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#1 Boaventura

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 01:36 PM

Greetings, I'm rather new onto the Warhammer Rpg Scenario, just got my first books as a gift from a friend, and I'm currently reading in hopes of GMing my first Warhammer Rogue Trader adventure for them.

My first question is. Bows are rather useless.

Please don't kill me! Allow me to explain! Bows are silent, yes, intended to kill unarmored targets in a stealthy manner, yes. But, what if one of the players in my table ask for arrows with the Mono upgrade? Costly, yes, but they're rogue traders! So would it be possible to have monofilament arrows for a bow, in order to make it lose it's 'primitive' quality?

Second question. Shields are Useless.

How to make them useful? The book is dismissive with shields, you can attack with them receiving a penalty, and they're slightly better to parry. But so do power swords or any other melee weapon with certain qualities. How to make them useful inside the rules?

Third, power weapons. Specifically, what if I want to make a power mace, or a heavy power maul A la "Space marine" (the game?) what specifically a weapon gains in it's "power" version?

Speaking of Space marine… Since I live overseas (and english is a second language, forgive my grammar mistakes please), it's quite hard to get a grasp on Warhammer material. I've only got in contact with Warhammer through the first Dawn of War games and most recently Space Marine, and therefore I only have these games as references. So, how would I describe a Melta blast? Space marine has it as a halo of superheated air, while Dawn of War is a stream of fire. Are bolters recoiless (due it's ammunition being gyro-rockets) or they do have a recoil? Where do I find stats for Tau weapons and armor (including the human-adapted ones)? And can a person wield and manipulate things (albeith awkwardly and with some troubles) while using a powerfist?



#2 eBarbarossa

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 12:44 AM

Boaventura said:

Greetings, I'm rather new onto the Warhammer Rpg Scenario, just got my first books as a gift from a friend, and I'm currently reading in hopes of GMing my first Warhammer Rogue Trader adventure for them.

My first question is. Bows are rather useless.

Please don't kill me! Allow me to explain! Bows are silent, yes, intended to kill unarmored targets in a stealthy manner, yes. But, what if one of the players in my table ask for arrows with the Mono upgrade? Costly, yes, but they're rogue traders! So would it be possible to have monofilament arrows for a bow, in order to make it lose it's 'primitive' quality?

Second question. Shields are Useless.

How to make them useful? The book is dismissive with shields, you can attack with them receiving a penalty, and they're slightly better to parry. But so do power swords or any other melee weapon with certain qualities. How to make them useful inside the rules?

Third, power weapons. Specifically, what if I want to make a power mace, or a heavy power maul A la "Space marine" (the game?) what specifically a weapon gains in it's "power" version?

Speaking of Space marine… Since I live overseas (and english is a second language, forgive my grammar mistakes please), it's quite hard to get a grasp on Warhammer material. I've only got in contact with Warhammer through the first Dawn of War games and most recently Space Marine, and therefore I only have these games as references. So, how would I describe a Melta blast? Space marine has it as a halo of superheated air, while Dawn of War is a stream of fire. Are bolters recoiless (due it's ammunition being gyro-rockets) or they do have a recoil? Where do I find stats for Tau weapons and armor (including the human-adapted ones)? And can a person wield and manipulate things (albeith awkwardly and with some troubles) while using a powerfist?

 

Well yes, bows are usually useless. Almost every gun has more punch and can shoot faster, and that's okay. Look at the real world; is there anyone using bows for actually killing people? Only those who REALLY like their bows or those who can't get their hands on a gun. It's just primitive tech intended to be used by primitive feral worlders. Even the silent killing is done just as good with a silencer.

That being said, if one of your players wants to have mono arrows, let him. They have the money and the connections to get that done, so just allow it. I doubt it'll be a game breaker.

 

Shield is the same thing. It's an outdated concept brought in against superior technology. No wooden or metal shield is going to stand up against a Power Sword. If you want shields, go for the storm shields from Deathwatch.

Power Mauls and Maces might already exist in some book or other. Check the thread "40kRP armory". It'll link you to an excel file that contains almost every piece of gear ever published. If a power mace exists, it's probably in there. Failing that, you can always extrapolate stats by comparing the changes from normal sword to power sword and apply that to a mace.

Bolters (in my game) are almost recoilless. They are propelled out of the gun by a very small charge and then ignite their own rockets. Since they were made for fighting in space, this should make sense.

I think I saw rules for wielding stuff with a power fist once. Might have been in Deathwatch. I THINK it was -20 to everything, as long as the fist was deactivated. When it's active it should pretty much destroy everything you touch. No fine manipulation, too.

 

I hope that was helpful!



#3 SirFrog

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 04:28 AM

Much like was stated above, shields and bows are concepts of old. You could, with some cleverness and possibly some heretek, have an arrow with some weird and wonderful stuff on it like the microgrenades from Hostile Aquisitions or toxins, or whatever. Much like rocket launchers, only your imagination is the limit of all the wonderful ways you purge the heretic.

Shields are kind of crap, indeed.

For blunt power weapons, look at the Power Maul in the Corebook, and the Thunder Hammer in Into the Storm, both are nice.

Melta blasts are described as retina-burning blasts of superheated submolecular bolts. In other words, if you're the one firing, close your eyes. Same goes with plasma weaponry, although less eyesearing and more blinding. They shoot small, uncontrolled fusion reactions. That's bound to glow a lot.

I also think some Deathwatch book has stats for Tau gear, although pulse weaponry is in Into the Storm as well. Pretty much one of the best kinds of weapons as well, you can't go wrong with Pulse weaponry.

But check out the 40k RP Armoury for further stats, it's right here on the forum.



#4 Iku Rex

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 06:17 AM

 

Shields are not useless! They provide a cheap +15 bonus to Parry, as well as additional armor. Note that you can parry with the shield in your secondary hand (with no penalty) even if you're wielding a proper weapon in your main hand. If you want a more advanced shield, take a look at the Suppression Shield from Into the Storm.



For bows, the Core Rulebook has Explosive Arrows that remove the Primitive Quality. (Also, the Composite Bow from the Dark Heresy supplement Inquisitor's Handbook is Accurate, making it a lot more useful.) Bows are still not great, which makes sense really, since the 40K universe has these newfangled things called "guns" that generally work a lot better.

 



#5 Lord Steel

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Posted 27 March 2013 - 08:44 PM

Well as one GM to another I will handle the setting question first. Rule Primus here is GO BIG and DISCRIPTIVE, the melta gun doesn't just shoot a super heated plasma blast. It fires a blinding colume of armor melting rightousness, A flamer doesn't spray a cone of fire, it unleashes the Emperors Judgement wrote in Flame! That isn't just some ruined city on the edge of the Verse, It is a fallen Hive, wrapped in the sins of its killers under a blood read sky with a Titan (I.E. BIG mech thing) NAILED TO THE SIDE OF A FACTORY THE SIZE OF DETROIT!

What i am trying to get at here is that you don't need to know the setting very well if you use your imagination and think to your self "What do my Players expect to see?" Still for a informative (and vulgar, and INSANE) look at the World of 40k I would recommed going to 1d4chan as they tend to have a rather large collection of lore (and vulgarity )

Now as for Bows and Shields, Presented in book yeah they are a little on the fluff side, nice little detai for a player not so much function, unless they are SNEAKY gits which all players are…DON'T LET EM FOOL YA OTHER WISE! Rule Secondus there. Much like the million and 2 uses for a 10 foot poll Inventive players can reek all sorts of havok with mundane items. heh a little grease, a few tube charges, a shield, and a incline can equal to a big mess.

Whats more they don't have to STAY MUNDANE, Shield + Powerfield = Power Shield, cheaper then a force Shield able to deflect that incoming power wrench the ork mek is swinging, Or Shield + Power Field + Combi weapon (Combi weapons are found in Into the Storm I think, basically meld two weapons together for twice the fun! and cost) Flamer and get a shield that can deflect plasma blasts and spew FIRE! Same thing with the bow, they gave ya all those options in the armory for a reason young GM.

Two more Rules afor I go

Rule Three…ius Never Stat out your plot relevent NPC till the part where they are suppose to be beatable, if they don't have stats you have a good reason to say they survive till next time.

Rule Zero, Have FUN! If the rules in the book (or here) get in they way of what you and your players want to do, chuck em and hammer in something that make sence to you. In the end you and your players are here to enjoy your selves. 



#6 Boaventura

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 01:05 PM

Cursed be this thing called "technology"! If the Most and Only Holy Emperor didn't wanted us to stop eating our food raw and kill our enemies with our bare teeth, he wouldn't have invented the power armor!

… Wait…

But thanks for the help! The players from my last group usually liked to go either on the munchkin route, or when they got tired of munchkin…king, they often went on the exotic route… mixed with more munchking, so while I'm preparing a new group (My previous group doesn't like elaborated descriptions… nor Warhammer… heretics!) I've developed a perk of trying to get ready to the worse scenario.



#7 jabberwoky

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Posted 30 July 2013 - 08:13 PM

Whats more they don't have to STAY MUNDANE, Shield + Powerfield = Power Shield, cheaper then a force Shield able to deflect that incoming power wrench the ork mek is swinging

Edit: Thread necomancy, my apologies.

 

How exactly does one place a power field on a shield?


Edited by jabberwoky, 30 July 2013 - 08:14 PM.


#8 Nameless2all

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Posted 30 July 2013 - 09:12 PM

Edit: Thread necomancy, my apologies.

 

How exactly does one place a power field on a shield?

 

It's called a Storm Shield in DW.  But all in all, it would be a houserule to have one not be Astartes designed unless I missed it in a book somewhere for normal human use.  I totally agree with this though because before SM's were running around, regular joes had to have had the same (or similar) weapons and armor for them to extrapolate from, pre-heresy wise.  So the design is out there, just lost somewhere.....   :(   But that is just MOI.


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#9 Errant

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Posted 30 July 2013 - 09:17 PM

Yeah, you're looking for combat or storm shields. They combine the same general tech as a power-weapon to generate a force-field around the shield itself. The inquisitorial crusader henchmen in the grey knights codex are able to use storm shields, so I assume the issue with providing them to regular people is rarity rather than incompatibility. Theirs are full tower shields though.



#10 Erathia

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Posted 30 July 2013 - 09:48 PM

It's important to note that under Rogue Trader rules, Power Weapons will only get their chance to disintegrate a weapon when the power weapon is used in the parry attempt. A non-power weapon parrying a power weapon does not have a chance to be disintegrated. No this doesn't make sense, and yes it was changed from Black Crusade onwards, but them's the rules as written!

 

You could also roll up a Relic Shield from Stars of Inequity that could gain the Power Field, or possibly the Indestructible trait f you want to rule that could resist a Power Field. Alternatively every Rogue Trader eventually gets the urge to visit a Mekboy and have it upgrade their gear, so that could be another way to get Power Fields on your weapon.


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