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Two Gate Bursts in the same game…it is truly sentient!


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#1 The Professor

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 11:10 AM

For those of happened to read the thread below ("the King…"), I came home from work and took a half hour or so and played four (4) Turns, as the Investigators had four (4) Elder Signs (yes, I relented and didn't flip the seal…I removed it) on the board and with Mandy in Kingsport on Rift duty following her Madness card, Amnesia; I had both Rita (with a Gate Box, borrowed from Mandy) and William in the same Other World.  George had gone out to fight a cultist and actually had his a….er, head handed to hi and he ended-up recovering at St. Mary's Hospital, when another Gate Burst ocurred.

So, despite the fact that I always play with the Lurker, I rarely take a Pact…this time was different and both Rita and George grabbed a Pact and used the Power tokens to seal the Gates and win the game.  I know there was some controversy over the Power tokens and I thought that one side of the argument stemmed from the fact that they didn't believe that Power tokens could be used during the same turn they were obtained.  According to the card, you "may use Power tokens as Clue tokens…" when it's "refreshed" ~ of course as it's the second paragraph it's not that clear.  The FAQ doesn't provide any real guidance, so I'm a bit confused about them.

Anyway, with 11 Doom Tokens on the Doom Track, George, Mandy, Rita, and William defeated Ghatanothoa ~ again, a nail-biter!


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#2 Julia

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 12:27 PM

Wunderbar! Well spotted Joe! Both for the proper application of the Gate Burst rule (thumbs up! your bravery was rewarned! anyway, worst luck in my Arkham life: three bursts in a row, on three seals… sigh. Won anyway) and the spectacular victory :-))

As per Lurker, yes, you can spend power in the turn you gained it (that's the official ruling, even if many here are not particularly fond of that ruling)


We have dragged Reason from her Throne and set in her place the Empress of Dreams [liber Endvra]
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#3 The Professor

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 02:57 PM

Julia,

     Just chalk it up to another curious FAQ entry…according to the card: "Any Phase: While this card is refreshed…" and the second paragraph under this header states, "You may spend a Power token as either a Clue token…" while the bottom part of the card clearly indicates, "Upkeep: Exhaust Pact and lose X …"  If you've obtained Power tokens during the Upkeep, the card is 'exhausted' which means you can't spend them, which can only be accomplished when the card is "refreshed." 

     I thought maybe it was just me…but no, apparently others find issue with the FAQ entry.

Cheers, Joe


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#4 Julia

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 10:08 PM

Joe,

not so sure I got your point. FAQ, pag 41:

Q: Can an investigator use an exhausted Blood Pact or Soul Pact to spend Power tokens?
A: Yes.

The sequence on the original card can be misleading, but the FAQ fixes it. Or am I missing something?

Before the FAQ was released, I've always played the Pacts as if the two sentences were independent: if the card is "not exhausted", any time you gain Stamina (in case of a Blood Pact, of course), then you may gain Power instead. Additionally, regardless of the status of the card (we have two different paragraphs, and no linkers are used to connect the two), you can spend you power, as Clue, or to mitigate Sanity losses.. If the two were related, the wording should have been: "While this card is refreshed, any time you would gain any amount of Stamina, you may instead gain that amount of Power AND you may spend a Power token as either a Clue Token or as 1 Sanity when you suffer a Sanity loss"

The FAQ entry simply confirms the original intention, which is broken, but quite clear, I'd say


We have dragged Reason from her Throne and set in her place the Empress of Dreams [liber Endvra]
Custom Arkham Horror material / Arkham Horror Advanced Players League

#5 The Professor

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 11:05 PM

Julia,

     I believe we're of the same mind on this issue and it stems from the same thing…the first part of the card which talks about using it "refreshed" to gain Power tokens in lieu of Sanity or Stamina is, apparently, independent from the second paragraph which talks about spending the Power token as a Clue token.  According to the fact, one may spend Power tokens as Clue tokens at any time, while I'm maintaining that an Investigator should only be permitted to spend Power tokens as Clue tokens, etc. when the card is "refreshed" and not when it is "exhausted" (in essence, I don't want my Investigators obtaining and spending Power tokens in the same round). 

Example: Rita obtains a Blood Pact at the beginning of the Turn and during Upkeep decides to "exhaust" the card, spend 3 Stamina tokens to obtain 3 Power tokens.  During subsequent Phases, she may not use those Power tokens this turn, as the card is "exhausted."  However, during the next Turn's Upkeep, after she "refreshes" the card, she may "exhaust" it again and obtain additional Power tokens or leave it "refreshed" so she may spend the current Power tokens.


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#6 Julia

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 11:10 PM

Aye, that's the common fix most of us use :-) Ooooor… you can play according to the rules and pair Lurker with my purring, lovely Aforgomon Herald:

As you can see, Embracing Darkness forbids blitzkrieg actions to force the last seals on the board


We have dragged Reason from her Throne and set in her place the Empress of Dreams [liber Endvra]
Custom Arkham Horror material / Arkham Horror Advanced Players League

#7 The Professor

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:08 AM

Julia,

     I can't see the picture on this computer, but I'm sure it's dreadful ~ hahaha!  I think the 'fix' that most of us use for the Lurker Guarald is reasonable.  In this way, you "can't 'blitzkrieg' the last few gates" as you say.


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