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Turr Phenirr pilot ability


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#1 Forensicus

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 09:38 AM

A question regarding Turr Phenirr's pilot card:

It says "After you perform an attack, you may perform a free boost or barrel roll action."

Does this mean

A) That he may perfom this move right after the attack (ie is it considered an "End Phase" ability)?

or

B) Is the free boost/barrel roll transferred to the next Activation Phase?


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#2 mrfroggies

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 10:09 AM

It happens right after you perform the attack.  The attack doesn't have to hit to trigger the ability either.



#3 Kaxel Vofer

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 11:14 AM

I think it occur after you perform the attack, like mrfroggies saids it do not depends of the result of the attack, greetings.



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#4 dbmeboy

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 01:42 PM

I'll toss in my agreement with the above responses.  Also note that he still cannot boost or barrel roll twice in a round (so if he used one of those as his first action, he cannot choose it again after his attack).



#5 godofcheese

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 02:59 PM

I also like him with Push the limit.

As long as he didn't use PTL after his main action (and didn't do boost or roll as main action) he can attack, barrell roll and THEN boost after he attacks (really making sure he gets out of any fire arcs.



#6 Forensicus

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Posted 14 January 2013 - 01:38 PM

I beg to differ on the interpretation that he wPlease note that it says "Ater you perform an attack, you may perform a free boost or barrel roll action."

and quoting the rulebook page 8:

"Actions

During the Activation phase, each ship may perform

one action immediately after moving. A ship may

perform any action shown in the action bar of its Ship

card. Additionally, certain pilot abilities, Upgrade

cards, Damage cards, or missions may allow ships to

perform other actions. Each of the possible actions is

described in detail over the next few pages.

If an ability allows a ship to perform a “free action,”

this action does not count as the one action

allowed during the “Perform Action” step."

 

So Turr Phenirr SHOULD be able to boost or barrel roll in his Activation Phase, then attack an then coose to do the free action again, right?


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#7 Englishpete

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Posted 14 January 2013 - 02:02 PM

The rules also state an action can only be performed once per turn per pilot (not exact quote) so no 2 barrel rolls


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#8 hothie

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Posted 14 January 2013 - 02:59 PM

Forensicus, look on page 9. "However, a ship cannot perform the same action more than once during a single game round."

So, no, he would not be able to perform a boost or barrel roll if he had taken one of those actions previously in the game round.


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#9 Forensicus

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Posted 14 January 2013 - 07:00 PM

OK, so let me see if we are on the same page now:

a) He performs a barrel roll In the activation phase (AP), attacks and then he can do a free boost

b) He performs a boost in the AP, attacks and then he can do a free barrel roll

c) he takes a focus in the AP, attacks and then he can choose between either a free barrel roll or a free boost

All of the above should be correct, right (as long as he was t stressed or a damage card prohibits him taking any actions)

if so, my "problem" with a) and b) is how to remember whether he did a boost or barrel in AP when the time comes for choosing eithe free action after the attack since these 2 phases might be far apart. (Hope that you are following/understanding my point/"problem" here)

 


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#10 mrfroggies

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 07:31 AM

I see your problem.  You may want to put a chit or marker on his card in that covers an action that he's already done to try and help you remember what actions he's taken.  I'm sure there's lots of little things along those lines that you can do to help with that.  Just pick a system and stay consistant and you should be fine.



#11 ArcticSnake

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 10:52 AM

Also, if your opponent is familiar with the rules, he or she would most probably happily remember on your behalf that you already did the same action. :D


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#12 Forensicus

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 03:13 PM

mrfroggies said:

I see your problem.  You may want to put a chit or marker on his card in that covers an action that he's already done to try and help you remember what actions he's taken.  I'm sure there's lots of little things along those lines that you can do to help with that.  Just pick a system and stay consistant and you should be fine.

 

Good point and good idea. Can't wait to fly him into battle and test his abilities. I wasso fortunate to win a Millenium Falcon at a local Kessel Run for 2nd prize, but none of my Wave 1 friends wants to play against it ;-)

 

Thanks for your inputs, cleared up the matter


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 Fleet: 1 x [YT-1300] -  5 x [X-Wing] - 4 x [A-Wing] -2 x [Y-Wing] - 2 x [HWK-290] - 4 x [B-Wing] - 1 x [Transport] - 1 x [Tantive IV]: 2 x [Firespray-31] - 8 x [Tie Fighters] - 6 x [Tie Interceptor] - 3 x [Tie Advanced] - 3 x [TIE-Bomber] - 3 x [Lambda Shuttle]

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#13 niceas

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 06:19 AM

Forensicus said:

Good point and good idea. Can't wait to fly him into battle and test his abilities. I wasso fortunate to win a Millenium Falcon at a local Kessel Run for 2nd prize, but none of my Wave 1 friends wants to play against it ;-)

 

Thanks for your inputs, cleared up the matter

 

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#14 Bazinga

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 09:25 PM

I agree I fly him every chance I get. Barrel rolls or boosting through astroids after shooting and getting an extra defense die. Also unless the attacker has the same value pilot skill often your no longer in their arc or moved out of range one.

#15 Rhetorical Heretic

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 10:35 AM

hothie said:

 

Forensicus, look on page 9. "However, a ship cannot perform the same action more than once during a single game round."

So, no, he would not be able to perform a boost or barrel roll if he had taken one of those actions previously in the game round.

 

 

Hi folks,

Would the side bar on page 20 titled Breaking the rules not allow you to take another boost or barrel roll if you wished, as per that the card text would indeed override the general rules.



#16 Buhallin

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 11:13 AM

Rhetorical Heretic said:

Would the side bar on page 20 titled Breaking the rules not allow you to take another boost or barrel roll if you wished, as per that the card text would indeed override the general rules.

While card text does override general rules, it must do so in the most limited way possible.  For example, Gunner lets you make a second attack - but all the normal rules for that attack still apply normally.

In this case, Turr lets you take an action at an unusual time, but it says nothing about letting you break the "no repeat" clause.

 



#17 Rhetorical Heretic

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 07:00 PM

Buhallin said:

Rhetorical Heretic said:

 

Would the side bar on page 20 titled Breaking the rules not allow you to take another boost or barrel roll if you wished, as per that the card text would indeed override the general rules.

 

 

While card text does override general rules, it must do so in the most limited way possible.  For example, Gunner lets you make a second attack - but all the normal rules for that attack still apply normally.

In this case, Turr lets you take an action at an unusual time, but it says nothing about letting you break the "no repeat" clause.

 

Hi Buhallin,

Gunner
"After you perform an attack that does not hit, immediately perform a primary weapon attack. You cannot perform another attack this round."

If you check out the gunner card it clearly states, "You cannot perform another attack this round". Also if i'm being pedantic about Gunner it already breaks the general rules, by allowing a second attack if you miss with your first. I'm not sure where you are getting the "it must do so in the most limited way possible", has there been an errata to Breaking the rules I don't know about?.

 



#18 ziggy2000

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 07:38 PM

Rhetorical Heretic said:

Hi Buhallin,

Gunner
"After you perform an attack that does not hit, immediately perform a primary weapon attack. You cannot perform another attack this round."

If you check out the gunner card it clearly states, "You cannot perform another attack this round". Also if i'm being pedantic about Gunner it already breaks the general rules, by allowing a second attack if you miss with your first. I'm not sure where you are getting the "it must do so in the most limited way possible", has there been an errata to Breaking the rules I don't know about?.

 

There has been no errata to the Breaking the Rules notation (which is a pretty standard notation for this type of game). But, to answer your original post, there is nothing in the text of Turr's ability that allows it to break the "cannot perform the same action more than once during a single game round" rule, as presented on page 9. In fact, Turr's ability specifies that you may perform a "free boost or barrel roll action", and the rule on page 9 states that you cannot perform the same action; "not even when the action is a "free action"." I see no ambiguity here.

 



#19 Bazinga

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 07:39 PM

Although question from a new player I was playing last week. If Turr phenirr has the intitive and fires and boost. Does that mean someone with the same pilot skill gets to shoot at him from his original position or new position? A lower pilot skill would be new position.

#20 Buhallin

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 07:45 PM

"Must do so as little as possible" is the way I like to articulate a foundational principle of any "break the rules" type game abilities.  Basically, card abilities break the rules only where they specifically say they break the rules.

For what may be a better example, let's consider two abilities: the Weapons Engineer, and the rumored ability of the Lambda Title, ST-321, which allows the ship to acquire a target lock at any range.  That ability breaks the rule requiring a target to be within range 3 in order to acquire a lock; but it does not say anything about the rule that you can only have one target lock at a time, so if you acquire a new lock all the way across the board, you still lose the old one.  On the other side, Weapons Engineer says you can maintain two target locks at once.  This overrides the rule that a ship can only have one active target lock, but says nothing about the range rule, so that rule is still in effect.

Abilities break the rules they directly say they do, and nothing more.  In this case, Turr's ability grants a free action, but it says nothing about all the normal restrictions for taking actions.  Therefore, those rules are still in place, and Turr cannot use a barrel roll after attacking if he already did a barrel roll earlier that turn, or if he has a stress token, or a Damaged Sensor Array critical hit, etc.

 






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