperor intended that longer lived legions-like the blood Angels- were to survive the crusade by virtue of their 1000 year lifespan, and act as a police force for the new golden age of humanity, a standing army, one with a longer term view of the Galaxy than "normal" Astartes. Perhaps some quality in their geneseed (their nobility? Their respect for humanity?) made them more desirable candidates to usher in a new, peaceful Imperium, than the berserker qualities of some of the other legions.
  2. There are probably a number of complex individual planetary and ship-wide intranets as opposed to a single Imperium-wide Internet. One imagines that better developed hive worlds and of course forge worlds would have very large computer networks, though given the vast interstellar distances between worlds, communication difficulties would probably prevent worlds linking up into a proper single network. I have in the past speculated that astropaths could be servitorised and used to transmit binary information accurately between forge worlds. Although perhaps a punishment for this astropaths, this might permit very slow (dial up speed) based networks to exist between worlds. (Actually I'm a computing ignoramus - are networks actually possible over slow connections?)
  3. It's interesting that the Blood Angels and the Ultramarines canonically have different lifespans. The Ultramarines seem to live for around 3-400 years (Ortan Cassius is said to be the oldest at nearly 400) whereas the Blood Angels seem to live for around 1000 years. I wonder if there are further variations between the original legions in terms of lifespan? Perhaps there were other chapters with far shorter lifespans? One imagines this might have been picked up in the circa 250 years of the Great Crusade, though, and I haven't seen any reference to this yet. Perhaps some legions with very high casualty rates (world eaters, death guard) might have had shorter lifespans which weren't picked up because they kept dying in industrial qualities in battle, preventing the shorter lifespans being discovered. Perhaps also some traitor legions would have had extended lifespans like the Blood Angels, but this wasn't discovered because they fled to the Eye of Terror, temporally distorting them and obscuring their true lifespan. Perhaps some of the traitors were in fact functionally immortal, even aside from the Daemonic effects of the eye?
  4. Did the WHFB shake-up effect tabletop rules at all? I can't imagine it wouldn't.Let's also keep in mind that GW is in the business of selling luxury plastic toy soldiers and anything they do with their IP is to sell more toy army mans. Graham McNeill is probably the lead writer in the Horus Heresy series. He is hugely influential over the development of that line, and his plots are incorporated seamlessly into the wider canon. what he says is important to the line...which is probably why his retraction was rushed out so quickly. As for warhammer end times rule changes, to paraphrase wildly, Tomb kings and Vampire counts merged into one army under Nagash with enhanced special,characters, new Chaos characters, high, dark and wood elves merged into new different lists.
  5. Lynata, you're right about the Third War for Armageddon campaign, that was great. GW doesn't seem to have run campaigns like that in 40k since the 13th Black Crusade. It's supposition on my part, but I think that this might be because handing the fans the chance to, by their own battles, permanently interfere with the entire setting and thereby GW's intellectual property, was probably a bit of a step too far for them. (Actually we're forgetting the pretty godawful Medusa V campaign here, thinking about it.) It would be nice to see a new large interactive narrative campaign by GW again in the 40k setting: one with themed, campaign specific armies, (ie not EVERY army fighting over one planet-I'm looking at you, Medusa campaign) supporting rules and background, themed minis, updates and store-run battles that tie in to a global outcome based on those battles. My main point is that a campaign like that can be great WITHOUT (ugh) bringing back the Primarchs, killing the Emperor, battles on Terra etc. The current setting WORKS, in my opinion, giving the freedom for decades of apocalyptic battles on the same grand scale as the end times stuff within the framework of existing 40k. There are signs mainstream GW are interested in this approach for 40k, though. Look at Sanctus Reach and the new blood Angels campaign. I don't think the QUALITY of this stuff matches the Forgeworld campaign material or, to a lesser degree, the End Times stuff, but it's a step in the right direction. Now they just need to take their time (ie stop churning out 3 mediocre books a month and concentrate on 1 excellent and innovative book every month), make it narrative, make minis for it (in fact generally be a bit more like Forgeworld) and make the whole thing interactive with the fan base. As for Graham McNeill's comments, yes, I know he's retracted them, but I do think that the very fact he's "musing" like that is slightly worrying. It suggests he doesn't really value the setting as is and thinks bringing back the Primarchs is a good idea. I personally think it's NOT a good idea, and risks killing the golden goose for GW.
  6. I personally find aspects of the End Times material for Warhammer a little jarring, but on the whole it's clearly been a huge success, creating renewed interest in an arguably moribund line. Given this success, there's going to be a temptation for GW to rush in and do something similar with 40k: a cataclysmic "End of the Imperium" style mega campaign. I think this should be approached with caution. The lesson here is not "apocalypse = success." The real lesson GW should learn from the End Times success is exactly the lesson they've already learned from the Horus Heresy line and, to a lesser extent, the Badab War books. That lesson is: if you have a large, well written, attractively presented and well supported narrative campaign spread over several large, high quality volumes and backed by works of fiction and beautiful miniatures...people will buy that stuff and enjoy it. The End Times stuff isn't perfect: it comes across as the work of many hands, and it seems to be a bit too casual about sweeping away huge chunks of the setting beloved of many older fans ("Bye, Kislev, bye Marienburg, farewell Tilea, so long Elves as we know them..."), but it succeeds on the whole because it's big, the quality's consistently high and it's in a setting people had forgotten they loved. Also there has to be that feeling of an ongoing campaign, a desire to see the next instalment: Tamurkhan was a lovely piece of work, for example, but I don't get the sense it resonated with fans as strongly as The End Times. 40k in my opinion doesn't need an End Times campaign: it needs dozens of high quality narrative campaigns like the Badab War, the Siege of Vraks etc over the next fifty years. 40k is in the end times already: I'd like GW to show us how we got here in loving detail.
  7. Horus. But my personal conception of Horus rather than the version the HH novels are showing us. I haven't read "vengeful spirit" yet, but so far I feel the HH Novel Horus is not living up to the legend. Horus should be the top primarch. He should be a towering figure, a master manipulator, a masterful General, a ruthless streetfighter, a charismatic magnificent bastard. He should be 25% Frank Underwood, 25% Avon Barksdale, 25% Jim Jones and 25% Augustus Caesar. Instead so far he's 100% Haydon Christianson as Anakin Skywalker; a cipher with implausible motivations who comes across as an easily manipulated dupe. You should hate Horus' deeds but have a sneaking admiration for the man. This doesn't happen so far. The HH Novel Horus is a little man who does not fill the gap in the canon left by the towering Horus of the older background. If we're talking primarchs as portrayed in the novels so far, I really like Dan Abnett's portrayal of Gulliman. Gulliman was never my favourite Primarch previously, but Abnett has taken his stiff, aloof, somewhat arrogant demeanour and made him into a sympathetic and well rounded character. He's flawed: relatively humourless, earnest, snooty and conventional, but his enormous intellect and superhuman abilities force him to recognise his own flaws and find humility despite himself. It's a neat, if short character arc, made all the more impressive for avoiding bathos and unnecessary drama. He's logical, cold, reasonable, but he finds passion in defending what's important when the chips are down.
  8. I did this in a neat little four column table in word, but the forum software keeps posting it as plain text much to my irritation. Here's a relatively neat plain text version: First part of Ork Name: D10 Roll 1 Ard 2 Madd 3 Bad 4 Deff 5 Gragg 6 Kekks 7 Bakk 8 Bukk 9 Stabb 10 Gurk Then roll again for the second part of the name D10 Roll 1 Grad 2 Ork 3 Garx 4 Krak 5 Git 6 Snik 7 Gakk 8 Cradjaz 9 Thrakk 10 Kegza Then if you wish roll for an Orkish title or nickname D10 Roll 1 Da Strangla 2 Da Stabba 3 Da Worldkruncha 4 Da Bita' 5 'Ulkrida 6 Da Loon 7 Throatstampa 8 Da Merciless 9 Earbita 10 Armrippa Thus rolling 3,7 and 1 gives you Baddgakk Da Strangla, a respectable Orkish name.
  9. Ugh. Did a really neat word table, but it pastes as plain text...hang on...
  10. Star Phantoms are a good example. They've lost a couple of home worlds, I believe. Their last one was destroyed by Hrud, then they went fleet based, then they resettled on one of Badab's moons after the Badab War.
  11. There was always this:- http://www.digitalequinox.com/wip/epic/dropship01.jpg
  12. I did this for Rogue Trader yonks ago: Eisenhorn's actual warp capable ship. Not what the OP was after, really, but here for completeness:- Isolde Pattern Bulk Clipper “The Essene was three kilometres long…and fully seven hundred metres deep at its broadest part. Its nose was a long sleek cone like a cathedral spire made of overlapping gothic curves and barbed with bronze finials and spines. Behind that bladed front, the angular hull thickened into muscular buttresses of rusty-red plating, looped and riveted with ribs of dark steel. Crenellated tower stacks bulged from the dorsal hump. Hundred metre masts stabbed forward from the hull like tusks, and other, shorter masts projected from the flanks and underside, winking with guide lights. The rear portion of the juggernaut splayed into four heat-blackened cones, each of which was large enough to swallow a dozen gun-cutters at once.” -Eisenhorn, Xenos Isolde pattern Bulk Clippers represent something of a failed experiment; an attempt to combine the speed of a Clipper with both the greater freight capacity of a bulk Transport and the armour of a warship. The fact that the class was unsuccessful in truly achieving any aspect of this triple purpose has not reduced the affection with which these ships are held by starfarers, a fondness rooted in their extraordinary beauty. Constructed in the now legendary Larland shipyards (themselves lost to heretical industrial sabotage over three millennia ago) the ships attempted to build upon the success of the earlier Orion-Class Star Clipper. The Orion was a finely balanced thoroughbred, and the Archmagi Shipwrights of Larland hoped to enhance the survivability of the class by overcoming certain calibration shortcomings that had precluded the mounting of additional armour. Unfortunately, this was never properly achieved. The gradual realisation among the Larland Technomagi of the new Isolde Class’ inability to comply with any aspect of the contractual Carta Confabricor led to a five decade round of buck passing and finger pointing, culminating in a series of disastrous enforced design compromises. And yet, despite its compromised origin, the Isolde has, in the fullness of time, come to be regarded as one of the most visually arresting vessels within the Imperium. Resembling its parent, the Orion, it is at once heavier yet somehow more organic and lithe. Constructed by the Larlanders from the finest materials (largely with a view to distracting potential purchasers from its shortcomings) it effortlessly catches the starlight, reflecting it across languidly elegant bronzed plating, smoothly dappled stained armourglass and electrum-coated buttresses that make the architectural features of the most magnificent Imperial cathedral seem dull and provincial in comparison. Dimensions: 3 km long, 0.7km abeam at fins approx Mass: 8.7 Megatonnes Crew: 16,000 crew, approx Accel: 3.6 gravities max sustainable acceleration Speed: 7 Manoeuvrability:+15 Detection: +10 Hull integrity:38 Armour: +12 Turret Rating: 1 Space: 38 SP: 25 Weapon capacity: 1 Port, 1 Starboard Cargo Hauler: This vessel was designed for transporting goods, and no amount of retrofitting can fully change this. This Hull comes pre-equipped with one Main Cargo Hold Component (See page 203 of the Rogue Trader Core Rulebook). The hull’s Space has already been reduced to account for this, however when the ship is constructed it must be able to provide a total of 2 power to this component. “A beauty.” This vessel draws admiring glances from all those who know about spacecraft. Anyone associated with the vessel is deemed to gain a +5 bonus to fellowship when dealing with the voidborn or anyone with the Pilot (Space Craft) skill.
  13. How did I misss that? Orkhan/Arkhan...**** you GW, you're too subtle for my feeble brain!
  14. Well you're right of course...there are obvious differences between the two that prevent them being entirely analagous:- Nagash -Tall pointy hat -Floats around surrounded by spirits -Has a gopher called Arkhan -Lives in a pyramid -Wants to kill every living thing in the world -Has repeatedly been shattered and has rebuilt himself each time C’Tan -Tall pointy head -Floats around surrounded by cloth -Has no gopher whatsoever -Lives in a pyramid…on a tombship…in space -Wants to kill every living thing in the galaxy -Has (probably) been shattered and has not rebuilt himself yet ...I could go on identifying discrepancies and similarities all day. You could do the same thing for other parts of the setting:- High Elves -Ride Phoenixes - Use magic -Are a powerful race, shrinking in numbers, clinging to the glories of the lost age, defending their realm against ignorant younger races and their own tragically twisted kin - Very fond of pointy helmets Craftworld Eldar -Keep banging on about phoenixes -Use psychic powers -Are a powerful race, shrinking in numbers, clinging to the glories of the lost age, defending their craftworlds against ignorant younger races and their own tragically twisted kin …er… My point is, however, that Nagash and the C'Tan clearly occupy very similar roles in their respective settings, despite certain differences. Perhaps broadly analagous is a better way to put it; broadly analagous in the same way that many elements of WFB are broadly analagous to elements within 40k. My wider point is - as above, so below. What works for WFB (and the fanbase's response to the Return of Nagash seems broadly positive) is likely to also work for WH40k. I like the C'Tan, and it would be nice to see them updated in a manner as interesting as the way in which Nagash has been presented. The real trick would be doing it in a way which doesn;t break the very narrow M41 999 timescale.
  15. I'm rather enjoying what GW are up to at the moment with Nagash in their WFB line. I've run undead armies since they were just undead armies, so it's kind of nice to see things go a bit full circle, and it's fun to see Nagash again, all grown up. Where this links (tangentially) with 40k is that GW's "return of Nagash" storyline got me musing about GW's approach to the Necrons, and the C'Tan in particular. The old Andy Chambers Necron Codex is (in my opinion) a bit of a GW classic, hitting the 40k tone beautifully, and introducing a fully workable Necron army in an interesting and fun way. It certainly wasn't perfect, in that if you didn't have one of the four named C'Tan, your army was a bit generic, but it remains one of the best codices written, in my view. Many people disliked the more recent (Mat Ward) codex, and I have my issues with it, but it isn't as bad as it's sometimes made out to be; on the whole I still like it. Mat Ward gets far more than his deserved share of internet hate, in my opinion. The Codex is strong on allowing players to create interesting unique armies, and has a considered, open and nuanced take on the motivation of different Necron factions. It's often characterised as "tomb kings in space" which is in my view a fair if double edged criticism; it's true, but then tomb kings are a fun and workable concept/stereotype. I dislike some aspects of the writing, which can come across as a bit cartoonish, but on the whole it's a solid piece of work, background wise. (note I'm not talking about the rules themselves anywhere here, that's beyond the scope of what I'm discussing.) Anyway, my point here is that if we're doing "the return of Nagash" why not do a "return of the C'Tan" storyline? The C'Tan occupy a similar position in the 40k canon to the position held by Nagash in the WFB canon; the instigators and creators of an undead faction. You could have the four "named" C'Tan (Deceiver, Dragon, Nightbringer, Outsider) return to 40k in the same way that Nagash has in WFB. Under the newer codex canon, the C'Tan have been shattered into dozens of "shards", though Mat Ward left the background sufficiently open to (in my view) permit GW to reintroduce more powerful named C'tan. Imagine: a new giant plastic C'Tan model, created using GW's splendid new CAD technology, configureable into any of the four major C'Tan. Just look at the new Nagash miniature for an idea of how adept GW had become at utilising negative space and flowing, floating, silk like features in three dimensions. All of these features would work brilliantly with the floating C'Tan. Imagine this miniature accompanied with 2 new Codices: one for "tomb kings" style Necrons and one for reawakened C'Tan forces - the "Vampire counts" Necron army. The Necrons are factionalised enough to permit two entire major subfactions: those who support the reawakened C'Tan, and those who fight to defeat them in revenge for the death fo their souls. You could roll in some interesting new miniatures for the "vampire counts" Necron faction: lesser C'Tan fragments as Elite infantry or generals for the C'Tan armies. For the pure Necron armies have special C'Tan slaying heavy weapons, or portable Tesseract vaults capable of imprisoning them. Perhaps even bring back the Silent King as a named character (a Settra analogue) for the "Tomb Kings" perspective on 40k. I'd buy all of that little lot GW...go on...give it a go!
  16. This sounds like the sort of thing Dark Eldar would do for fun. Puts a new perspective on Illyan Nastase, doesn't it? Mutant offspring of a thousand alien psychopaths, conceived in a torture chamber for the pleasure of a cabal of insane Haemonculi, his pregnant and utterly traumatised mother, a captured slave, was hurled through the webway, landing on the shattered world of Badab among the ashes of the Palace of Thorns...this stuff just writes itself!
  17. The title of this thread (rather than the green skin seducing Kirk concept) got me musing on what a 40k siren would be like... Given the nature of the setting, they wouldn't be beautiful in reality. I started thinking of a horrific looking monster that PRETENDED to be a beautiful woman to get close to men in order to eat/enslave/brainwash etc them. Then I thought that this idea seemed a little familiar:- http://reddwarf.wikia.com/wiki/Psiren And actually:- http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Under_the_Skin_(2013_film) And now I come to think of it:- http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Species_(film) And actually:- http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Vampires#.U_Je-WK9KK0
  18. It seems to me increasingly arguable that the Minotaurs may well be an Iron Warriors successor chapter.-They're both grim, dour, mechanistic fighters who use ruthless, attritional tactics where necessary -They both use extensive ancient Greek (Grecic?) imagery. -Perturabo, according to "Angel Exterminatus" travelled everywhere with a kind of portable labyrinth of his own construction. Minotaurs live in labyrinths. (Well, Theseus' one did, anyway.) -The Minotaurs are part of the cursed founding, where all kinds of weird stuff was tried out. -There were known loyalist Iron Warriors elements during the Horus Heresy, such as the 77th Grand Company, who opposed an Alpha Legion strike force during the battle of Paramar, and Warsmith Dantioch. -Horus Heresy 3: extermination appears to be written in many ways as a companion piece to the Badab War books, giving plausible origins for both the Minotaurs (the aforementioned 77th Grand Company) and the Carcharadons (a unit of Terran pre-primarch discovery Raven Guard banished into a nomad-predation fleet by Corax due to their extreme viciousness.) The book also creates backstory for the origins of the Executioners, among others. Alan Bligh, the author, is clearly creating a pocket "Bligh-verse" within the 40k setting, in much the same way as Dan Abnett did with his "Daniverse". (Which is cool, because Bligh's the best 40k writer currently working in the setting, IMHO.)
  19. Any thoughts on this? I suppose there are two opposing views:- 1. Guardsmen never retire. They fight on until they die. All guardsmen are locked into what amounts to a death sentence, doomed to martyr themselves gloriously in the service of the God-Emperor. 2. Guardsmen are like any other Imperial servant: they will be given rejuvenat treatment proportional to their importance. Those who have reached the end of their useful life are given the right to retire in peace. Personally, although the former is nice and grimdark (and no doubt applies in some theatres of war) on the whole I prefer the latter. Dan Abnett's treatment of the guard certainly deals with them in a manner analogous to a 21st century army, with pay, breaks for r&r etc. Retirement fits this pattern. Canonically, successful regiments get to run conquered worlds; arguably this is a type of retirement. What do you think?
  20. Ooh, sorry Robin, but the Exorcists have a confirmed progenitor chapter.... Which are The Grey Knights themselves! And yes, alpha legion could be (are) infiltrating other chapters (which has it's own level of awesome for stories) but I'm looking for chapters made up entirely of members with gene-seed from the traitor primarchs. Gotta look up that extermination book, see how likely a group of iron warrior survivors could be. Wait, what?! The Grey Knights have successor chapters?! Source? I'd be interested in hearing a source for this, too. I was actually mulling over potential links between the Exorcists and the Grey Knights today. They're kind of opposite ends of the same spectrum: marine chapters that fight Daemons in different ways. The Grey Knights are (or were until their last codex) puritans, and the Exorcists are radicals from the outset. It occurred to me that a neat way to retcon the section from the Grey Knights Codex that everyone hates (ok, not Draigo, the other one, the one about killing Sororitas for their 'pure blood') would be to make the Exorcists something of a dumping ground for the more impure Grey Knights, exiles and borderline heretics who have tried new and radical methods to defeat chaos. What if those Grey Knights responsible for the massacre of the Sororitas were corrupted/inspired by radical inquisitors, and were subsequently exiled from the chapter by their brothers? What if there is a long tradition of these potentially tainted, radical, but otherwise still deadly and useful Grey Knights being quietly transferred to the Exorcists so the Grey Knights can continue to boast that not one of their number has ever been corrupted by chaos? What if the Exorcists were deliberately created from the start with this concept in mind? After all, I don't think anyone was upset that Sororitas were being killed to perform chaotic rituals: this sort of thing is common in 40k. What annoyed people was that the GREY KNIGHTS were the ones doing the killing, and this fitted far outside the conception most had of the chapter. My working assumption had always been that the Grey Knights were of a Puritan mindset. I think I got this idea from the Daemonhunters Codex, which as I recall (don't quote me on this) wouldn't let Grey Knights work with Inquisitors who used Daemonhosts. Like many, I wasn't happy with Grey Knights using Daemon weapons, killing Sororitas etc, as it fitted outside my vision of how they operated. But what if, behind the scenes, there has long been a struggle within the Grey Knights chapter over exactly HOW they should be fighting chaos? This is a debate that has raged for thousands of years within the Inquisition; Marines are far from stupid, so it seems logical that they should have the same debates. Primarily "should we use the weapons of the enemy against them?" It's all very well for Inquisitors to fall into squabbling factionalism about these debates, but the Grey Knights are an elite military unit, and they would likely have to make fairly rapid and robust decisions about how these debates should be played out. They can't afford to have a civil war about it: the Imperium depends upon their work. What if they dealt with it in the same way as the Iron Hands dealt with the Moriae Schism: by allowing the "rebels" to set up their own franchise? Their own chapter: the Exorcists. Of course this would probably have taken place over a long period, with the intense scrutiny of high ranking Inquisitor Lords from opposing camps of the radical/Puritan divide. But by using the Exorcists as a "release valve" for wilder ideas and a secret new posting for arguably tainted Brothers, the Grey Knights are able to retain their reputation with high ranking Puritan Inquisitor Lords (likely the most politically influential faction) while also continuing to test out radical theories and get some use out of damaged old warhorses in a new Chapter.
  21. I did this nearly a full yonk ago for DH. I haven't updated it for OW, but I might do one day. http://www.darkreign.org/articles/15-08-2008/complete-advanced-character-package-afrieli-strain-guardsman
  22. As to Ultramar being a sector, this is an idea being pushed by the HH novels. They call it the "500 worlds". It seems Ultramar is evolving from 9 worlds in total to those 9 worlds being effectively subsector capitals of a vastly larger region. At 500 worlds, it's twice the size of a normal Imperial Sector. It's a logical idea in my book. Ultramar as a distinct super rich and organised region envied by the wider Imperium makes very little sense if it's less than half the size of a typical subsector. As to the marine legion size, I think the Forgeworld books are the ones putting the most detail into Legion size, but I think that is based on the HH books again. Don't quote me on this, but I think one of the early books (maybe Horus Rising) cited the Ultramarines as being circa 250,000 strong. I think that this was the first concrete figure cited for a legion, and it all seems to have flowed from there.
  23. Good points, Grendel. I agree that the support staff element is likely to be enormous. This isn't well reflected in the HH books generally, in my view. I think a lot of the HH writers still subconsciously think in terms of Legions as just being a different title for a Chapter, and write from that perspective. Really a Legion is akin to a small nation state in terms of overall population. And as for the World Eaters, Misha, I agree it's a little surprising to see them with such a large Legion. However, I suppose that for both the World Eaters and Death Guard one gets the feeling that their Primarchs were pretty brutal with their own marines, and were quite content to incur enormous casualties when it suited them. One imagines that the "support staff" element of each Legion would have been pretty experienced at recruiting neophyte marines at high speed to recover losses; as such perhaps the populations of these two legions varied widely over relatively short periods to reflect massive casualties and massive recruitment drives. The Death Guard being at 95,000 and the World Eaters being at 150,000 suggests that perhaps they just happened to be at opposite ends of this normal cyclical process at the time of Isstvaan. Perhaps the "normal" size for each Legion was more in the region of 122,500 to split the difference between these two extremes. This would put both Legions in the "average" category. No canon support for that theory, obviously, though.
  24. This is a proper "musing" article, it doesn't really go anywhere, nor is it trying to make any big points, I'm just thinking about the size, scale and culture of Astartes Legions in 30k. Prior to the release of the FW Horus Heresy, If I'd been asked to hazard a guess at the size of the various legions, I would have put the Ultramarines at 200,000 or so, the Sons of Horus at 150,000 or so, the Thousand Sons at 10,000 or so, and the rest of the legions at 100,000, give or take. As it's turned out, there is a far wider distribution of Legion size, with some surprising variants. Here's what we have so far, of the canon FW material, in size order. 1. Word Bearers-Thought immediately prior to Isstvan to be around 140,000, in fact likely much larger:"by some reports their numbers rivalled the ultramarines." No official number given, but likely very large, if they rival the Ultras. 2. Iron warriors-150,000-180,000. I was surprised by this, I'd assumed they'd be a smaller Legion. 3. Sons of Horus-130,000-170,000 4. World Eaters-150,000 5. Alpha Legion-120,000-130,000 (though possibly as Low as 90,000 or as high as 180,000). The level of uncertainty regarding the size of the Legion is a neat touch, and nicely in keeping with their character. 6. The Iron Hands-113,000 7. The Emperors Children-110,000 8. The Night Lords-90,000-120,000 9. Imperial fists-100,000 10. The Death Guard-95,000 11.Salamanders-89,000 (83,000 of which went to Isstvan where they suffered 98% casualties. 2,000-3000 garrisoned major facilities elsewhere, along with a full intake of neophytes and several line companies.) 12. Raven Guard-80,000 So we have 4 broad categories: Very large legion: 200,000 plus. Likely only the Word Bearers and Ultramarines fall into this category. Large Legion: 150,000-200,000. At the moment only the iron warriors and world eaters definitely fall into this category, though the sons of Horus probably did too (well, prior to Isstvaan, anyway.) The Alpha Legion might too. I'd hazard a guess that the Dark Angels do, too. Average legion:- 100,000-150,000. At the moment this would probably cover the alpha legion, iron hands, emperor's children, night lords, and imperial fists. I reckon the space wolves, white scars and blood angels fit into this category, too. Smaller legion: at the moment only the salamanders and raven guard fall into this category, but I reckon the thousand sons are prime candidates, too. It's interesting to compare these legions with the size of various modern armies:- British army:- 125,430 (exc reserves) US Army: 546,047 (exc reserves) German army: 62,279 French army: 119,070 Australian army: 30,235 Russian army: 285,000 personnel incl est 80,000 conscripts Like I say, this post doesn't really go anywhere, but I think it is interesting to think of Legions being so much larger than many modern militaries. I think there is still a tendency to see Legions as pretty much the same as the Chapters that replaced them; in many sources (particularly the HH novels) we see "Captains" and "companies" treated as the standard subdivisions for the Legion as if we were dealing with a Codex Chapter. Whilst some Legions clearly preferred not to operate in this way, when one compares this to, say, the British Army, (which is about the same size as a larger Legion) it's clear that there are massive cultural and structural differences between different ranks and between different parts of the same army. In many ways I think that the image painted of Legion structure within the HH novels is too simplistic; the FW books have a far more interesting take on them, in my opinion.
  25. No problem, Misha. Like everything else, the whole of married life can be summed up with a d5 table:- Marriage random events table (d5) 1. "I'm FINE." You've done something to upset your spouse. You don't know what it is, and you'll never know. You'll pay for it for weeks though. 2. "Oh no, not NOW..." An act of physical intimacy between you and your spouse is interrupted by one of your tiny offspring indignantly informing you that their nappy/diaper has leaked all over their bedsheets and that they have simultaneously vomited all over their hair. 3. "HOW much?!" Your spouse burns d10 of your Profit Factor on an item with no apparent use. 4. "What time do you call THIS?!" Your spouse goes and and gets drunk with their cronies, burning d5 Profit Factor and suffering d10 insanity points for the next 24 hours, thus ruining the whole damned weekend. 5. "What have you DONE to it?!" Select an item of your personal effects with the highest rarity value (archaotech pistol, rosarius etc). Your youngest offspring destroys it irrevocably by putting it in the bath or covering it in glitter.
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