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Doubts (movement, monsters' abilities, fatigues, dark pact etc…)


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#1 PhobosTheMad

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 03:52 AM

 

After several hours of gameplay (5 missions so far) i still have some doubts about rules that could change drastically 
the way i'm playing the descent's campaign with my friends, so i hope you can solve them:
 
 
- Monsters as heroes can perform 2 actions and can repeat the same action twice with the only exception for the attack action 
(monsters can attack or use an attack ability only once). So they are allowed
to take 2 movement actions. i'd like to know if 2 movement actions must be performed as a single movement with
doubled speed points (for example shadow dragon should move 6 instead of 3) or as a movement followed by another
movement. I know that this question is a bit tricky but we've noticed that there is a problem with giant monsters,
particularly with dragons (base 2x3), cause as they move and reach the last space
of their movement, they can move the base as they want and so a dragon can easily gain 2 more spaces. i've tried to draw 
a scheme to explain this problem, the red circle is the dragon, and a and b are the 2 different movement possibilities 
(a- 2 separeted movement actions, b- 1 movement action with doubled speed points)
 
[imageid=1591155]
 
 
- Several monsters have the ability to cause a hero to suffer fatigues (barghest's "howl" for example). If the hero 
targeted by this kind of ability has reached his stamina limit and so he can't suffer more fatigues, must he lose
health points (hearts) instead? And if so, this monster's ability has to be considered as an attack (so it can be used only once ) or not?
 
 
-(this question is also linked to the previous one) If the ability of a monster causes the loss of health points (for example ettin's "throw"), should it be considered
as an "attack" ability or not? so could it be used only once or even 2 times?
 
 
- Necromancer's ability "Dark Pact" allows to redirect health points damages from the necromancer to the Reanimate familiar,
if the redirected attack applies also a condition (disease,immobilize,poison or stun) should it be redirected with the health points damages to the Reanimate
or should the necromancer get it?
 
 
 
 
Thank you in advance for your help.


#2 PhobosTheMad

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 03:58 AM

movement scheme

http://i.imgur.com/TeTOLgh.jpg



#3 Husker949

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 05:49 AM

Phobos,

Taking a double move action with a monster is to be treated the same way you would take a double move action with a hero. When you take both actions, it builds up points in your movement pool equal to your speed. So taking two move actions adds 6 points in the case of the dragon. The only time you can interupt a move action is if something allows you to, such as taking an attack action or using an ability. Almost all of the monster abilities require the monster to use an action, so if you take two moves you cannot interupt the movement of the monster that way. Because of that statement, the dragon is required to take all 6 points of movement, or less, at one time. The only reason I say, or less, is because you can move less than your total available movement.  If you were to use a Dash card that allows a second move action in addition to your 2 actions a turn, you could make your first action a move, your Dash action for a move, and then interupt your total 6 space movement at say 2 spaces, expand so that you gain the extra 2 spaces, make your attack, then continue your move from the new forward position.

As far as using monster abilities that deal damage, I.E. Barghest's Howl with a full hero Fatigue Pool or The Ettin's Throw ability, they do not specify make an attack. The ruling has even come down from the creators of the game that say if the ability does not plainly state in the text "make an attack" then you can use the ability twice. Again using a Frenzy card is a way of giving your monsters a second attack action.

Dark Pact merely gives the Necromancer the ability to transfer all damage delt to either the Reanimate or the Necromancer itself. If the Necro was the target of the attack, it would still gain the condition so long as it delt damage to the Reanimate. If the Reanimate soaks all of the damage in the defense roll, then the Necro doesn't take the condition, but if it takes at least 1 damage the Necro will get the condition. My defense to these statements is based on the fact that the Necro is the target of the attack and the damage is merely being transfered, not changing targets of the attack.

Hope this helps.



#4 gaarge

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 06:02 AM

Movement: I would have argued that scheme A is correct, and I would have forced the dragon to "expand" before taking the second movement.  This may then actually limit the dragon's movement, if the dragon is unable to expand.

Fatigues: No.  Howl is howl, attack is attack.  Using your logic one could argue that a failed attack is not an attack because no damage was dealt…  I think not.

Dark Pact: the card is quite clear (http://www.descentin...9/dark_pact.jpg) “each time you suffer heart, you may choose to have your reanimate suffer all the heart instead.  Each time your Reanimate suffers heart, you may choose to suffer all of the heart instead”.  No mention of transferring conditions.  On the other hand, if you lose heart as a result of a condition, of course, you can transfer to your Reanimate using this skill.



#5 Steve-O

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 03:07 PM

PhobosTheMad said:

 

i'd like to know if 2 movement actions must be performed as a single movement with doubled speed points (for example shadow dragon should move 6 instead of 3) or as a movement followed by another movement.

 
 
Actually, the figure has a choice to do it either way.  He can declare one Move, complete it and then declare another, or he can declarre one Move, interrupt it to declare a second Move and then use up all the MPs at once.  Every figure, hero or monster, can do this whichever way he pleases.
 
The down side of doing as "one Move" is that an enemy ability which ends movement prematurely will end BOTH moves.  The down side of doing it as two Moves (at least for Large monsters) is that it needs to have room to expand in between, otherwise it can't legally get through a tight space.
 
And yes, large monsters can easily gain a couple extra spaces by finding a reason to expand and re-shrink in the middle of a move.
 

PhobosTheMad said:

- Several monsters have the ability to cause a hero to suffer fatigues (barghest's "howl" for example). If the hero 
targeted by this kind of ability has reached his stamina limit and so he can't suffer more fatigues, must he lose
health points (hearts) instead? And if so, this monster's ability has to be considered as an attack (so it can be used only once ) or not?
 
 
 
An ability is considered an "attack" IF AND ONLY IF the text of the ability uses the word "attack" (or sometimes "perform an attack") in it's description.  If it doesn't say it's an attack, it is not an attack.  There are some abilities in the game that can cause wounds which are not considered attacks.  I'm not just talking about hitting a hero who's full up on fatigue with Howl either, there are actual damage-dealing abilities that aren't attacks.  Generally they don't do much, of course, but still.  Look for the word "attack" to determine if it's an attack.
 

PhobosTheMad said:

- Necromancer's ability "Dark Pact" allows to redirect health points damages from the necromancer to the Reanimate familiar,
if the redirected attack applies also a condition (disease,immobilize,poison or stun) should it be redirected with the health points damages to the Reanimate
or should the necromancer get it?

 

 

I think this one may have been addressed in the "Adam Sez" thread over on BGG (don't have a link handy, sorry.)  I'm pretty sure the condition stays on the original target - the ability only transfers wounds dealt.



#6 PhobosTheMad

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 08:49 PM

thank you for the answers ;)






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