I have to agree. Back in 2002 when the company had barely any presence and didn't seem to be printing money at GenCon I could see it. But they are one of the top 4-5 companies at the Con now. Wizards, Mayfair, maybe YGO...other than that FFG had easily the most presence. ~But, maybe that is because all they spend is $$ on 3 promo cards per player

bloodycelt said: Why not a 5KE box? Prune it down to say the best non-broken 60 cards from the set. The agendas, the characters that turned into agendas. Maybe the reducers that reduced by 2 if you had a king or queen? Kingdom locations? So maybe the bars attachment remover from AcoA will be useful again. (IIRC the only reason the 2 gold for 2 gold ones were really annoying is they were super rare and to compete one put 9 of them in. Though if they would return it does need heavy play testing because all those influence events become useable now). I like this, the King/Queen mechanic was great and could be increased upon. They should be powerful IMHO. No Kingdom locations though - unless they could be balanced better.

alexfrombeyondthewall said: JackT said: Not to put too fine a point on it, but going to a Tournament and then complaining about the competitiveness is like going to Church and then complaining about all the Jesus talk. hahahaha! and boom goes the dynamite. Huh, I was thinking people were not complaining about the competitiveness...they were complaining about having no chance to win, which is the opposite of competitiveness. I know if I went to a table and knew I had a 1% chance of winning, I wouldn't think of that table to be 'competative'. I guess if I was the one with 99% chance, I would think it VERY competitive.

I know the guys who used to play in Portland (Dave and Binder) had a Bday party with everyone dressed up as various aGoT characters. It looked like a blast. Kennon, you are WAY more Littlefinger than Viper

I think it comes down to the previous conversation we had about agendas. They are hard to balance. Ones without any real drawback suck. I respect the other side of the fence, and for sure Maester/Bob took most people by surprise which helped it win, but I really think we need cards that help disrupt agendas. Or stop making no-brainer ones *shrug* Starting in play cards shouldn't be no-brainers... Also, re-printing Bastard would help

goshdarnstud said: www.foxtrot.com/2011/08/08142011/ I saw that in the paper yesterday. Is it a good thing or back thing it is getting to be pop culture enough to be in the mainstream comics (althouhg Foxtrot always has a geek edge with multiple comics about WoW and the such).

Great to see you again! Sorry we never got to play...

Thanks for making it, and congrats on a good showing! Sorry I put the nail in that Stark coffin

Great to see you again! Thanks for beating me...again

I will post once, and that is it. They played well within the rules. He deserved to win (the Melee, not the overall which was silly and I would have said that no matter who won). However, it was neither sporting or fun for anyone...which I think includes the meta-mates (total speculation based on reactions and small-talk afterwards. Here are the end-game facts if we are playing for fun (a big assumption I know, ~there was a wooden box and a big sword at stake): 1. Melee ends. No one says a thing (or claps). Everyone disperses...including the winner who I couldn't find to congradulate 5 minutes afterwards. 2. Joust ends. Huge cheers. Actually there were two rounds since he throught he won twice. Everyone hangs around, even though we all want to start drunk draft ASAP and it is getting very late. Lots of hand-shakes, lots of congrats. For the record, I would have cheered and been VERY happy if Erick or Corey had won Joust (they are amazing players and deserve everyone to consider them 'real' champions, which just won't happen until they win a Joust). *shrug*

Twn2dn said: I wonder Rings, how much of your disappointment was with this specific (martell summer-heavy) environment, versus the competitors themselves? I really don't care for the Martell-focused environment. I was outright angry when FFG ruled that the fourth chapter pack wouldn't be legal, because I knew it would lead to a martell-dominated metagame. (I realize the fourth chapter pack has a lot of crazy powerful stuff in it, but at least there would have been some variety.) Probably a combo. Again, nothing personal against anyone, but the reason many of us play competative aGoT (as Laughing Tree said) is that it ISNT like many other ones...mainly since all you get for winning is a pat on the back. So to see net-decking and 'drafting' (I guess what I call it - like in racing when an entire team plays for the goal of one) just seems...odd and a bit wrong. *shrug* I certainly didn't like seeing so many Martell builds, but I was hoping if there WAS a lot of Martell, that people would have played slightly different versions of it. I think 4-6 players were playing pretty close to the exact same deck (let's call it Erick v2, Martell Summer w/ Ghaston Grey) with another 2-4 playing something VERY similiar (let's call it Erick v1, w/o the Grey). Let's just say I was happy that a deck I never had seen or even thought about won. I love unique decks, and by-and-by most Champ decks (Joust of course) have been surprising...both 1st AND 2nd were actually! I AM surprised you thoughts the 4th chapter pack would have stopped Martell. IMHO I think we would have saw MORE with Prince's Plans (or Doran's Game?...whatever the one that recycles your discard pile is) and the pretty strong 'discard X Maesters to make your opponent discard X characters' consiering their refugee is a Maester... Okay, enough of that. ~Let's let the Mathlete loving thread that this has turned into return...

Okay, I better get this TR going before I forget absolutely everything about the tourney(s). Some basic thoughts before moving on to the blow-by-blow (of the Joust only, of course!). Sorry if it seems harsh at times, you know the internets - it is hard to show humor or resignation or annoyance rather than anger! 1. After placing top 4 for five straight year (1st, 3rd, 2nd, 3rd, 4th) that run ended, and probably that window has closed. I don't spend the time playing, looking at cards, etc. I was lucky to go 4-2 (losing to two Martell Summer decks), and just miss the cut. I will take credit for winning the Drunk Draft in that I was the last guy standing undefeated at 4.30am and I had certainly drank more than most that day/night. 2. In the same vein, congrats to everyone that did well! Obviously the usual suspects were very strong - Erick, Dobbs, Mathlete, Casey and more. But there were new successes, especially Corey and Zeigler. Big time congrats to Z ~for his first 'real' title. 3. The scoring system was just silly. Dobbs is the second person ever to make both finals (Erick the first, who did win the overall)...and he get third (!!!!!!). If he got 1st and 4th he still wouldn't have won, losing to someone with a 1st and a 9th. Just funny. It wasn't like Corey wasn't deserving, but Dobbs just had a better weekend *shrug* The fact that it was already decided after the Swiss round of Joust...*roll*... 4. Overall, the competative scene just left a bad taste in my mouth. Melee was...well, melee. I saw two people get mad enough to leave before the game was over, just pick up their cards and leave. Mathlete had someone call him an a-hole (Mathlete of all people)...by someone from the meta that king-made more than any other. Obviously the finals left a bad taste in many people's mouth. Anyone can argue as much as they want, but 95% of the people I talked to were not happy about it, people who were THERE. When the winner actually won, not one person clapped and the winning team left within 5-10 minutes. *shrug* Contrast that to a ton of clapping for the Joust champion (twice actually!). 4b. In Joust, it was just weird. Seeing at least 5 of pretty much the exact same deck wasn't cool (disclaimer, at least one of them basically invented the deck). Seeing 7 of the top 16 playing the same House/Agenda wasn't cool. **Quick disclaimer - I like Erick. I like his meta, which in my mind is tied with Missou for the best meta in the country. I just don't quite agree with the ends to the means. There would be props if it was five different decks being used. There would be props if there wasn't obvious meta-specific kingmaking in the finals of two people playing the same deck. *shrug* Maybe the game has passed me by, many of us just play aGoT BECAUSE it isn't net-decking and MTG type 'drafting' of meta's and the such. I didn't know Corey, but he seems like an amazing player and deckbuilder. *shrug* 4c. I don't like Magic. aGoT isn't Magic. However, they know competative gaming. They have very good rules in place. I find it funny that FFG does the exact opposite in many cases. I know there are reasons to not allow concessions or the such, but basically it makes an environment where getting away with lying = winning more. This isn't anything on Ktom, who ruled (as always) perfect with the rules in place (gosh, he does a great job). 4d. FFG...stop with the overall champ. Just stop. It isn't working. Make a Melee champ - they have shown Melee is viable on its own. Make a Joust champ. But stop giving mythical championships to people who don't win anything...it demeans the accomplishments of the actual winners. Overall champ is the BCS of the game (for non-US-rules football fans, the BCS is a computer that tells us who should be the champion in football, and it sucks and is only there to make $$ for the bowls rather than an actual playoffs). 5. It is bad enough that I might not play next year. I have played in every aGoT Gencon since it started. I never thought about leaving the game when rotation was started. I never did when the game was moved to LCG. To be honest, in 12 months I will probably have forgotten all this and will play. But the fact that I am thinking of it at all, and waited three days to do my TR (usually it is the morning after I get home)...well, that says something. Either about me, or the competative scene, or (most likely) both. 6. Ghaston Grey is good. REALLY good. It was my secret tech, in that I put it in my deck the second I opened that chapter pack. The 2champs1chump podcast famously called it the worst card in that pack (although Dobbler did mention that I was using it for profit at Kubla). I got there and the card beat me up...badly. At least 5-8 people in the top 20 were playing it. Okay, on to the TR! Got in late - as usual. For some reason Con flying and me don't mix. Luckily, wasn't planning on doing anything except some fun games, but still annoying to wake up at 3.00am just to sit in an airport. On Friday played a little Warhammer, and got to experience the Con a little more than usual. Was going to play L5R, but decided not to play competatively L5R for the first time in six years at a GenCon qualifier (that I wasn't planning on playing more of, even if I did qualify) was a bad idea. Plus I was a little hung-over from the Irish bar the night before. So, just got to do the exhibit hall, try some games (I love Acension!!!), and hang with friends in between round of Whack-a-Mole...I mean Melee. Sidenote: Melee had a huge turnout, and that was great! It was interesting to see quite a few more casual players playing. Friday night took it a bit easier, to try and not be AS tired and hung-over as usual. Couldn't decide between Martell Brotherhood or Lanni Maesters (very light on the Maesters). In the end, I went with Martell since I had played it a ton, and it had my 'secret' tech of Ghaston Grey. Another last second tech change (I thought) was putting in Good for the Gander as my 1st turn plot. I thought there would be tons of Maester decks so I could search twice, plus I ran Birds and Ill Tidings so if I played a Summer deck and they searched I could do that twice as well. And, as usual, I put Fleeing in the deck, and it worked almost every game per the norm. I like the synergy of Martell, the BH cards, Ill Tidings (although I forgot the card draw more often than not), all the control (Claim/Ghaston/Blade/Game of C/Seductive Promise). **Disclaimer** I barely remember my own name some days, I have a horrible memory for names (not a great trait for a banker). Sorry if I miss yours, I can picture you but not name you! Round 1: Canadian guy running Stark Tully's. He started out great, I was so-so. Tully's certainly have some cards I dislike when playing Martell - especially the septon that doesn't kneel to defend intrigue, and the cancel Maester. However, I had a V. Blade and I think I played three Seductive Promises on his characters. I whittled him down, and finally won. 1-0 Round 2: Jonathan Benton running Martell Summer: He flops 5, and proceeds to get great board control. I am hanging on, but not looking good due to Ghaston Grey. Again, I didn't think I would see this in the entire tourney, and it just owns Brotherhood. We both have it out, which makes for some 'fun' beginnings of challenge phases. I Flee which buys me some more time (he had 6-8 locations out, and then couldn't afford the Nobles as much after Flee), but I didn't run specific location control so it is basically an auto-loss. 1-1 Round 3: Rich (?) playing GJ Winter We both had a pretty good start, but with Seductive Promise after a Fleeing I think I forced his Valar too soon, and I saved a few and canceled one of his saves? I always had pretty good board position, and end up winning on the back of Beric and Mad Hunts. I got rid of his season quite a bit as well with Birds and Ill Tidings. I think I probably only win this game vs. a good GJ winter deck player 50% of the time, but this was one of them. 2-1 Round 4: John/Feiras playing Martell Summer: I had a really bad start here, and he (as most summer decks do) had a great one. He was moving fast, but I thought I was always on the cusp of turning the game (especially after Grey finally came out). However, it didn't happen. John played it well, and won. 2-2 Round 5: Kyle from MO playing Lanni shadows and stuff. A pretty unique deck. This round was very annoying. I basically wiped his board clean 1st or 2nd round. Unluckily he Nightmare/Valars my Beric. I couldn't draw another BH to save my life. He had some card draw, but almost no income, so whenever he did get 2 characters out I would either Blade/claim or Game of C/claim or Seductive/claim both of them away. I was at 13 power when time was called during dominance, and would have won the game. He offered to concede (thanks Kyle) with us not knowing you couldn't do that. Ktom was standing close, and I didnt' enter the score, so I assume this meant that I was given a timed win instead of a full win, which made me miss the top 16. I don't mind at all, since that was the rules going in (although I didn't read those), but a tough thing since I dominated the game and would have won if time was called 30 seconds later. *shrug* 3-2 Round 6: Alex from CA, playing Lanni Maesters. I don't know what to say here. Again I had a good start and wiped his board 1st or 2nd turn. He couldn't get anything out that wasn't controlled, and didn't even put a chain out I don't think. Sorry Alex! 4-2 So, ended up 4-2 and somewhere in the 18th or 19th place range. Again, at this point I didn't know about the 'no concessions' rule so thought I was in after looking at my SoS. But, I was strangely zen about it, and really didn't mind not playing. I got to watch, and see some really unique deck ideas (and some not-so-unique ones). It made me excited to branch out and start building decks again, which was cool. I was happy to see who was moving on, and then got to go to the liqour store. I returned in time to be already 1/2 of the way to the drunk draft (Complord was 200% there), and see Z vs. Dobbs in a great game a little. Z 'won' twice, and that was funny. Drunk draft was a ton of fun (as usual). I ended up undefeated, mainly riding the coattails of 5KE Eddard Stark who was a BEAST. I think someone else was undefeated, but I was there last so decided to post that I won Not that it matters (~although the prize support of nothing was not much less than the Worlds prize support!). In a surprising twist, the guy I thought would drink the most (the Joust Champ) bowed out early...to be honest most of the Mizzou meta punked out Anyways, I did have a great time with friends. Played better than I thougth I would. Am still really tired. And that is what matters! Thanks to all my opponents, and all my friends, allt he people that showed up to the largest in recent memory, and to FFG for continuing such a great game.

first congrats to z...couldnt b happier...secomd dobbs wa at the final table of both melee and joust and didint win overall....a total travesty...lastly i am hammered and won drunk draft

zeiler wins w bara maesters....awesome....btw he won twice and i was hammered

sorry two baras one rush and zeiglers weird bara maesters

my count is seven martell summers out of sixteen a couple of gjs one maester and one winter...greg has martell w his agenda...a targ...cant remember all of them...no stark no lanni one bara at fifteen seed

lots of martell including the ny meta...i think corey and erick have the same deck. i found out my secret tech of ghaston grey is no where close to secret...i played martell bh and got pwned by ghaston

no thread yet? just cut to top sixteen...a couple from ericks meta one and two but bruno and many other can take it. i went four and two to a couple of martell summer decks and missed the cut by two or so.

Fieras said: rings said: ~Thanks FFG for putting Warhammer on the same day as Joust *roll*. Guess we won't get a chance to rematch then. Not like it matters much. The legends pack completely changed the game. Maybe...hey, we can always play for fun and you can beat me down again I am bringing my decks for sure.

Since I am only playing the Joust (~or as I call it, the Championship), I think I am going to have plenty of time to figure out other things to do. Probably will try L5R on Friday (first tourney in 5-6 years, used to play it competatively). Not sure on the rest of the time. ~Thanks FFG for putting Warhammer on the same day as Joust *roll*.

FFG REALLY needs a sticky thread for new players. I will make sure to mention to Nate this weekend. L5R does it very well from their main site as well with a link to the sticky thread.

I woudl really use the search engines to decide what you need to buy. Twn has them in his signature (gosh that is handy!). Welcome back - I certainly remember you!

ktom said: ~ What, are you new here? If anyone in the world knows I am the worst rule person of all time, it is you Thanks!

1. You are right, the guests have blown the last few years at GC. But they did have all the hobbits from LoTR in 2004 maybe? And pretty close to the whole cast of Battlestar in...2005? Wow...it has gone way downhill. 2. Springfield had the best US regional attendance? I thought Kubla either barely won or tied? Or is this a "darryl beat Erick' type rememberance? 3. Drunk draft has always been on Saturday that I remember. Will said something about a Friday Joust, and I just don't remember that happening (other than when they did a Sweet 16 the next day, and that was pre-DD). 4. No Missou meta at the DD (except Dobbs)? For some pansy White Wolf party? Sigh...you think you know people. 5. Will - you brining Deadlands? Or am I going to bring it so you can shun me for the 3rd year in a row? I have a (big!) CoC deck, but it is a year behind probably...

Easy question, but I keep going back and forth: Do you have to pay for the links when you bring them into play using the Maester Agenda? Or are they free (like when you play something out of your discard, etc.).