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Spell Recall vs. Scribe


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#1 allawi

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Posted 30 April 2013 - 07:06 AM

Hi, 

This situation occured last night.

  • Player A: Spellcycler with 2 spells & Scribe follower.
  • Player B: Spellcycler with Spell Recall spell.

So Player A cast a spell, immediately player B cast Spell Recall to pick up that spell but Player A then used Scribe to take back the initial spell and discard another spell from his hand.

Now an argument started about how to play this. Player B argues that his Spell Recall works to pick up the initial spell, but Player A argues that Spell Recall would allow player B to pick up the discarded spell from the Scribe.

How do we play this by the rules.

Regards

Allawi



#2 The_Warlock

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 05:44 AM

allawi said:

Hi, 

This situation occured last night.

  • Player A: Spellcycler with 2 spells & Scribe follower.
  • Player B: Spellcycler with Spell Recall spell.

So Player A cast a spell, immediately player B cast Spell Recall to pick up that spell but Player A then used Scribe to take back the initial spell and discard another spell from his hand.

Now an argument started about how to play this. Player B argues that his Spell Recall works to pick up the initial spell, but Player A argues that Spell Recall would allow player B to pick up the discarded spell from the Scribe.

How do we play this by the rules.

Thanks for pointing this out. It's not an easy situation.

Player B can assume he may use Spell Call if he played it right after Player A cast his Spell. Since Player B declared his action first, he can take the Spell INSTEAD of placing it on the discard pile. The Scribe can't retroactively change this, because he puts another Spell on the discard pile instead of the original one and this has no impact on the Spell Call, because it acts on the cast Spell, not on the Spell which goes to the discard pile.The Scribe can't be used at all if Spell Call is cast first.

What bothers me is the other case: if Player A says he wants to use the Scribe to discard another Spell, Player B might think he's able to take the original Spell in any case, because it acts on a Spell just cast. The only counterargument I can find is that Spell Call should be cast on a Spell JUST CAST; if any effect is triggered after casting, the correct timing for Spell Call is lost and the Spell cannot be used anymore.

Basically, it's a situation where "who yells first, wins".



#3 Tiggurix

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Posted 13 May 2013 - 06:54 PM

I would say that spell call takes precedence; after all, the spell was just cast, while the other spell was only discarded. In fact, I would say that the player who used spell call would get the spell that was just cast, but the player who used the Scribe would still have to discard a spell. After all, the scribe is more than powerful enough as is, and this would be one of the few ways to stop the broken combos that she enables.



#4 allawi

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 03:50 AM

Thanks for the answers guys!

 

best regards

 



#5 frogemoth

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 07:33 AM

We removed the Scribe follower as we felt it is too powerful, first game we played the sprite got this card right at the start and one of his spells was Temporal Warp so he then started playing by himself since we couldn't play anymore.

He lost his spells because of the Magical Vortex but by that time he was already too powerful.



#6 Msrushing

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 07:52 AM

This happened to our game last week.  The Scribe being played with a spell book and a acquisition sell so it was not possible for me to have any items including a talisman needed to win the game....

 

I cant decide if im going to take the card out or house rule that the scribe discards after being used, which i think was how she should have been designed in the first place....



#7 talismanamsilat

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 10:08 AM

Blame the developers, they should have known it would be too strong!



#8 Artaterxes

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 09:35 PM

Warlock + Temporal Warp + Scribe = Solo game?

#9 Uvatha

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Posted 04 September 2014 - 10:20 PM

Warlock + Temporal Warp + Scribe = Solo game?

Once per round can't do other players have not missed any turns or had turns. Temporal Warp just gives you 3 turns it doesn't give you 3 rounds.

 

Yep just read the cards myself Spell Call trumps Scribe, Spell Call is casted straight after a spell is cast once cast Spell Calls effects cannot change unless countered. So Spell Call is much like a counter but does not counter the spell.

 

So there you go a counter for the Scribe :).



#10 0beron

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Posted 05 September 2014 - 06:57 PM

Obviously 'intent' has a lot to do with how factors are handled in the game. 

 

My wife and I are not incredibly competitive in this manner (but ask me about the last one over last weekend; I did demolish her!) but both of us have had the Scribe and used reasonably well, without making play too annoying for each other.

 

With that, I agree that the Spell Call or any other such factor would temper the Scribe's ability. 

 

My personal reason for not wanting to remove any components because of overpowering, is because there are always factors that can mix it up. The Randomness if you will.

 

And I think Doma said it, that there are cards that have not been played/discovered, because we too use the full shebang set with the 500 or more Adventure cards.  Each game, anything can happen.

 

In all our games (we're not playing as often as most seem to), the Scribe has only been a follower to us, a total of 3 or 4 times.

 

Also, we completely cycle through the characters, so characters like the Alchemist, also deemed a game-breaker, only happens once in whatever amount of games it would take for the two of us to go through all characters.

 

So there are ways to temper effects, per that idea or perhaps other things. 



#11 Uvatha

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Posted 07 September 2014 - 10:25 PM

I don't think its has anything to do with 'intent'. Its a timing issue, unless you mean its the intent of the designers and even then I think its more than the designers 'intent' I think its the way Talisman is played.. Plain and simple.. Intent leaves dought I don't see any dought..


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