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Range ruler question…


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#1 SpectreSix

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 11:33 AM

I played a small game with someone, and I had my X-wing in range of a TIE Fighter and it was somehow in the middle of the 1-2 range.

 

I provided an example diagram to below show what I mean.

 

http://i46.tinypic.com/2qakejb.jpg

Now would Luke get the +1 Attack dice bonus from Night Beast being in Range one, or not because he's in part of Range two?

 

 


Spectre Leader, standing by.


#2 Hujoe Bigs

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 11:39 AM

He is within range 1, so bonus would be applied.

Rebels: 4 X-wings, 2-Y-Wings, 3 A-Wings, 3 E-wings, 4 Z-95s, 1 YT-1300, 2 B-Wings, 2 HWK-290, 1 CR90, 1 GR-75 

Imperials: 5 Tie/Ln, 1 Tie/Adv, 7 Tie/In, 2 Tie/Sa, 2 Tie/D, 3 Phantoms, 1 FireSpray, 2 Lambda


#3 Emrico

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 11:43 AM

SpectreSix said:

I played a small game with someone, and I had my X-wing in range of a TIE Fighter and it was somehow in the middle of the 1-2 range.

 

I provided an example diagram to below show what I mean.

 

http://i46.tinypic.com/2qakejb.jpg

Now would Luke get the +1 Attack dice bonus from Night Beast being in Range one, or not because he's in part of Range two?

 

 

In your diagram, you are actually measuring the range improperly (if you positioned the range ruler in game as it is shown in the diagram).  Range is measured from the closest points of the ships bases, within the firing arc.  So the question you pose should not even come up.  In your diagram, properly measuring would be the closest point of Luke's base (upper right corner) to the closest point of Night Beast's base (bottom left corner).  If that closest point falls in the Range 1 band, that is all that matters.  

Jim


Rebels: 3 YT-1300s, 6 X-Wings, 6 Y-Wings, 6 A-Wings, 6 B-Wings, 4 HWK-290s,10 Z-95s, 3 E-Wings, 2 GR-75s, 1 CR-90
Imperials: 8 TIEs, 4 TIE Adv, 12 TIE Interceptors, 3 Firesprays, 6 TIE Bombers, 5 Lambdas, 3 TIE Defenders, 4 Phantoms

#4 SpectreSix

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 12:07 PM

Emrico said:

SpectreSix said:

 

I played a small game with someone, and I had my X-wing in range of a TIE Fighter and it was somehow in the middle of the 1-2 range.

 

I provided an example diagram to below show what I mean.

 

http://i46.tinypic.com/2qakejb.jpg

Now would Luke get the +1 Attack dice bonus from Night Beast being in Range one, or not because he's in part of Range two?

 

 

 

 

In your diagram, you are actually measuring the range improperly (if you positioned the range ruler in game as it is shown in the diagram).  Range is measured from the closest points of the ships bases, within the firing arc.  So the question you pose should not even come up.  In your diagram, properly measuring would be the closest point of Luke's base (upper right corner) to the closest point of Night Beast's base (bottom left corner).  If that closest point falls in the Range 1 band, that is all that matters.  

Jim

 

Yeah I screwed up the diagram… it was from the base, like in the rules, but Night Beast was right on the 1/2 border. I should probably give that person a rematch since the bonus wasn't applied.


Spectre Leader, standing by.


#5 Sergovan

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 10:53 PM

I have had the same scenario come up before. I measured point to point from base to base and the range ruller was on the line.

 

Luckily I was able to negotiate with the player and we agreed that it was range 1. However, if they did not believe that it was, I would have used Resolving Rules Disputes on p.13. It would then come down to a roll off.

But you may have a good rules question there. What if the measurement is on the line? One side will argue lower (the attacker) and one side will rule higher (the defender). Who's right?

Will the FAQ one day say that ties go to the defender? [and that pun was intentional :)]


Rebels: 5 X-Wing, 4 Y-Wing, 6 A-Wing, 2 Yt-1300, 5 B-wing, 3 HWK-290, 3 Z-95, 1 E-wing, 1 CR 75

Empire: 6 Tie Fighters, 6 Tie Interceptors (1- 181st, 1- RG), 2 Tie Advanced, 2 Firesprays, 4 Tie Bombers,

2 Lambda, 2 Tie Phantom, 2 Defender

Tournament results: (S)11 of 11; (S)3 of 11;(AoIA)2 of 3; ®12 of 28


#6 mrgoodtrips

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:21 AM

If you cant agree roll off like it points out in the rule book.  my gaming group this has come up a few times mostly we agree one way or the other.


c


#7 Parakitor

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 04:31 PM

I agree that rolling it off is a good plan. But I tend to lean towards "tie goes to the attacker." It's clear from the design of the dice that this is supposed to be a fast-paced shoot-'em-up game (there are more hit/crits than evades). So it seems to me that anything that would speed up the action would fit the spirit of the game, so if it were really on the line, I'd say make it the closer range. Yeah, this situation comes up, but not that often in my experience.


"That starship won't fly, Bastila."


#8 ziggy2000

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 07:36 PM

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. One of my favorite aspects of this game is that it ecourages player interaction and agreement on the sometimes ambiguous aspect of play, this question being a perfect example. In my opinion, it is a far more "human" game than anything out there. You have marginal errors on movement, jostling other ships during movement or measurement, inexact placement after overlap, judgement calls on range and firing arc. It comes down to an agreement between the players about which way it goes, and I think that this interaction is what sets the game apart, rather than relying completely on the ruleset to solve every equation. Absent a gentleman's agreement, for our group we usually call in a third party for an opinion, but there have been times where we've used the rolloff as well.

It is interesting to see Parakitor's take that perhaps a "tie" should go to the attacker. IMHO, the attacker already has the advantage on the dice, and I'd like to point out that in some of FFGs card games (yes I know it's a different medium but I'm looking at precedent here), a tie goes to the defender. In  AGoT challenges, ties in strength go to the defender. In the Star Wars card game, Edge battle ties go to the defender, and in the Force Struggle a tie means the Balance token remains unchanged, which in my book is a victory for the "defender".

 



#9 Cambrius

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 10:56 AM

If it's a friendly game between friends, I would suggest a dice roll or rock-paper-scissors. The instance is so rare, I can't imagine a quick and easy solution can't be had.  :)


-I'm holding out for the B-Wing avatars!





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