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Do you lose previous Talent slots after Career Transition? If so, what's the Rationale for this?


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#1 non-player

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 07:53 AM

I've mostly completed the process of transitioning my game from a Warhammer 1E campaign to a Warhammer 3E campaign. Most of the shift was surprisingly simple. But now there's a conundrum.

I've got a High Elf player who has just completed the Scribe career. She's been gunning for the advanced career of Lawyer up until now (because every adventuring group needs a lawyer!), but it turns out that 3E doesn't have a Lawyer career. However, the Envoy class is a very close match to how we've been role-playing that career goal, so I think we'll go for that.

The problem here is that the Scribe has two Focus slots, while the Envoy has two Reputation slots. If she transitions from a fully-advanced Scribe with multiple Focus talents, as far as I can tell those will be totally useless once she enters Envoy. Is this correct?

So first question: Is there actually a Lawyer advanced career anywhere, custom or official?

Second, would inclusion of a house rule stating "if you complete your career and purchase the dedication bonus, keep all of its talent slots" totally break the game? If so, would there be a good way to keep this rule, but also balance it out on the enemy side?

Thanks guys!



#2 Emirikol

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 04:34 AM

I've got a High Elf player who has just completed the Scribe career. She's been gunning for the advanced career of Lawyer up until now (because every adventuring group needs a lawyer!), but it turns out that 3E doesn't have a Lawyer career. However, the Envoy class is a very close match to how we've been role-playing that career goal, so I think we'll go for that.

The problem here is that the Scribe has two Focus slots, while the Envoy has two Reputation slots. If she transitions from a fully-advanced Scribe with multiple Focus talents, as far as I can tell those will be totally useless once she enters Envoy. Is this correct?

So first question: Is there actually a Lawyer advanced career anywhere, custom or official?

Second, would inclusion of a house rule stating "if you complete your career and purchase the dedication bonus, keep all of its talent slots" totally break the game? If so, would there be a good way to keep this rule, but also balance it out on the enemy side?

 

A1: There is no lawyer (Litigant in 2e) career yet, but I'll see if I can whip one up.  You can also use a simpler house rule that allows a career to be re-taken to be called "Master."  You can see it in my house rulebook in my sig below.

A2: Yes, you do lose the talent slot, but your GM could rule that you can pick and choose as long as it is a permanent change.  Talent slots exist for the sake of game balance so that players can't stack 8 talents at once.  Only Advanced careers can have more than 2 talent slots (for reasonable balance).

 

Best of luck in your game,

 

jh

 



#3 Emirikol

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 05:29 AM

Your honor,

I am hereby presenting evidence that the Scribe can, in fact, change careers to the Litigant.  The Litigant, according to Imperial Code 11.2.11.4 (b), c-f), as laid down by the Three Emporers (granted the Three Emporers had some difficulty and inconsistencies in their rulings), is a viable and workable career.

Here's a Litigant (Lawyer) adapted directly from the 2e Career Compendium (originally from Terror in Talabheim).

 

Enjoy,

jh

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#4 Yepesnopes

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 05:33 AM

Nice Emirikol, if I have some spare time, I will do a bit of photoshop with the picture, and put the career ability in a career ability card.

Cheers,

Yepes


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#5 Emirikol

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 05:51 AM



#6 gruntl

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Posted 14 January 2013 - 01:17 AM

Nice career suggestion Emirikol! Although I would probably have put Guile instead of Leadership in the skill list. And just give it 1 reputation and 1 focus slot. It seems reasonable that a lawyer/litigator needs Reputation a lot more than a Scribe would.

We're using a house rule for talent slots. I allow a player to socket the "wrong" talent type in a socket if they take 1 stress. That has worked fine for us.



#7 SJMazzella3380

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Posted 14 January 2013 - 05:14 AM

You do not lose the talent card itself, and you can always try to socket it into the party sheet if that type of talent is available.



#8 k7e9

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 07:06 AM

non-player said:

So first question: Is there actually a Lawyer advanced career anywhere, custom or official?

The Scholar career would be the closest thing I can think of. I mean it is a generic "scholar" so the career could be focused on law, history, economics, biologi or whatever you (or the player) wants. I believe scholar has at least one focus slots as well, so that might be the way to go.

non-player said:

Second, would inclusion of a house rule stating "if you complete your career and purchase the dedication bonus, keep all of its talent slots" totally break the game? If so, would there be a good way to keep this rule, but also balance it out on the enemy side?

It would probably not break the game. In my games I created a few house rule talents which works really well, at least in my group See them here: https://dl.dropbox.c.../NewTalents.jpg . Basically, they allow the players to purchase a permanent talent slot in any of the three groups (I only allow for one extra of each type). These are purchased as regular talent advances, all my players have purchased at least one.



#9 Jericho

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 03:04 AM

But what is the rationale you use to explain why talents suddenly become unavailable and can still be used on the party sheet?

I mean the in-game explanation.

Thanks all!


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#10 Yepesnopes

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 03:32 AM

Jericho said:

But what is the rationale you use to explain why talents suddenly become unavailable and can still be used on the party sheet?

I mean the in-game explanation.

Thanks all!

Warhammer 3 has a few things like this.

Action recharge times, soketing talents…these were subjects of devate during the early time of these forums. I would not mind too much. It is just a mechanic that works on keeping the game balanced.

If it anoys you, you can just house rule it as proposed in this thread. I quite agree it won't break the game, at the end, talents only confer a small bonus if compared to training dice or fortune dice in characteristics.


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#11 non-player

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 09:31 AM

Emirikol said:

Your honor,

I am hereby presenting evidence that the Scribe can, in fact, change careers to the Litigant.  The Litigant, according to Imperial Code 11.2.11.4 (b), c-f), as laid down by the Three Emporers (granted the Three Emporers had some difficulty and inconsistencies in their rulings), is a viable and workable career.

Here's a Litigant (Lawyer) adapted directly from the 2e Career Compendium (originally from Terror in Talabheim).

 

Enjoy,

jh

www.hafnerchiropractic.com

 

Emirikol, you rock my world. Thanks for this!



#12 SJMazzella3380

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 03:37 AM

I have made a new party sheet that uses all 3 talent types (Focus, Reputation, Tactics).  It also allows the players to get a free talent card swap out and players are able to spend the parties fortune pool points to socket a talent type to one of their free talent sockets.

 

Here is a link to the image (Not sure how to post the image itself here)

https://www.dropbox....-Front-Face.png

 

Hope This Helps.

 



#13 SJMazzella3380

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 12:44 AM



#14 dvang

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 12:11 PM

The intent is to keep careers balanced, as well as to encourage players to advance into careers that are similar.  The talents aren't lost, it is just more difficult to access them. The party sheet is one way. Another is to advance into a different career that has access to the same type of slots.  Keep in mind that higher rank careers tend to have 3 or more talent slots.

Potentially, you might house rule allowing the ability to slot non-career talents. I would be careful, though, and would make it expensive. Talent slots are there for a reason.

I certainly wouldn't allow "keeping" talent slots, which would allow intermediate careers to have 4 or 5 talent slots, for example.






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