Jump to content



Photo

Needing to find rules regarding the Pre Heresy Chapters


  • Please log in to reply
13 replies to this topic

#1 LuciusMacharius

LuciusMacharius

    Member

  • Members
  • 23 posts

Posted 06 May 2013 - 03:25 PM

I have been talking with my friends and they have become interested in having a pre heresy campaign.  However, there are no exactly rules for the chapters that had turned heretic.  I know there was a fanmade one online, but I cannot seem to find it.   It encompasses all the various chapters and their squad mode abilities.  Does anyone have suggestions/links?



#2 Hrathen

Hrathen

    Member

  • Members
  • 1,348 posts

Posted 07 May 2013 - 08:46 AM

There aren't any rules for pre-heresy, at least not any DW rules.  There are some rules for 40k TT.  I would use it as an oppertunity to come up with your own stuff.  It could be really fun to stretch your creativity muscles. 

I would point out that it has been 10,000 since the heresy.  10,000 years ago.  To put that in perspective the Sumerrians were inventing writing only 6,000 years ago.

The world of 40K has a pretty messed up view of history.  Accoriding to everything you will read about the heresy, things looked very similar to how they look in the 41st Mil.  But you could totally change that.  The Herresy is more like a myth then it is history.  Think of what we know about the heresy like historical events from the Bible.  The events of the heresy as we understand them probably have more cultural/religious significance than exact historical accuracy.

Yes, the Empire has been pretty stagnent, but 10,000 years is longer than current human history.

Have some fun with it.  I would play off what your player know (or think they know) about the herresy and change things.  I have heard so many ideas about how things might have "really" happened as apposed to what every citezen of the Empire know what happened.

On intreeging example was the idea that the Emperor lost the fight with Horus, but Horus's armies lost.  So after the fight Horus got locked in the Golden Throne.

 

 

Other things to consider.  There is no Death Watch pre-heresy.  There is no Inquisition.  There is a warp and chaos, but it is lurking in the shadows.  In the Horus Heresy books they treat creatures fromteh warp as simply Xenos from anther dimension.  They even denied the exsistence of chaos (or any) gods and daemons.


Putting an end to this distructive conflict and bringing order to the galaxy.

#3 eldath

eldath

    Member

  • Members
  • 168 posts

Posted 14 May 2013 - 12:48 AM

LuciusMacharius said:

 

I have been talking with my friends and they have become interested in having a pre heresy campaign.  However, there are no exactly rules for the chapters that had turned heretic.  I know there was a fanmade one online, but I cannot seem to find it.   It encompasses all the various chapters and their squad mode abilities.  Does anyone have suggestions/links?

 

 

Pre-Heresy there were only the 18 Legions (originally 20 but the fate of the missing two is unknown), the chapters were pretty much 1000 man regiments of the parent Legion. Available Pre-Heresy Space Marine Legions are:

1 - Dark Angels (Loyalist), 2 - Emperor's Children (Traitor), Iron Warriors (Traitor), White Scars (Loyalist), Space Wolves (Loyalist), Imperial Fists (Loyalist), Night Lords (Traitor), Blood Angels (Loyalist), Imperial Fists (Loyalist), World Eaters/Originally War Hounds (Traitor), Ultramarines (Loyalist), Death Guard/Originally Dusk Raiders (Traitor), Thousand Sons (Traitor), Sons of Horus/originally Luna Wolves (Traitor), Word Bearers/Originally Imperial Heralds (Traitor), Salamanders (Loyalist), Raven Guard (Loyalist) and lastly Alpha Legion (Traitor, or possibly not dependant on which fluff you have read).

You will notice that several Legions chanced their names, this was in each case once the Primarch had been located and were mostly done by the Primarch. The one exception is the Sons of Horus who changed their names after the Emperor offered Horus the prospect which he originally refused.

The 2nd and 11th Legions are missing even before the Heresy, though there is nothing stopping you from coming up with your own answers as to what happened, where they went and why no-one will talk about them even the Primarchs.

I don't know of a fanmade sourcebook but one suggestion I found was:

Luna Wolves = Space Wolves (minus some of their wolfy traits) for their personal glory
World Eaters = Black Templars for their close combat orientation and psyker hatred
Death Guard = either Iron Hands or Salamanders either for their resilence
Thousand Sons = Dark Angels for their secrecy
Emperor's Children = Storm Wardens (FFG's own creation) for their meticulous nature and focus on personal duals
Iron Warriors = Imperial Fists for their siege warfare style
Word Bearers = Ultramarines for their devotion to an idea
Night Lords = Raven Guard for their guerrilla warfare style
Alpha Legion = Dark Angels for their secrecy
 

As Hrathen says, the Deathwatch itself did not exist until post the Heresy, so you would need to either ignore that part of canon or have the group be part of another organisation. The most likely thing would be to have the characters all members of the same Legion, or have the Warmaster/Emperor group them into a special mixed squad to handle an unusual mission.

Hope this helped.

Eldath



#4 Gurkhal

Gurkhal

    Member

  • Members
  • 1,024 posts

Posted 14 May 2013 - 05:36 AM

I think that I know what the TS is looking for and in the name of the Emperor I shall provide it for you. 

 

https://docs.google....dit?usp=sharing

 

Praise the Emperor and hallow be His name!



#5 UncleArkie

UncleArkie

    Member

  • Members
  • 594 posts

Posted 15 May 2013 - 12:06 PM

Tome of Blood etc for Black Crusade has traitor chapters in them, only a matter of rewriting it a little (it's a better rule system as well).



#6 Brother Anselm

Brother Anselm

    Member

  • Members
  • 112 posts

Posted 15 May 2013 - 12:07 PM

Gurkhal said:

I think that I know what the TS is looking for and in the name of the Emperor I shall provide it for you. 

 

https://docs.google....dit?usp=sharing

 

Praise the Emperor and hallow be His name!

 

At first glance that is an amazing piece of work, well done.



#7 Brother Orpheo

Brother Orpheo

    Member

  • Members
  • 539 posts

Posted 16 May 2013 - 04:16 AM

Deathwatch could be used to represent something similar to Garro and his fellow defectors. A relative few Loyalists from within various Traitor Legions, all with different methods and ideologies, having to learn how to adapt to each Battle-Brother's personality and warfare strategos (war ethos). I would imagine it harder in the time of the Heresy, as the Primarchs are actually still alive, and their aura of magnificance, their psychic imprint on these defectors would be greater, for better or for worse. Simply remove all anti Xenos-specific benefits, perhaps replacing them with "Traitor" Legion specific benefits.

Alternatively, Legions known for their arduous clashes with Xenos (such as the Blood Angels) might keep these anti Xeno-specific Skills and Talents, while others, such as the Death Guard or Emperor's Children, instead have cold spots in their twin hearts for their traitorous brothers. 


=][=


#8 Gurkhal

Gurkhal

    Member

  • Members
  • 1,024 posts

Posted 17 May 2013 - 12:15 AM

Brother Anselm said:

Gurkhal said:

 

I think that I know what the TS is looking for and in the name of the Emperor I shall provide it for you. 

 

https://docs.google....dit?usp=sharing

 

Praise the Emperor and hallow be His name!

 

 

 

At first glance that is an amazing piece of work, well done.

 

Well, I didn't make it so I can't take credit but I'm happpy you like it.



#9 Cynr

Cynr

    Member

  • Members
  • 143 posts

Posted 19 May 2013 - 12:30 PM

Forge World released Horus Heresy: Betrayal… a beautiful book (expensive) that is basically a codex and fluff for The Sons of Horus, Death Guard, World Eaters and Emperor's Children.  Using it would be like using any other 40k codex and doing the conversion work yourself.

-Cynr



#10 Amroth

Amroth

    Member

  • Members
  • 181 posts

Posted 04 June 2013 - 07:20 PM

A simple way to do it could be to use the create your own chapter rules of Deathwatch Rites of Battle. Use the rules to make the traitor chapters as you think they would have been before the fall and as GM you can modify them slightly if nothing exactly fits your vision.



#11 Decessor

Decessor

    Member

  • Members
  • 956 posts

Posted 06 June 2013 - 12:30 AM

There are some Legions written up for the Dornian Heresy alternate timeline, where the Loyalists and Traitors are swapped.

http://www.fantasyfl...46&efidt=623530



#12 Cardinal Nicodemus

Cardinal Nicodemus

    Member

  • Members
  • 79 posts

Posted 10 June 2013 - 10:00 PM

Gurkhal said:

I think that I know what the TS is looking for and in the name of the Emperor I shall provide it for you. 

 

https://docs.google....dit?usp=sharing

 

Praise the Emperor and hallow be His name!

 

This…this is GLORIUS! All I needed to run a proper PBF game :)

Question: I see there are rules for all the Traitors and there are proposed skill and talent swaps. My question is regarding Dark Angels who have a lot of Forbidden Lore Skills concerning things that do not exist during the Heresy timeline. What would some of you swap their Forbidden Lore (Adeptus Astartes), (Inquisition) and (Traitor Legions) ?



#13 Vorenus

Vorenus

    Member

  • Members
  • 16 posts

Posted 20 July 2013 - 11:21 PM

Great document on preheresy legions.  Has anyone created a preheresy character sheet?



#14 Korvis

Korvis

    Member

  • Members
  • 114 posts

Posted 21 July 2013 - 01:23 AM

The Apocryphon Conclave didn't occur until after the Heresey.  Deathwatch did not exist prior to the Conclave in any way, shape or form.  It was due to the events of the Heresey that the Primarchs met at the Conclave and swore the original, and ancient, Oath.  The Inquisition was formed about the same time and the 3 Ordos within were established to prosecute their specific missions; Malleus, Hereticus, and Xenos.  There was NO Deathwatch Pre-Heresey.






© 2013 Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc. Fantasy Flight Games and the FFG logo are ® of Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc.  All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Contact | User Support | Rules Questions | Help | RSS