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Frog Squad Remix


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#1 The_Brown_Bomber

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 09:54 PM

This is simlar to the Frog Squad that used the same ships, pilots and most of the same upgrades. What do you think?

Wedge Antilles(29) + R2 Astromech(1) + Expert Handling(2) =32pts

Luke Skywalker(28) + R2D2(4) + Shield Upgrade(4) + Draw Their Fire(1) =37pts

Biggs Darklighter(25) + R2F2(3) + Stealth Device(3) =31pts

Total =100pts

 

its pretty obvious how this squad works. Keeping Biggs slightly behind (but still within range 1) of Luke & Wedge will help his defense rolls early and hopefully keep that stealth device for a few attacks. Expert Handling could perhaps be Swarm (as it was in the original Frog Squad build) but i really like the unpredicatable ability Expert Handling gives wedge as well as letting him evade target locks from those pesky Slave 1s. R2 Astromech negates stress on wedge more efficiently and complements Expert Handling nicely.


"There will be a substantial reward for anyone who finds the Millenium Falcon. You are free to use whatever means necessary, but I want them alive. No disintegration!".

Lord Vader


#2 The_Brown_Bomber

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 11:01 PM

 

http://x-wing.voidst...9959/frog-squad @mrfroggies

 

original Frog Squad… uses stealth device on Wedge instead of R2F2 on Biggs… [Wedge also has Swarm tactics instead of Expert Handling].


"There will be a substantial reward for anyone who finds the Millenium Falcon. You are free to use whatever means necessary, but I want them alive. No disintegration!".

Lord Vader


#3 magadizer

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 02:41 AM

The original frog squad is a kick butt squad. I have only played it once at home, but it impressed me with it's balance of defensive and offensive strength. I would probably think to fly it more if I didn't love flying my Y-wings so much.

Regarding your modification, I would prefer the original due to the added protection Wedge receives once (if?) Biggs becomes one with the Force. Plus R2F2 is an action, and you probably do better with Focus to improve Biggs's offensive output while he is still around.


Be seeing you.

#4 ForceM

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 05:09 AM

Well i don't know if this is worse than the original. Stealth device on a 3 agility ship (Biggs with his droid) is much better than on Wedge. Also here, he has Expert handling, he takes stress barrel rolling but has R2 to help him out with it. Against ships that don't have 360 degrees barrel rolling is very helpful, especially when you have someone like Wedge who really has "shoot me" written on his forehead.

Where you are right is that in this build 2 out of 3 pilots won't get a focus very often which is a pity really. Also not having Biggs shoot at skill 9 hurts a bit, but not too much. Swarm tactics is not exactly the most important thing in this list.



#5 The_Brown_Bomber

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 09:15 AM

ForceM said:

 

Well i don't know if this is worse than the original. Stealth device on a 3 agility ship (Biggs with his droid) is much better than on Wedge. Also here, he has Expert handling, he takes stress barrel rolling but has R2 to help him out with it. Against ships that don't have 360 degrees barrel rolling is very helpful, especially when you have someone like Wedge who really has "shoot me" written on his forehead.

Where you are right is that in this build 2 out of 3 pilots won't get a focus very often which is a pity really. Also not having Biggs shoot at skill 9 hurts a bit, but not too much. Swarm tactics is not exactly the most important thing in this list.

 

 

i guess im relying on my flying skills to keep wedge out of trouble instead of the luck of the dice by removing stealth device from him in favour of R2F2 on Biggs. I'll let you know how it plays out but Expert Handling could be very good against any squad that relies heavily on target locks.

Actually i think focus is possible with both wedge and luke, except the odd time wedge opts to barrel roll. im not expecting to need that very often but this depends on how the game plays out, barrel rolling is always more of a surprise when u use it sparingly, like when you are in behind their front line or trying to turn out of a lesser pilots firing arc. Dont be caught up in the fact that i cant roll and focus at the same time as i have the choice to do either, depending on what is best at the time.

I agree my Biggs may lose something by not focusing, reflecting on your comment i think id rather have a focus icon on him for defense than an extra defense dice but will c how this plays out. might switch it back to stealth device on wedge, let u know how my testing. i think that R2F2 will work better against swarms and focus is better against smaller squads where i might want to use focus more and R2F2 less. (that focus icon might get used up on defense b4 bigs fires anyway? which takes away from his offense my point being focus can only be used once whereas R2F2 helps versus ALL attacks that round.


"There will be a substantial reward for anyone who finds the Millenium Falcon. You are free to use whatever means necessary, but I want them alive. No disintegration!".

Lord Vader


#6 mrfroggies

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 10:13 AM

I'm glad you like my list, and it's great to see variations.  Expert handling is a nice option for Wedge, and like you said works great with the r2 unit.  I really like the stealth device over R2-F2.  I hate giving up a focus action for extra defense.  I think the math suppprts that 2 defense plus focus is better then 3 defense.  However, if you get good results with your vrsion, I say keep playing it.  I know I've had several games where swarm tacitics played no part, and it made me feel like I wasted points.  I've also tried Elusiveness with Wedge, and that's worked out pretty well.



#7 The_Brown_Bomber

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 11:21 AM

mrfroggies said:

I'm glad you like my list, and it's great to see variations.  Expert handling is a nice option for Wedge, and like you said works great with the r2 unit.  I really like the stealth device over R2-F2.  I hate giving up a focus action for extra defense.  I think the math suppprts that 2 defense plus focus is better then 3 defense.  However, if you get good results with your vrsion, I say keep playing it.  I know I've had several games where swarm tacitics played no part, and it made me feel like I wasted points.  I've also tried Elusiveness with Wedge, and that's worked out pretty well.

hey MrFroggies. thanx for your advice. ill try out my version this wknd and see how it plays. i suspect im going to miss that focus action on Biggs… already thinking of alternate options… will stick to my guns for now :) i loved ur list when i saw it. iv always loved playing straight x-wings… i ran 4 in my kessel run event last yr and placed 3rd, narrowly missing out on the playoff for 1st… vader swarm just pipped me but it was very close.


"There will be a substantial reward for anyone who finds the Millenium Falcon. You are free to use whatever means necessary, but I want them alive. No disintegration!".

Lord Vader


#8 ForceM

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 09:55 PM

 

mrfroggies said:

I'm glad you like my list, and it's great to see variations.  Expert handling is a nice option for Wedge, and like you said works great with the r2 unit.  I really like the stealth device over R2-F2.  I hate giving up a focus action for extra defense.  I think the math suppprts that 2 defense plus focus is better then 3 defense.  However, if you get good results with your vrsion, I say keep playing it.  I know I've had several games where swarm tacitics played no part, and it made me feel like I wasted points.  I've also tried Elusiveness with Wedge, and that's worked out pretty well.

Well if 2 agility plus focus is better than 3 without focus let's make it 4 with focus shall we? WIth the following list we get Biggs to a frustrating level of resilience, and still get focus on all 3 ships, while also gettting Wedge to 3 shields wth R2D2, and Garven to 3 shields. This list is taking all of the defense while sacrificing none of the offense. We also get a lot more mileage out of Swarm tactics here since Wedge can make Garven shoot first and give him his focus after biggs is dead. I don't know if we can still call it a Frog squad variant since i changed out a pilot obviously.

There is some stuff that it lacks compared to original Frog squad though, namely Luke's elite slot and draw their fire, and his better pilot skill, plus his nice defensive pilot skill. Things to be discussed are also if we are not better off giving Garven Stealth device and R2 instead of a shield upgrade (although stealth device is not worth it on X-Wings if they are not Biggs if you ask me, i'd rather take the plain additional hitpoint instead of a gamble), or just give Wedge an extra proton torp so he can oneshot Ties easier…

Total Squad Points: 100

Pilot: Biggs Darklighter
X-Wing (25)
Upgrades:

  • R2-F2 (3)
  • Stealth (3)



Pilot: Garven Dreis
X-Wing (26)
Upgrades:
  • Shield Upgrade (4)



Pilot: Wedge Antilles
X-Wing (29)
Upgrades:
  • Swarm Tactics (2)
  • R2-D2 (4)
  • Shield Upgrade (4)

 

 



#9 ForceM

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 09:56 PM

Well idk what happened to my last post, all i did is copy in a list… But at long as we can read everything i hope that's okay!



#10 The_Brown_Bomber

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Posted 26 May 2013 - 08:35 PM

The_Brown_Bomber said:

This is simlar to the Frog Squad that used the same ships, pilots and most of the same upgrades. What do you think?

Wedge Antilles(29) + R2 Astromech(1) + Expert Handling(2) =32pts

Luke Skywalker(28) + R2D2(4) + Shield Upgrade(4) + Draw Their Fire(1) =37pts

Biggs Darklighter(25) + R2F2(3) + Stealth Device(3) =31pts

Total =100pts

 

its pretty obvious how this squad works. Keeping Biggs slightly behind (but still within range 1) of Luke & Wedge will help his defense rolls early and hopefully keep that stealth device for a few attacks. Expert Handling could perhaps be Swarm (as it was in the original Frog Squad build) but i really like the unpredicatable ability Expert Handling gives wedge as well as letting him evade target locks from those pesky Slave 1s. R2 Astromech negates stress on wedge more efficiently and complements Expert Handling nicely.

 

i played the list above yesterday and it performed quite well, narrowly beating a 5 ship imperial swarm.

biggs did not last as long as id hoped but he did his job i guess by drawing all attacks to him in the 1st few turns. sadly i dont think that R2F2 made a significant difference :(

i felt the expert handling on wedge worked well, but i did miss his focus action 1-2 turns which as mentioned by someone here would reduce his attacking power so that was a definite tradeoff. im thinking of making room for PTL on wedge and see how that goes ( i think this might work better than swarm tactics and has good synergy with R2 astromech.

thinking of this revamped list…

 

Wedge Antilles(29) + R2 Astromech(1) + Push The Limit(3) =33pts

Luke Skywalker(28) + R2D2(4) + Shield Upgrade(4) + Draw Their Fire(1) =37pts

Biggs Darklighter(25) + Stealth Device(3) =28pts

98 points… wonder if i should upgrade that r2 astromech on wedge for r2f2? (he would wear stress alot but benefit from the extra agility diec on defense… or drop the r2 astromech altogether in favour of a stealth device?   …worth testing i think).


"There will be a substantial reward for anyone who finds the Millenium Falcon. You are free to use whatever means necessary, but I want them alive. No disintegration!".

Lord Vader





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