Extremely unlikely.

The group limit numbers are not ratios. They are simply how many of each type (minion and master) you can have with a given number of heroes.

I'm just hoping one of the OL upgrades can be that kick-ass tattoo.

ZXTR said: Speaking of useless skills in 1E there was a lot of useless skills depending on some combination of characters and skills. For example, when we started our last campaing One Fist recieved as one of the starting skills Ambidextrous. LOL!

IronRavenstorm said: Yeah, but can we still incorporate the old ones? No. There will be nothing in the Conversion Kit for LTs. But you will have the same ones in 2E. If you're asking if you can still use the old *figures*, then yes.

My comment about the lieutenants was meant in this way: you stated that it was possible that the text on the Goblin Archer card could allow for the possibility that there were no LTs in 2E, and that the text was just there for use with the 1E LTs. I said that this could not be the case, as if there are no LTs in 2E, then there would be no way to use the 1E LTs in 2E (sorry if all the abbreviations are confusing)! So there *will* be LTs in 2E, and they will be the same ones as appear in 1E (i.e, same name, same images), but the mechanics on how they work will be different.

IronRavenstorm said: While writing about the enemy breakdown of units I had a thought pop into my head about new possible hero skills. I was writing about water spaces on the board pieces and I thought about the Druid class of heroes. Wouldn't it be cool if you had a Druid type character who could do different magic attacks based on the type of terrain they are on like a Geomancer. It brought me back to the days of playing Final Fantasy Tactics. Examples: You or your enemy is on a water square and you cast your water spell to make the freeze in place or something. Or if you are on a dungeon/cave square you could have the ground fall underneath the enemy or make the ceiling fall down. Not all of them would have to cause physical damage, but instead cause other effects on them to weaken them in some way or another. Just a thought… It's a cool idea, but such skill cards would also need to have some other useful secondary ability to make them appealing to buy, as the abilities you describe are just way too situational (you would have a skill card that was completely useless 95% of the time).

IronRavenstorm said: Can you please explain where everyone is finding this info about just having one master per enemy type? If you can show me where this is, I think that it will help me understand the enemy breakdown better. Again, it doesn't make sense to me to just have one enemy master. I only wrote down the five of the nine that I knew that had to be in the game, but I still think that if you break it down right with the last 13-14 enemy units left you can make it to nine different types (That is if you go by my numbers). In the first game they just had two dragons and giants (one white, one red), so why do people think that the two headed giant and the wyrm will get (two white, one red)? If FFG is trying to cut back on enemy units wouldn't they have them stay at a one (white) to one (red) with the biggest/baddest units? I would like to agree with you Bleached Lizard about having the water type unit in the game, but I just can't picture a goblin type water unit. From the little of the board pieces they have shown us I can see that there is going to be water, so if they are going to have a water enemy it will be more amphibious then true water based like in Sea of Blood. Bleached Lizard, I just want to make sure that we are on the same page here. Do you think that they will bring forth new lieutenants for the second edition? For some reason, these forums won't let me reply inline. Oh well. 1 master/monster: It's just because all the monster cards we have seen so far list only one master monster, even for monster types that usually have more, so until we see something that breaks this trend the evidence is pointing towards each monster type only having one master. Why does this not make sense? It's a perfectly valid design decision. Just because it's not the same as 1E does not make it wrong. Number of white monsters: Probably presumption based on the fact that there should be some kind of scalability for all monster types. I have no opinion on this either way. Water monster: Who said anything about a goblin water type? Flesh Moulders and Bargests have nothing to do with goblins. The water type monster could be anything. Who knows - it could be a blood squid! Yes, I agree they will be amphibious and not confined to just water spaces. Lieutenants: The lieutenants will be the same but they will work differently than in 1E. We have already seen that Lord Merric Farrow appears in 2E - there is a token with his image on it over on BGG.

IronRavenstorm said: I already kinda touched on this before in the "What You hope most from Descent 2E? " forum, but I thought it would be best to start this anew after reading another forum from on BGG (Board Game Geeks.com). The topic was the breakdown of how many different types of enemy units it would be in the 2nd Edition box. After reading this forum I became confused with his numbers of how many of each unit would be in the box. I was under the impression that they thought that they would have few enemy units, but have multiple enemy types. An example is they think there is going to be just 4 normal goblin archers and one master in the box. Overall I think that their numbers are too low, especially having just one master for each type. I'm I wrong about this or have I missed something? I know that FFG is trying to cut back on the amount of units on the board, but this seems crazy. Here is what they think for the numbers: 4+1 - Goblin Archer 4+1 - ??? 4+1 - ??? 4+1 - ??? 3+1 - Barghest 3+1 - Flesh Moulder 3+1 - ??? 2+1 - Ethin 2+1 - Wyrm or 4+1 - Goblin Archer 4+1 - ??? 4+1 - ??? 3+1 - Barghest 3+1 - Flesh Moulder 3+1 - ??? 2+1 - Ethin 2+1 - Wyrm 2+1 - ??? 1+1 - ??? I think that they are getting these numbers off the bottoms of the enemy cards that have been shown thus far (The ones that show the numbers based on amount of players). From my post on the forum "What You hope most from Descent 2E?" I place the numbers high for individual units, and low on the different types. Here are the numbers that I see: 6+2 Goblin Archers 4+2 Flesh Moulders 4+2 Barghests 1(2?)+1 Two Headed Giant 1+1 Dragon/Wyrm This totals so far to 23 or possibly 24. This leaves me to believe the other type of units we haven't seen yet can be broken down to multiple other pairings which I will not touch on since who knows what they can be. Granted I do believe that there might be another 6+2 melee group to mirror the ranged Goblin Archers group. This leaves us with 13 to 14 enemy figures left to be anything. The one thing that intrigues me is if it is the odd number 13. This is just a theory; If it is 13 they could possibly break it down to 12 enemy units and a possible lieutenant (They creepy looking guy with the sword from the latest OL preview). Also, the Goblin Archer card mentions lieutenant, but it can easy be said they are talking about the lieutenants from the first edition. Overall, this is just a theory of mine, but I want to know about the number of enemy units? Are there really going to be one master for every type? Read what I posted on the other forum "What You hope most from Descent 2E?", and then post your thoughts. Again, I think they are going to be fewer types with the same number of them from the first edition. It makes more sense in my mind to combined them to make one instead of having two that do the same thing. Example: The Giant and the Ogre becoming the two headed giant. Does any of this make any sense??? I really am open for a serious conversation about this for anyone interested. P.S. I don't think we are going to see any enemy units that can swim just yet, but flying is a strong possibility. I can't remember where it comes from, but it has been confirmed that there will be nine different monsters included in the base set of 2E, so the first set of numbers you outline above (from BGG) seems likely. Keep in mind that just because each monster group is quite small, it does not mean that there will only be a few monsters on the board, as the OL can have multiple monster groups on the board at once. So even if he is restricted to just two groups he can still have up to ten monsters on the board, which is plenty. It's likely there will be at least one water-based monster so that they have all ten traits covered using just the base game monsters. They certainly aren't talking about lieutenants from 1E, as there is no way to incorporate them into 2E games.

gbnogkfs said: I, for one, would hope the revision / getting ridden of the 2 ugly mechanics of knocking-out/teleporting-to-and-from-city and monster-spawning. for the second they have already somewhat told something about. for the first not yet… The previews have already revealed that heroes do not respawn by teleporting back to town - they are just "knocked out" and need to be revived by a teammate.

Steve-O said: IronRavenstorm said: I kinda figured out that they could heal other heroes, but it has to be cooler then that for FFG to make up this new class of heroes. Also, if they don''t have potions anymore it kinda forces the group to have a healer amongst them. Also keep in mind that when a hero gets KO'd (as I understand it) another hero needs to come tag him before he can stand up again. This will mark a significant shift in tactics from 1e. The hero summary card states that a hero can stand him/herself up.

kerred said: Interesting stuff. First of all, turn summary cards, yummy. Now I don't have to keep creating and uploading turn summary cards (i have one for the first edition if needed). Overlord cards For the Cataclysm Campaign in the 1st edition, I had a lot of fun seeing the heroes sweat over the time pressure of losing conquest tokens, so it will be interesting to see what keeps heroes from dilly dallying in the 2nd ed. Dilly-dallying in what way?

If they've started previews, then the game isn't more than a couple of months away. The now-expected date of mid-late June (around the Realms of Terrinoth event) seems realistic.

Dr ePhil said: I am kind of sad with these first previews of the game. Sure they are informative, but to me the people who end up buying the game will probably end up being the OL so I wish they would have previewed that part of the game first. I hope they release information about the game play for the OL soon. I betting the next preview will be about the OL. I'm also betting the next preview will be tomorrow. I've got a lot of money riding on this.

Sausageman said: Bleached Lizard said: My deconstruction of the dice (what we''ve seen so far) can be found on BGG here: http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/793554/trying-to-figure-out-the-distribution-on-the-dice I think the complexity of the dice from 1E (which is quite a dull form of complexity) is being replaced by simple dice that can be manipulated by complex skills (which is a much more interesting form of complexity). Fingers crossed this is true… I didn't see an issue with the 'dull complexity' though. You KNEW that if you rolled the blue dice, you could get good range, but the damage wouldn't be so great (and arguably you aren't putting yourself in harms way, so why not have this negative), but if you rolled the red dice, you had the potential to wallop someone (with the downside being if you missed, you had an enemy stood infront of you about to hit back). The white dice was the wild card with decent damage, though not as much as the red, decent range, though not as much as the blue, but lots of surges to trigger magical effects. I liked this, meant characters 'felt' difference. And from a 'game' perspective, it meant there was less fighting over dice…. The implication there is that heroes in 2E won't feel different from each other. But we can't really tell that for sure until we see what the skills are like. Maybe the skills will make the heroes feel much more different from each other than they ever did in 1E, and we'll all forget about the silly differences in the dice. Hopefully.

The Dark Might card is an Overlord card. Nice.

My deconstruction of the dice (what we''ve seen so far) can be found on BGG here: http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/793554/trying-to-figure-out-the-distribution-on-the-dice I think the complexity of the dice from 1E (which is quite a dull form of complexity) is being replaced by simple dice that can be manipulated by complex skills (which is a much more interesting form of complexity). Fingers crossed this is true…

Unclechawie said: The next question then becomes, how do you make two classes out of that? Healing seems to be a very narrow possibility. We already know one of them is dressed in armor, which points toward a Paladin. Maybe something along the lines of a damage prevention, though that was already described under the knights class for the fighters archtype. My friend brought up the possibility of a buffer and debuffer. One that removes curses/heals wounds and the other that prevents them altogether. Here''''s to hoping we get another preview soon. I think the two most likely classes are Cleric and Druid. Obviously straight-up healing abilities will be common to both (with maybe the cleric having a slight edge). Possibly the druid will have familiars at his disposal…►

IronRavenstorm said: Thank you for clearing up the tokens, but my question about the blue healers. What makes them special? In our games we normally have the fastest hero become the medic, so what sets the healers apart from some one with a potion? I imagine their skills will allow them to heal other heroes. Seems obvious, really.

IronRavenstorm said: What do we really know about the blue healing class as of yet? When looking at the actions card that they last posted on the website it mentions heroes being knocked out (Which makes more sense then ending up in the city again). Also looking at the first campaign story that has been shown I noticed four tokens by every heroes card (Left of their main cards). They all seem to match to a certain class since all three heroes have a different type of token. Correct me if I am wrong here, but maybe the OL wins if they take enough of those tokens? If you notice the hero cards no longer have a point value system on them for the OL to gain points. My strange thinking is that the healing class might have something to do with all of this. Maybe the healer can do something special which can help a knocked out ally? Again, what do we know about the healing class? I hope that in the next preview we will see something dealing with this new class since we already know about the other three (for those who played the first edition that is). The four tokens appear to be "hero tokens" that are just used to identify players in certain circumstances (check out the Curse of the Monkey God card from the latest preview). The next preview will likely be about the Overlord''s role.

jessie6 said: I was looking at an Italian gamestore. They had this info about Descent 2nd Edition: "This product will be in stock on Monday 30 April, 2012." They lie.

Pongle said: Thanks for the clarification. I missed the red die not having an X on it. That makes more sense now, but I kind of miss having the three different "flavors" of main attack die. We do not know for certain that the red dice do not have an X on them. It's a guess based on the fact that there are two of them.

Unclechawie said: IMO that would be a waste of the card(s) it was printed on. It should be inherent in the use of fatigue as it was in 1st ED. Hopefully the won't go that route. EDIT: Referencing the RUN skill. Unclechawie said: IMO that would be a waste of the card(s) it was printed on. It should be inherent in the use of fatigue as it was in 1st ED. Why? I actually prefer it if these things are printed on skill cards, as it differentiates the characters. Scouts should be good at running, warriors at adding to their attack dice, etc.

It's possible/likely there'll be skills along the lines of: Run Move 1 space. You may use this skill as many times as you like each turn. Cost: 1 fatigue.

shnar said: GTM had an ad on the back a couple months ago, and there was a pic of what the conversion kit will have: Basically, you get Hero sheets and Monster cards. You might also get a small rulebook on how to "integrate" the monsters into the game, but that's pretty much it. -shnar It's also been confirmed that there will be cards for three familiars, so it's possible there might be a few other cards as well (and possibly even some tokens).