Jump to content



Photo

Eldar PCs using Only War rules


  • Please log in to reply
13 replies to this topic

#1 Admiral Cain

Admiral Cain

    Member

  • Members
  • 14 posts

Posted 03 February 2013 - 06:50 AM

Hi, no house rule section yet and no Eldar section yet   : )   so posting these here for anyone intrested.

https://docs.google....dit?usp=sharing

Intended for an Eldar campaign, not as creating Eldar PCs for your regiment.  These characters are closer to Rogue Traders than Only War or Dark Heresy Characters.  Its a rough draft at the momement but anyone thinking of running an Eldar game this should get you started.  I also need to thank Nathan "N0-1-H3r3" Dowdell for much of the heavy lifting as I reference his work at http://www.n01h3r3.com  many, many times.

Let me know if anyone tries these out, I'd love to hear how it goes!

Thanks!

 

 



#2 Robomummy

Robomummy

    Member

  • Members
  • 272 posts

Posted 03 February 2013 - 09:19 AM

Interesting, I have craftworld eldar make a breif appearance in one of my campaigns but I just use the rules for dark eldar in the Core rulebook with some slight modification to the profiles (since the imperium doesnt really distinguish between craftworld, dark, and exodite eldar). I might try these out though.


Check out my podcast Buckets Of Dice where myself and a friend review how to start various different kinds of tabletop, roleplaying, and CCG games. http://bucketsofdice.podomatic.com/ Each episode focuses on a new game, we discuss a little about the game's backround, rules, how to start/ what to buy, and a little about the company.  


#3 AtoMaki

AtoMaki

    Member

  • Members
  • 698 posts

Posted 03 February 2013 - 10:13 PM

Uhm, and how is the increased Characteristics? 30+2D10 (40+2D10 for AG) sounds a little bit too much. S40/T40 (the average for an Eldar character) is Ork category, and I don't think that an Eldar should start with the same Strength and Toughness as an Ork. 

Our gaming group has a custom 40k setting where one of the basic races is the Eldar. There, we simply gave them a "roll 3D10 for Characteristic, picking the two highest rolls" Trait to represent their superiority. 

Also, I think every Eldar should have the Psyker aptitude, as they are natural born psykers. 



#4 Admiral Cain

Admiral Cain

    Member

  • Members
  • 14 posts

Posted 04 February 2013 - 04:15 AM

AtoMaki said:

Uhm, and how is the increased Characteristics? 30+2D10 (40+2D10 for AG) sounds a little bit too much. S40/T40 (the average for an Eldar character) is Ork category, and I don't think that an Eldar should start with the same Strength and Toughness as an Ork. 

Our gaming group has a custom 40k setting where one of the basic races is the Eldar. There, we simply gave them a "roll 3D10 for Characteristic, picking the two highest rolls" Trait to represent their superiority. 

Also, I think every Eldar should have the Psyker aptitude, as they are natural born psykers. 

Thanks for the input!

Stat line is more about general power level of the campaign.  30 +2d10 was in line with what I felt about right.  Compared to N0-1-H3r3's stat lines for Aspect warriors its actually low.  IIRC FFG did publish "official" stats for a couple Eldar Aspect warriors in either a Rogue Trader or Deathwatch suppliment some where.  I don't recall the stat line but I'd be suprised if there were any stats in the 20s for the Aspect Warriors.  Guardians or civilian Eldar, sure.  I'll dig though the mountain of books again and compare when I get home.  I may go with a 25 for Str and Toughness as a starting point to balance out the 40 Ag.  50 Max Str/Tough starting may be a bit much once you add in any other stat mods from Char gen and then another +20 from advances.  75 str/tough is downright Phoenix Lord territory for Eldar.  Good point, thanks.

Psyker aptitude.  I had a couple thoughts on this one.  I thought about giving all Eldar Psykinisience but choose not to.  And I wanted Warlocks to be the Psykers so they would get the appropriate skills/talents at a discount compared to the Aspect Warriors and Rangers.  IMO if the GM wants to portray the low level psyker abilities of any Eldar its best done through RP rather than giving all PCs specific game mechanic.  YMMV.

Thanks for the read!

 

 

 



#5 AtoMaki

AtoMaki

    Member

  • Members
  • 698 posts

Posted 04 February 2013 - 06:16 AM

The Kronus Bestiary has lots of Eldars in it. Most of them is WS40-50, BS40-50, S30-35, T30-35, Ag45-55(with Unnatural AG 4), Int35, Per40-45, WP40-50 and Fel 30-35.

So I would say, an Eldar "fresh-face" would have WS35, BS35, S30, T30, AG40 (+Unnatural AG 4), Int 30, Per 35, WP 35, Fel 30 as starting Characteristics. Though, I must add, an AGB of 4+4 is dead crazy for a character with a "free" development system like the Aptitudes. 



#6 Admiral Cain

Admiral Cain

    Member

  • Members
  • 14 posts

Posted 04 February 2013 - 02:45 PM

AtoMaki said:

The Kronus Bestiary has lots of Eldars in it. Most of them is WS40-50, BS40-50, S30-35, T30-35, Ag45-55(with Unnatural AG 4), Int35, Per40-45, WP40-50 and Fel 30-35.  So I would say, an Eldar "fresh-face" would have WS35, BS35, S30, T30, AG40 (+Unnatural AG 4), Int 30, Per 35, WP 35, Fel 30 as starting Characteristics.

Thank you, that was it.  I may run with a 25 base and hand out more specific stat mods for being Eldar and in the Classes to get a more uneven distribution.  25 +2d10 (or 100 points) for all.  +10 AG, +5 Per, than throw some appropriate stat mods into the classes.  I'm aiming for graduated from Guardian school as a starting point, not so much with the fresh face.  There is a joke in there somewhere about Eldar skin lotion/aging/beauty spa treatments…

 

AtoMaki said:

 Though, I must add, an AGB of 4+4 is dead crazy for a character with a "free" development system like the Aptitudes. 

*eh*  I had a Rogue Trader void farer, best damn fighter pilot in the galaxy.  Had a dodge skill over 100% and still wound up heavly wounded after most fights.  Can't dodge hordes.  Can't dodge what you can't see.  Can't always get more DOS than an autofire (or lighting) attack, any you've only got so many reactions. 

And Eldar are suppose to be sneaky.  It'll be quite a novelty after 30 years of gaming to actually have an entire party that occasionally can sneak past an Orc guard rather than "oh screw it the guy in *insert heavy armor type here* is going to blow it anyway.  Charge!!!"  Sadly even with a Stealth skill of around 80, with 5 PCs rolling there is around a 1/3 chance one of them will blow the roll anyway…

 



#7 AtoMaki

AtoMaki

    Member

  • Members
  • 698 posts

Posted 04 February 2013 - 10:57 PM

Admiral Cain said:

*eh*  I had a Rogue Trader void farer, best damn fighter pilot in the galaxy.  Had a dodge skill over 100% and still wound up heavly wounded after most fights.  Can't dodge hordes.  Can't dodge what you can't see.  Can't always get more DOS than an autofire (or lighting) attack, any you've only got so many reactions. 

And Eldar are suppose to be sneaky.  It'll be quite a novelty after 30 years of gaming to actually have an entire party that occasionally can sneak past an Orc guard rather than "oh screw it the guy in *insert heavy armor type here* is going to blow it anyway.  Charge!!!"  Sadly even with a Stealth skill of around 80, with 5 PCs rolling there is around a 1/3 chance one of them will blow the roll anyway…

 

The problem with the AGB 4+4 comes from two sources:

- 16 meters Full Move (small note: the Tactical Speed of most vehicles is usually less). Maybe it doesn't sound that bad, but believe me it is. Take Sprint, and you will have a 24 meters Full Move and can run a whooping 96 meters. Movement speeds like these are the best way to kill the thrill of dangerous situations, because the PCs will always have a reliable way to simply run away. 

- Unnatural Agility 4 also adds 4 automatic Degrees of Success to all Agility based Tests. So in order to fail an Agility Test, the characters must accumulate 4+ Degrees of Failure, so they must fail the roll by 40 or more. Because of this, there will be situations, where they can't fail at all. Say, with Ag 40, Stealth +20, they will automatically succeed on any Challenging or easier Stealth Tests….

And now, combine the two for the ultiamte "Catch Me If You Can!" character who (thankfully to the open character development system) will have a whole arsenal of other Skills (social, investigation) for other challenges  too. 

 

In our custom setting, Eldar characters sucked in combat, couldn't take OP cybernetic enhancements and were very vulnerable to Corruption/Insanity and even then they were slightly broken.



#8 whoseyes

whoseyes

    Member

  • Members
  • 70 posts

Posted 04 February 2013 - 11:50 PM

AtoMaki said:

 

- Unnatural Agility 4 also adds 4 automatic Degrees of Success to all Agility based Tests. So in order to fail an Agility Test, the characters must accumulate 4+ Degrees of Failure, so they must fail the roll by 40 or more. Because of this, there will be situations, where they can't fail at all. Say, with Ag 40, Stealth +20, they will automatically succeed on any Challenging or easier Stealth Tests….

 

A couple of things..

Unnatural Characteristic: In addition, whenever someone with an UCHAR succeeds on a test utilising that characteristic, they gain a number of bonus Degrees of Success equal to half of their UCHAR.

Also, I think that giving eldar characters an Unnatural Agility of 4 is too much. Dark Eldar warriors and wyches from the NPCs of Only Wat have an Unnatural Agility of 3.

FInally, an eldar should be able to perform hit&run tactics or to simply run away / disappear when they think that its the right thing to do. When you can live eternally you consider differently taking risks, behaving like a hero or stuff like that. This doesn't mean that they are cowards (although the Uplifting Primer says so), only that they use strategies where their own casualties are minimal.



#9 AtoMaki

AtoMaki

    Member

  • Members
  • 698 posts

Posted 05 February 2013 - 12:09 AM

whoseyes said:

Unnatural Characteristic: In addition, whenever someone with an UCHAR succeeds on a test utilising that characteristic, they gain a number of bonus Degrees of Success equal to half of their UCHAR.

 

LOL, we played this wrong then :D. Considering that we have/had like, 9-10 characters with Unnatural Characteristics, this is quite humiliating :D

 

I agree that with Unnatural Ag, the players would play the Eldar just as the Eldar is supposed to be played, but I'm more concerned about the possible challenges these characters could face and actually feel difficult to complete. Like, you can't throw Genestealers at the characters in every adventure… 



#10 Admiral Cain

Admiral Cain

    Member

  • Members
  • 14 posts

Posted 05 February 2013 - 06:03 AM

whoseyes said:

Unnatural Characteristic: In addition, whenever someone with an UCHAR succeeds on a test utilising that characteristic, they gain a number of bonus Degrees of Success equal to half of their UCHAR.

I thought Unatural Characteristics lowered the difficulty….*shrug*  must be recalling one of the other 40krpg rule sets.

 

whoseyes said:

Also, I think that giving eldar characters an Unnatural Agility of 4 is too much. Dark Eldar warriors and wyches from the NPCs of Only Wat have an Unnatural Agility of 3.

Noted, thanks.  I'm still tweaking the stat line.

 

 



#11 whoseyes

whoseyes

    Member

  • Members
  • 70 posts

Posted 05 February 2013 - 06:47 AM

AtoMaki said:

 

 

I agree that with Unnatural Ag, the players would play the Eldar just as the Eldar is supposed to be played, but I'm more concerned about the possible challenges these characters could face and actually feel difficult to complete. Like, you can't throw Genestealers at the characters in every adventure… 

 

I'm sure it can be done. It's like thinking about challenges for deathwatch squad… the power level has nothing to do with the level of an IG squad, but you can think of possible enemies/missions/surprises to challenge your players.

Some of examples that come to my mind:

- The Eldar have to protect someone/something (a cripled or slow ally, a relic, a temple). Its obvious that if the PCs are attacked, they can't flee and abandon their positions!!

- The Eldar have to hunt/attack/destroy someone/something. Again, you have to face your enemy and attack him, can't simply run away if your objective involves combat.

- An horde of soldiers/critters surrounds the Eldar characters. Running away becomes more difficult, as does avoiding enemy attacks…

- ¡Fast and agile enemies! From tyranids to other Eldar (especially Dark Eldar, of course).

- Make them operate in thight/closed spaces (tunnels, sealed chambers, etc.).

- Shoot them from reeeeeaally far away (sneaky enemy snipers or long-range weapons). This works especially when opposing the PCs to opponents with a better stealth than them (Space Marine Explorers, imperial Assassins) or when placing the players in the open (a field without cover).

 

I pesonaly wouldn't enjoy a game with Eldar PCs because I prefer the grittiness of low power characters, but I'm sure it can be done!



#12 AtoMaki

AtoMaki

    Member

  • Members
  • 698 posts

Posted 05 February 2013 - 07:38 AM

^Yeah maybe just my past experiences are talking :). Anyways, I wouldn't mind the 4+4 AGB if it would have some sort of counter-disadvantage. Like penalties when the character loses his Spirit Stone, some sort of limit to develop certain character aspects (maybe durability and hitting power) through limited aptitudes/Trait-bound penalties and so on. This way, the GM can present some situations what are challenging, but don't look like the convenient hard-counters of the character's biggest advantage.



#13 Admiral Cain

Admiral Cain

    Member

  • Members
  • 14 posts

Posted 05 February 2013 - 01:58 PM

whoseyes said:

AtoMaki said:

 

 

 

I agree that with Unnatural Ag, the players would play the Eldar just as the Eldar is supposed to be played, but I'm more concerned about the possible challenges these characters could face and actually feel difficult to complete. Like, you can't throw Genestealers at the characters in every adventure… 

 

 

 

I'm sure it can be done. It's like thinking about challenges for deathwatch squad…

Two basic ways to force a combat encounter on a group of highly moble PCs.  One, take advice from Sun Tzu and create Death's Ground.  Something the PCs *have* to attack or defend.   Or you go the Alfred Hitchcock route and use a MacGuffin to lure them in.  Also, as a GM, you can cheat.  "Nope, that Lictor totally made 9 DOS on his stealth check and now you're trapped in the building until you can clear the rubble out…"  (hidden enemies, restirctive terrain).

For the most part I would think that a campaign with all Eldar PCs would be quite a bit more Stealth, recon and occasional caper than the typical Iggy or Space Marine kick the door in style game.

"Well its that time of the Century for the festival of Ishkabibile.  Unfourtunatly the humans seem to have built a fort on top of the ancient ruins where we hold the rites.  Well, we've got a couple months still and there is that Space Hulk with all the Greenskins just over there.  Why don't you five see what you can do while we begin the preperations for the festival."



#14 Admiral Cain

Admiral Cain

    Member

  • Members
  • 14 posts

Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:12 PM

AtoMaki said:

^Yeah maybe just my past experiences are talking :). Anyways, I wouldn't mind the 4+4 AGB if it would have some sort of counter-disadvantage. Like penalties when the character loses his Spirit Stone, some sort of limit to develop certain character aspects (maybe durability and hitting power) through limited aptitudes/Trait-bound penalties and so on. This way, the GM can present some situations what are challenging, but don't look like the convenient hard-counters of the character's biggest advantage.

Losing the Spirit Stone would be fairly serious in RP terms (as in trip to the Eye of Terror to replace it).  I'm not aware of any fluff that would indicate some kind of punitive mechanics.  Again, I'm not real concerned with the PCs running away from combat.  They're Eldar, if they didn't avoid combat unless 100% required by some objective, or overwhelming superiority, I'd think the players weren't getting into the spirt of the game.  YMMV, especially if you've got a game of mixed races.

 






© 2013 Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc. Fantasy Flight Games and the FFG logo are ® of Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc.  All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Contact | User Support | Rules Questions | Help | RSS