Steerpike said: sort of lame (personal opinion of course) I suppose the dice you roll are cooler. When you're playing your elf.

The hour glass represents a delay in an action or more time that is taken. Right, but what does that mean? I'm sure there's an in-game effect for it, but what? Does it change our stance, since the stance meter graphic showed hourglass tokens on it? I doubt that it's purely a storytelling element. The Imperial Eagel represents a Boon or something beneficial happening, while the Skull represents a Bane or something detrimental happening. From what I can tell, we match up the number of rolled Eagles or Skulls (or whatever) to the effects listed on our action card. It looks like if we don't get a match for certain symbols, we can ignore them. That's that sort of thing I want to know more about. What do the symbols actually do in the game? One thing I've just picked up from the video is that you convert a certain number of your "other dice" into red or green stance dice. If you're 3 steps into red, you'll swap 3 of your blue ability dice for red Reckless dice. I think. That eases my mind a little bit about rolling lots of dice at one time, since you're not just adding stance dice to the rest of your pool. It also makes your stance more important. I like the stances, in theory.

I suppose I should've woken up before I wrote that. I missed at least two words in there! I'm gonna pretend like it was intentional.

I think this is where a lot of us are stalling. Everything looks pretty cool me up to that point. I just don't know the symbols on the dice mean. Anybody else think this should be the subject of a preview or designer diary? Bump it if you do.

Reclusiarch said: I have a two concerns Such is the power of the Three.

"As the Game Master, you will make the lands of the Old World real as you craft the story, the people, creatures, and the mysteries the other players will encounter during their adventures." That's on the same page I linked to earlier. Make of it what you will. You did not see me. I was never here.

I remember reading that there would be a pad of character sheets included.

Crazy Aido said: What is my role now as GM? This is of major concern to me, since I rarely find anyone with the cahungas to step up and assume my (in)glorious mantle. The provision of tables, cards, books and in depth rule sets seems to put power very firmly in the hands of the players, as well as increasing concerns that the game now resembles more of a board game than an RPG. As GM, how much control do I have over combat and the options available to the players? You might feel better about this after reading the "What is Roleplaying?" section here: www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_minisite_sec.asp Especially this part: "The GM presents the stories and situations, provides the setting and its denizens, and adjudicates the rules. The other players take on the roles of the characters, around which the action primarily revolves. These characters are known as the Player Characters (PCs). They describe their intentions and actions to the GM, who then decides how their actions affect the plot." I'll go back to lurking now.

Crazy Aido said: But how easy is it going to be to make house rules based on the new system? Think of yourself as a game designer (because you are!) when looking at the rules. Obviously, FFG tweaked the rules all during the process of design just by changing some wording or the looks of some components. You should be able to do the same just as easily. Major changes will require drastic measures -- you might have to tack on lots of post-it notes or redesign some cards or use dice from a different system -- but this is the same thing that any game developer would do with their own game in order to make corrections.

jadrax said: There is always a Twin Tailed Comet in the sky before major wars. Buh. So maybe it's just before SoC.

Someone (wish I could remember who) said this game takes place before the Storm of Chaos. There's a twin-tailed comet in the sky. What if this game is set in the year 1998 or 1999 IC? What if Mordheim is still standing? Seems really unlikely to me, but what do you think?

Happy birthday Peacekeeper! Here's to ya!

Hellebore said: They will no doubt release enemy expansion boxes with whole armies of the various bad races. Spread out all of the creatures by threat level -- Little guys of all kinds in the first expansion. Middleweights in the second expansion. Bosses in the third. FFG pnwz you.

HELLEBORE wrote: Simply through the lack of variety you get with making it a dice pool system. Is that a fact?

Emirikol said: http://gallery.rptools.net/v/contrib/emirikol7/?g2_page=2 Image is broken. Just me?I'm looking at the career stuff on the back: General Career Advances -Action Card -Talent -Skill Training or (on?) Specialty -Wound Threshold -Open Career Advance -Open Career Advance -Open Career Advance -Open Career Advance -Open Career Advance -Open Career Advance Career Completion Advances -Career Transition(?) -Dedication Bonus Non-Career Advances [Nice!] -Advance Type -Advance Type Card Inventory -[Two blank lines] That last bit is interesting to me. There isn't a lot of space to write down your card inventory. Does that mean we won't have very many cards? Maybe they just ran out of room and they're expecting us to write really tiny. And look how far out you can go on stances! From your neutral spot, you can go six steps into Conservative or Reckless.

Yeah, skills are associated with a characteristic. WS is based on Strength, BS on Agility. Hellebore, what makes you think they'll all have the same stats? They could just give you 15 points to spread around, and use the career card's suggestions for primary characteristics. It's also possible that you just start off with some predetermined number in each of them. Maybe you roll for it -- roll ten dice, count the hammers. I haven't seen anything to tell us one way or another. I'd expect if the stats are always the same that they'd be printed on the career card. But maybe they're set by race.

I see the skills as: Athletics Ballistic Skill Coordination Intimidate Resilience Ride [That's not a word! Spelunking? Spelunkery? Something to do with Scale-sheer-surface? But that's probably covered by Athletics. Pfff. It's a long S word, but what? It's a physical skill so wouldn't be Skullduggery -- unless they mean it literally!] Stealth Weapon Skill Charm Discipline First Aid Folklore Guile Intuition Leadership Nature Lore Observation The most interesting thing about the character sheet is what's not on there -- height, weight, hair, eyes, handedness, distinguishing marks. However, these might be on cards -- just pull. Instant character. No different than rolling it randomly, which you would've done anyway. However, it might be fun to play for a while and invent your character's features as you go along. But there's something about it that makes me think the PCs as almost being totemic -- you're the Troll Slayer. Like there wouldn't be two the Troll Slayers in a party.

The careers may not work quite like we're used to. You'll see on the character sheet that there's a space for Current Career and then Career Rank. This sounds like it's borrowing ideas from Dark Heresy, when each Career Path is divided into a series of ranks (a.k.a. levels). So V3's Troll Slayer might have enough ranks within it that make it the equivalent of V2's Troll Slayer+Giant Slayer. If that's true, then 40 careers might be enough to cover the number of careers that we're used to in earlier editions. Also, having the Rat Catcher in a supplement is weird -- but there might be a good strategy behind it. If the core game includes middle-powered careers (Troll Slayer, Priest, Wizard), expansions might be where we get the extreme lows (Beggar, Rat Catcher) and extreme highs (Daemon Slayer, Battle Wizard). This makes some sense to me because not everybody picking up this game for the first time will be interested in the dregs or the superheroes. As long as you include a nice cross-section, you can explore the fringes later. But I'm only guessing.

Thanks for putting this online. I'm just going to hit the topics that concern me the most, if anybody wants to talk about them. Character Origins: There are fewer options for starting places in V3 than in earlier editions. (Earlier editions were limited as well, but not to this extent.) I suppose you'll have to house-rule some things if you want to start off with a character from anywhere else. (You had to do this with earlier editions, just not to this extent. And in V3 it may be as simple as saying, "Okay, you're from Karak Kadrin, then.") I also don't see any Imperial Dwarfs, but maybe I haven't kept current with canon. We may be getting a "narrow but deep slice" of the Warhammer setting here. I actually prefer this, and it's something that I knew we'd be looking at with a new edition. I would rather get one kind of really well-developed Dwarf character than have them be just short Humans with a few exclusive careers. In the previous editions we had more freedom to define our characters, but we may not have had this level of detail for them to start with. I'm crossing my fingers on this one. Funky Dice: I like the dice. I just can't read them! Right now it looks like a code that doesn't want to be broken. If I knew what the symbols meant, even if I didn't quite understand the rules that they refer to, they'd be a lot less intimidating. It also looks like a lot of dice to be rolling at one time -- and a slow process of resolving what's indicated by the symbols -- but the results might be worth it. Or it might be a lot quicker and simpler than I'm guessing.

That's a great question! I think what I really wanted would've been something very much like V3, only without all the cards and tokens and stuff. A book with all the same rules and info, just worked out so that we can use regular paper. (Maybe V3 supports that option?) Anyway, I'm used to paying about US$40-$50 for new core rulebooks. For really high-quality books (such as Dark Heresy) I'll meet them at $60. $100 is probably more than I'll pay without reading a few good reviews.

Ye Ancient One said: Wait, I can has Fimir? You can has Fimir and time machinez, but only because you're you.

Just for fun. For the entirety of the game line, you get to play humans and just one other race or creature. It can be anything in the setting: halflings, vampires, goblins, skaven, beastmen, Dark Elves, whatever.

It's about 3/4ths of the way down this page: www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_upcoming.asp With all the bits and parts, it probably takes a while to get everything sorted out. But whatever the game is going to be, it's too late to change it now!

DeathFromAbove, I think the part that's important is this: ynnen said: The twist that helps keep this Warhammer Fantasy is the fact that some of the characters know they are heroes (or like to believe they are) and rise to the occassion. Other characters have destiny forced down their throats and become de facto heroes simply by virtue of having the story focus on their actions. So not all PCs have to be "heroic". Ordinary people can be put in extraordinary circumstances -- which makes them heroes. It doesn't mean that the PCs will be able to fight off whole armies by themselves. I think with WFRP it's important to remember that the game gets much of flavor from the fact that the PCs are "of the people". They're just like anyone else. Even in your second or third career, your character is just like any other second- or third-career NPC. In the earlier editions, there are almost no rules that set PCs apart from NPCs -- except for Fate Points, Fortune Points, Shallya's Mercy (maybe), and the fact that they're at the center of the story. No matter how well they can fight or talk their way out of fight, the PCs are special -- they're heroes -- but only because they're the focus of the story. I hope that's something that's preserved in V3, and it sounds like it will be.

Just curious what you think or feel about the game now that we've had some time to let everything sink in. Here you're welcome to rant, rave or anything in between. I'm gonna just watch. But I'll start. I liked the idea of a new game system to begin with, and I still do. What about you?