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#1 Turinqui

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 02:20 AM

Hello all,

 

after I got the card game recently I tried to play some games with my brother sadly were both not native English speakers so we have some questions regarding the rules of the game that we couldnt find back in the rulebook or at this forum yet.

I want to appologize upfront if someone already asked for these questions but I sincerely couldnt find an answe yet, and some of these questions might seem very foolish to you but if you have the time and can spend the effort we really would like to know the answer.

1- What happens with the stack of the runner when he/she ran out of cards, will the cards on the heap pile get shuffeled again and put back in the heap or is it just to bad that there no cards left anymore?

2- If the corp has more then 1 ICE of the same subkind, for example, 2 of the subtype codewall, can the runner use only 1 program to break first the 1st ICE and then the same program to break the 2nd ICE.

3- The card "Personal Touch" can you freely move it around any icebreaker card you have? Can you stack more then 1 on any icebreaker card? Can you use it for example when you encounter an ICE on icebreaker 1 and then when you encounter ICE 2 on an other icebrekaer?

4- What is the use for the runner to take a run at the archives server? Why would a corp discard a agenda card  there in the first place?

5- What is the use of the NON agenda cards that a runner may acces in the R&D server? Is it just to make the R&D pile go emptier faster so the runners wins that way? If the the cards have a trash cost and you can pay it you trash it if you cant pay it it  goes back to the server but if there is no cost it can be trashed in archives but will be it be faced up or faced down?

6- The card "Crypsis" can you keep spending credits to increase the cards strength, for example you pay 10 credits to gain 10 strenght?

7- The card "Nisei MK II" what does this card mean at all? What does the agenda token and what does it do?

8- If you have as the runner the cards "Magnus Opus" and "Armitage Codebusting" at teh same time is that any use at all?  Since you can get 2 credits for 1 click ALL the time for "Magnus Opus".

9- When do you lay cards face up or face down in the archives server?

10 - For the Corp, do you lay assets always face up or face down in the remote server? And what about assets that are an ambush?

11- The card "pipeline" does it work against teh card "Hunter" and can it break the subroutine trace then?

12- Do you lay traps/ambushes on the archives pile after a Runner made a run against your trap/ambush. Or do you leave them in the remote server? And o you lay them face up or face down if it goes to the archives pile?

13- Its not the case that the corp refills his hand all the time to 5 cards and that he discards all his cards after a turn, right?

 

Thank you very much for your time if you were so kind to answer these questions.



#2 wildfire393

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 02:59 AM

Turinqui said:

Hello all,

 

after I got the card game recently I tried to play some games with my brother sadly were both not native English speakers so we have some questions regarding the rules of the game that we couldnt find back in the rulebook or at this forum yet.

I want to appologize upfront if someone already asked for these questions but I sincerely couldnt find an answe yet, and some of these questions might seem very foolish to you but if you have the time and can spend the effort we really would like to know the answer.

1- What happens with the stack of the runner when he/she ran out of cards, will the cards on the heap pile get shuffeled again and put back in the heap or is it just to bad that there no cards left anymore?

2- If the corp has more then 1 ICE of the same subkind, for example, 2 of the subtype codewall, can the runner use only 1 program to break first the 1st ICE and then the same program to break the 2nd ICE.

3- The card "Personal Touch" can you freely move it around any icebreaker card you have? Can you stack more then 1 on any icebreaker card? Can you use it for example when you encounter an ICE on icebreaker 1 and then when you encounter ICE 2 on an other icebrekaer?

4- What is the use for the runner to take a run at the archives server? Why would a corp discard a agenda card  there in the first place?

5- What is the use of the NON agenda cards that a runner may acces in the R&D server? Is it just to make the R&D pile go emptier faster so the runners wins that way? If the the cards have a trash cost and you can pay it you trash it if you cant pay it it  goes back to the server but if there is no cost it can be trashed in archives but will be it be faced up or faced down?

6- The card "Crypsis" can you keep spending credits to increase the cards strength, for example you pay 10 credits to gain 10 strenght?

7- The card "Nisei MK II" what does this card mean at all? What does the agenda token and what does it do?

8- If you have as the runner the cards "Magnus Opus" and "Armitage Codebusting" at teh same time is that any use at all?  Since you can get 2 credits for 1 click ALL the time for "Magnus Opus".

9- When do you lay cards face up or face down in the archives server?

10 - For the Corp, do you lay assets always face up or face down in the remote server? And what about assets that are an ambush?

11- The card "pipeline" does it work against teh card "Hunter" and can it break the subroutine trace then?

12- Do you lay traps/ambushes on the archives pile after a Runner made a run against your trap/ambush. Or do you leave them in the remote server? And o you lay them face up or face down if it goes to the archives pile?

13- Its not the case that the corp refills his hand all the time to 5 cards and that he discards all his cards after a turn, right?

 

Thank you very much for your time if you were so kind to answer these questions.

 

1. If the stack runs out, it's out. The runner doesn't lose, but he can't draw cards anymore - which puts him at risk of losing to running out of cards in hand, as he can no longer refresh this card supply.

2. Yes, you may use the same program to break any number of Ice of the same type. Just remember that boosting strength only lasts for the duration of an encounter with one specific Ice (with the exception of Pipeline, Battering Ram, and Gordian Blade, which last the duration of a run). So if the corporation has Enigma followed by Tollbooth on one server, you can use ZU.13 Keymaster to break both, but you will have to pay 1 to pump it to 2, then 2 to break the subroutines of Enigma, then 4 to pump it from 1 to 5 and 1 to break the subroutine of Tollbooth.

3. No. When you play Personal Touch, you choose an Icebreaker to attach it to. It only has an effect on that Icebreaker, and you cannot move it around.

4. The corporation has to discard at the end of the turn if they have more than 5 cards in hand. This is pretty common when the corp spends their 3 actions activating Melange Mining Corporation. The corporation may choose to discard an agenda card this way, because they want to keep all of the other cards in their hand. They might also choose to replace an Agenda at the node of a remote server, for whatever reason (maybe to convince you that it was an Ambush and the new card is an Agenda). Additionally, if your identity is Noise, you cause the Corporation to discard cards from the top of R&D, which can cause Agendas to go into archives. Finally, Accelerated Beta Test causes any non-Ice cards in the top 3 cards of R&D to be trashed to the Archives. Any of these circumstances can cause agendas to end up in the Archives, so it's a good idea to run on them occasionally, if only to keep the corporation "honest".

5. By Trashing an Upgrade or Asset card (the only cards with Trash costs), you stop the Corporation from being able to draw that card. Additionally, on your next run on R&D that turn, you get to see an additional card to Trash or Score. It also helps push the Corporation to the empty R&D loss condition. If you cannot trash the card, because it is an Operation or Ice, or because you do not have the credits to trash it, you are at least gaining information about what the corp will have access to in upcoming turns.

6. Yes, as with any Icebreaker, there is no limit to how many times you may trigger their paid abilities to increase their strength. Just remember that it only lasts for the duration of the encounter with a piece of Ice.

7. When you score it, you place a counter on it. It then has the paid ability with the cost of removing the agenda counter on it in order to end the runner's current run. Effectively "Hosted X Counter: Effect" means that you remove a counter of that type hosted (on) the card as the cost of the ability.

8. Magnum Opus does make Armitage Codebusting Redundant. However, MO costs 2 Memory Units, so you may want to trash it at some point to play other programs.

9. Cards stay in the face up/face down position they were in before being trashed. If the corporation discards a card from his hand, installs replacing a facedown card, or gets cards trashed from his R&D without the runner seeing them (Noise's ability), the cards end up face down in Archives. If the Corporation Trashes a face up card (like Corporate Troubleshooter), installs replacing a faceup card, plays an Operation, or has the runner Trash a card he is accessing, the card ends up Face Up in the archives.

10. All cards the Corporation Installs are installed face down. This includes Ice, Assets (even Ambushes), Agendas, and Upgrades. They are only turned face-up upon being rezzed, or temporarily while the Runner is accessing or exposing them.

11. Yes. Pipeline is a Killer that breaks Sentry Subroutines, and Hunter is a Sentry. If you buff Pipeline's strength to equal Hunter's strength, you may break its Trace subroutine.

12. If the runner accesses an Asset or Upgrade installed on one of your servers, he may choose to trash it by paying its trash cost, which puts it into your Archives face-up. If he does not trash it, it remains installed on the server in whichever position it was in (face up or face down).

13. No. The corporation only draws cards at the start of each of his turns, and may additionally draw cards by spending 1 Click per card.



#3 Toqtamish

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 03:03 AM

Turinqui said:

Hello all,

 

after I got the card game recently I tried to play some games with my brother sadly were both not native English speakers so we have some questions regarding the rules of the game that we couldnt find back in the rulebook or at this forum yet.

I want to appologize upfront if someone already asked for these questions but I sincerely couldnt find an answe yet, and some of these questions might seem very foolish to you but if you have the time and can spend the effort we really would like to know the answer.

1- What happens with the stack of the runner when he/she ran out of cards, will the cards on the heap pile get shuffeled again and put back in the heap or is it just to bad that there no cards left anymore?

2- If the corp has more then 1 ICE of the same subkind, for example, 2 of the subtype codewall, can the runner use only 1 program to break first the 1st ICE and then the same program to break the 2nd ICE.

3- The card "Personal Touch" can you freely move it around any icebreaker card you have? Can you stack more then 1 on any icebreaker card? Can you use it for example when you encounter an ICE on icebreaker 1 and then when you encounter ICE 2 on an other icebrekaer?

4- What is the use for the runner to take a run at the archives server? Why would a corp discard a agenda card  there in the first place?

5- What is the use of the NON agenda cards that a runner may acces in the R&D server? Is it just to make the R&D pile go emptier faster so the runners wins that way? If the the cards have a trash cost and you can pay it you trash it if you cant pay it it  goes back to the server but if there is no cost it can be trashed in archives but will be it be faced up or faced down?

6- The card "Crypsis" can you keep spending credits to increase the cards strength, for example you pay 10 credits to gain 10 strenght?

7- The card "Nisei MK II" what does this card mean at all? What does the agenda token and what does it do?

8- If you have as the runner the cards "Magnus Opus" and "Armitage Codebusting" at teh same time is that any use at all?  Since you can get 2 credits for 1 click ALL the time for "Magnus Opus".

9- When do you lay cards face up or face down in the archives server?

10 - For the Corp, do you lay assets always face up or face down in the remote server? And what about assets that are an ambush?

11- The card "pipeline" does it work against teh card "Hunter" and can it break the subroutine trace then?

12- Do you lay traps/ambushes on the archives pile after a Runner made a run against your trap/ambush. Or do you leave them in the remote server? And o you lay them face up or face down if it goes to the archives pile?

13- Its not the case that the corp refills his hand all the time to 5 cards and that he discards all his cards after a turn, right?

 

Thank you very much for your time if you were so kind to answer these questions.

Turinqui said:

1- What happens with the stack of the runner when he/she ran out of cards, will the cards on the heap pile get shuffeled again and put back in the heap or is it just to bad that there no cards left anymore?

2- If the corp has more then 1 ICE of the same subkind, for example, 2 of the subtype codewall, can the runner use only 1 program to break first the 1st ICE and then the same program to break the 2nd ICE.

3- The card "Personal Touch" can you freely move it around any icebreaker card you have? Can you stack more then 1 on any icebreaker card? Can you use it for example when you encounter an ICE on icebreaker 1 and then when you encounter ICE 2 on an other icebrekaer?

4- What is the use for the runner to take a run at the archives server? Why would a corp discard a agenda card  there in the first place?

5- What is the use of the NON agenda cards that a runner may acces in the R&D server? Is it just to make the R&D pile go emptier faster so the runners wins that way? If the the cards have a trash cost and you can pay it you trash it if you cant pay it it  goes back to the server but if there is no cost it can be trashed in archives but will be it be faced up or faced down?

6- The card "Crypsis" can you keep spending credits to increase the cards strength, for example you pay 10 credits to gain 10 strenght?

7- The card "Nisei MK II" what does this card mean at all? What does the agenda token and what does it do?

8- If you have as the runner the cards "Magnus Opus" and "Armitage Codebusting" at teh same time is that any use at all?  Since you can get 2 credits for 1 click ALL the time for "Magnus Opus".

9- When do you lay cards face up or face down in the archives server?

10 - For the Corp, do you lay assets always face up or face down in the remote server? And what about assets that are an ambush?

11- The card "pipeline" does it work against teh card "Hunter" and can it break the subroutine trace then?

12- Do you lay traps/ambushes on the archives pile after a Runner made a run against your trap/ambush. Or do you leave them in the remote server? And o you lay them face up or face down if it goes to the archives pile?

13- Its not the case that the corp refills his hand all the time to 5 cards and that he discards all his cards after a turn, right?

 

Thank you very much for your time if you were so kind to answer these questions.

 

1) Nothing happens as per the rules.

2) You can use icebreakers as many times as you want per run. There is no limit. Just need to pay for using them on each ice.

3) No, once installed on an icebreaker it stays on it.

4) Sometimes the corp has too many cards in hand, and Noises ability forces them to discard from R&D

5) Cards don't change facing when trashed. Cards with no trash cost listed cannot be trashed under normal circumstances. 0 cost cards can be trashed for free. Sometimes the runner might not want to pay to trash that card.

6) Yes you can use the ability as many times as you want/can afford.

7) The agenda counter lets you end the run for free by removing the counter

8) Both are good money generators but both at the same time probably not necessary. Stil Armitage Codebusting is a resource and can be trashed by the corp if the runner is tagged

9) Face up if they were installed, facedown if they were not rezzed or trashed from R&D. Cards don't change their facing when trashed.

10) All cards are installed face down until rezzed.

11) If you boost its strength to 4 yes. Hunter is a sentry and Pipelin is a killer icebreaker.

12) If the runner trashes the card it gets trashed, and really it is unlikely a runner would not do that.

13) No, why would you think that ?



#4 Turinqui

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 03:18 AM

Thank you so very much for these clear answers, it will really help me playing this game the way it is supposed to be.

Thank you for your time, and if I encounter any more things we dont understand Im happy to know there are kind people that are willing to help out to make things clear.



#5 TheRealLeo

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 01:36 PM

I know there have been a couple responses already (and good ones at that), but I just wanted to elaborate further on some of the points they have brought up, and offer a few other insights that might be of use.

1. Unfortunately, when the runner is out of cards, the runner is out of cards. He/She gets no love from the rules in this case. Usually this is a losing situation for the runner, as it typically means they have run out of credit-generating cards, but I have seen a runner or two pull out a win even in this dire situation.

2. The answers to this question thus far are correct, but I noticed you phrased your question in a way similar to previous posters that eventually led to lots of confusion. Just to be clear, Subroutines on ICE are "broken", not ICE themselves. I know this seems rather minor, but given the way some other conversations turned out in regards to this issue, I think it would be best to make sure it is very clear exactly what gets broken.
   As far as the question itself, you and the others are correct. You can use the same icebreaker to break subroutines on multiple pieces of ICE during the same run (and on every run for that matter). The only two conditions that need to be fulfilled in order to use an icebreaker are: 1) The icebreaker's strength matches the ICE's strength; and 2) the icebreaker is able to break subroutines of the type matching the ICE, or can just break any kind of subroutine (ex. Crypsis and Wyrm).
   There is no need for a different icebreaker that breaks the same type of subroutines, unless maybe you are going for efficiency, since some icebreakers break subroutines on certain ICE for cheaper than others. However, in the long run, it is usually best to just use one icebreaker per type of ICE. Makes it easier to focus your deck, and is more efficient with your MU.

3. Personal Touch (as well as any other card) cannot be moved once it is installed. The icebreaker you choose for Personal Touch will keep Personal Touch until either that icebreaker is trashed, or Personal Touch is trashed. If that never happens, then Personal Touch will stay put.
   Generally speaking, the rule about installed cards not being moved around doesn't often matter for the Runner, and most players tend to move cards around anyway, just to better organize their rig. However, it will matter for cards like Parasite, Djinn, and, of course, Personal Touch. You just have to remember that once a card is installed, that's it. You can't move a program onto Djinn later on if you've already installed it normally. You can't move a Parasite from one ICE to another, nor can you play it onto Djinn to conserve MU. Likewise, Personal Touch will stay with the program of choice for the lifetime of that program, or for the lifetime of Personal Touch, whichever is shorter.

4. There are a few uses for running Archives:
- 1) Information. You don't always get to see what the Corp trashes, so you might want to run the archives just so you know exactly what has been trashed, and what might still be left in the deck. It's not often a useful tactic, but it can come in handy now and then.
- 2) Agendas. There are several ways that agendas can end up in the Archives. Why would the Corp player discard an agenda? Because you asked the question. The fact that you are asking suggests that you think it illogical for any Corp player to ever willingly discard an agenda, and some Corp players may prey on such notions by attempting to hide agendas in their Archives. I myself have successfully hidden agends in my archives on numerous occasions, even undefended. I can only recall one time where a runner actually called my bluff. So, when playing the runner, it is always best to keep the Corp honest. Don't ever take for granted the idea that the Corp would never discard an agenda.
- 3) Datasucker. Most Corp players don't usually care to defend their Archives all that heavily, so if you use Datasuckers to fuel your icebreakers, then Archives is the most logical server to attack to build them up when you need to get them going.
- 4) TBA. We still have a fairly limited pool of cards to work with. Who knows what other devious cards the runners will get to manipulate the Archives. I wouldn't be surprised if there comes a time when every Corp player makes significant efforts to wall up their Archives just as much as HQ and R&D, just to prevent the possibility of some nasty runner card(s) ruining their day.

5. Information is power! I'm sure you've heard that phrase before, and it holds true in this case as well. Knowing what the Corp player is about to get can be of great use to the runner, if only to have an idea of what they are about to face. Plus, if you manage to snag an agenda, that's just icing on the cake!
   And you are actually incorrect on trashing cards. Only cards with a trash icon can be trashed. If there is no icon, the runner cannot trash that card. They will only get to look at it, and then it goes back on top (unless it's an agenda, of course).
   A good strategy for any Runner would be to make a run on R&D at least once a turn, and as early in the turn as possible. That way, you're able to see a lot of what is coming for the Corp, and you can likely get to any agendas before the Corp player. Of course, just like any strategy, there are a few exceptions to this.

6. You can indeed spend any number of credits to boost its strength. However, it is (currently) of no benefit to you, as each icebreaker (with a few explicit exceptions) resets its strength after each encounter with a piece of ICE, so all those credits you spent to boost the strength will go to waste unless you were able to use the boost for some reason (like breaking subroutines).

7. The Nisei Mark II is, as far as I can tell, the second generation of Nisei precogs in the Android universe, which basically means… I don't really have a clue what they are pensativo, other than they are very Minority Report-ish in flavor.
   As far as the ability goes, the portion about the agenda counter follows the standard "cost: effect" model outlined in the rules for Paid Abilities (pg. 21, Core Rulebook). Thus, the cost for the ability is spending the agenda counter on the card (discarding it), and the effect is to end a run currently in progress. This ability can be used any time a paid ability can normally be used during a run. For more information on when you can use it, you should refer to the Run Timing Chart in the back of the rulebook.

8. There is not really any good reason to have both Magnum Opus and Armitage Codebusting in play at the same time. However, that does not necessarily mean it is not a good idea to have both in the same deck. Magnum Opus is good to have in the early game, when you just need to build your economy, but the 2 MU cost can get in the way later on, so you will probably want to overwrite it at some point. Having Armitage in your deck can allow you to deal with losing Magnum Opus by still giving you that option to keep building up your economy, just on a more limited basis.
   Some players feel that just using one or the other is usually a better idea, and it can be, given the right circumstances. If you are willing to invest in MU-building cards, like Akamatsu Mem Chip, The Toolbox, Grimoire, or even Djinn, then just having Magnum Opus is probably a good call, as you probably won't need to worry about running out of MU. However, if you have a hard time paying higher costs (5+ credits), and just want something quick and easy, Armitage is probably going to be your go-to card. It just really depends on your style of play, and what you feel your deck can handle.

9. Always a tricky question to answer, but the general rule of thumb is: any card that the runner was able to see at the time it was trashed goes in face-up. Everything else goes in face-down. So, if the runner is paying a trash cost to trash an asset or upgrade, that means they saw it, so it goes in face-up. If the Corp player is overwriting ICE cards during an action in which he/she installs another piece of ICE, it goes in face-up if the trashed ICE was rezzed, or face-down if it was unrezzed. If the Corp plays an operation, the runner gets to see the operation, so it is trashed face-up when the Corp finishes resolving its ability. If the Corp has more cards in hand than their hand limit at the end of their turn, they must discard down, and since the runner doesn't have viewing privileges at that time, the discarded cards go face-down.
   The only thing that can be a bit confusing in regard to this rule is Noise's identity ability (trash the top card of R&D after playing a virus). Just know that when you use Noise's ability, the trashed card goes face-down, since the runner was not viewing it at that point in time.

10. Assets are always installed face-down (with vertical orientation) into a remote server, even ambush assets. Just like most any other cards the Corp player installs, they are inactive until rezzed (or accessed, in the case of ambush assets).

11. Pipeline can indeed be used to break Hunter's subroutine. It would be very costly without any help from other cards (7 credits), but it is indeed possible.
   For that matter, any subroutine that causes a trace to happen can be broken with the right icebreaker, which allows the runner to simply avoid the trace altogether. However, sometimes it might actually be cheaper for the Runner to just let the trace happen, and either pay it off, or deal with the consequences of a successful trace. It just all depends on the situation.

12. Ambush/trap cards are only ever trashed if either the Runner chooses to trash them when they access them, or when the Corp player overwrites them by installing a new asset or agenda into the same server. In the case of the Runner trashing them, the card is placed face-up in the Archives. In the case of the Corp trashing them, it is only placed face-up in the Archives if the card was rezzed. Otherwise, it is placed in the Archives face-down.

13. Indeed, that is not the case. The only drawing that the Corp is required to do, by rule, is to draw 1 card at the start of his or her turn, and the only discarding that the Corp is required to do, by rule, is discarding down to maximum handsize (5, unless otherwise modified by card abilities) at the end of his or her turn. All other card drawing/discarding is going to be dictated by card abilities, or by the Corp player spending actions (clicks) to draw cards.

 

I hope this helps some.






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