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How good is marksmanship?


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#1 The_Brown_Bomber

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 09:29 AM

Marksmanship (3)
Action: When attacking this round, you may change one of your  results to a  result and all your other  results to  results.

 

would be interested in how you have used this skill and how highly you rate it. it seems better on rebel pilots due to their increased attacking power but the tie interceptor has 3 attack dice too so will Marksmanship see more play with wave2 ships like the interceptor?

i have seen Marksmanship used in a 6-ship Imperial build placed on 4 Black Squadron Pilots with devestating effect. Add Howlrunners reroll ability and you have some heavy firepower on a par with x-wing rookie pilots.


"There will be a substantial reward for anyone who finds the Millenium Falcon. You are free to use whatever means necessary, but I want them alive. No disintegration!".

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#2 Major Mishap

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 10:22 AM

 Marksmanship can be very good, often making the difference between damaging a ship and destroying it but plain Focus is more versatile as if you don't roll any 'eyes' when shooting you might still be able to use Focus when defending.  Marksmanship is probably at its best when paired with a toredo.



#3 ShadowJak

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 11:21 AM

It is the worst upgrade in the game.

I've explained it on AFM but the main problem with it is that crits suck so all the other upgrades are better and/or cost less. Crits are worth only about 1.2348 damage and they are usually only good on at most 1/3 of a ship's HP. Crit on a shield? Too bad, it is just a hit. Crit on a ship's last point of Hull? Congratulations, you could have done the same thing with a normal hit anyway. All of that is without even taking into account when crits have no additional effect or are negated by abilities and upgrades.



#4 Icedragon

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:24 PM

what is "crits" mean?

 



#5 Eruletho

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:32 PM

"crits" is the common term for the open explosion hit, that make you use the face of the damage card instead of the back.



#6 Parakitor

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:38 PM

Icedragon said:

what is "crits" mean?

To add to the above comment, "crit" is short for "critical hit."

The other thing that makes Marksmanship generally better on Rebels is that you don't have to whittle the shields away before it's useful. Since shields nullify critical hits, it's wiser to use a simiple Focus action, I think.

But once it's down to hull, Marksmanship can make a huge difference. Sure, Shadow Jak, they're only worth 1.23 damage (if all you want is the Direct Hit or other damage-inflicting cards), but don't forget about other goodies like "Blinded Pilot" which prevents the affected ship from rolling any dice on its next attack, which can make a huge difference defensively.

The operative word with the above statement is "can." It has the potential to be awesome. For me, it's just a little too risky for 3 points. As has been pointed out above, I like the versatility of the Focus action, which can be used for knowledge and defense in addition to attack.


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#7 The_Brown_Bomber

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:48 PM

i can see marksmanship needing additional synergy to make it more playable. taking it as a free action for example. Sqaud leader or lando perhaps?


"There will be a substantial reward for anyone who finds the Millenium Falcon. You are free to use whatever means necessary, but I want them alive. No disintegration!".

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#8 The_Brown_Bomber

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:48 PM

The_Brown_Bomber said:

i can see marksmanship needing additional synergy to make it more playable. taking it as a free action for example. Sqaud leader or lando perhaps?

 

the problem is of course is that for 3pts you can get something better eh?


"There will be a substantial reward for anyone who finds the Millenium Falcon. You are free to use whatever means necessary, but I want them alive. No disintegration!".

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#9 dbmeboy

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:49 PM

It seems like its best use is combined with cluster missiles since, unlike focus, it would apply to both of the attacks.  Of course, it would be pretty hard to justify spending the points (and upgrade slot) on Marksmanship for a single-use weapon like cluster missiles.



#10 Duraham

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 01:36 PM

dbmeboy said:

 

It seems like its best use is combined with cluster missiles since, unlike focus, it would apply to both of the attacks.  Of course, it would be pretty hard to justify spending the points (and upgrade slot) on Marksmanship for a single-use weapon like cluster missiles.

 

 

 

you can further extend that to the big ships with gunner/luke on them



#11 cleardave

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 01:53 PM

dbmeboy said:

It seems like its best use is combined with cluster missiles since, unlike focus, it would apply to both of the attacks.  Of course, it would be pretty hard to justify spending the points (and upgrade slot) on Marksmanship for a single-use weapon like cluster missiles.

It's not too bad if you were using it on Vader in that application.  When you move into range of the Cluster Missile, you can Target Lock and Marksmanship for Vader's two Actions, then let the missiles go for maximum effect.

Once the missiles are gone, you still have Marksmanship, so if you can keep Vader at Range 1 of his targets, you can  always have one Action devoted to Marksmanship, and still use the other one to Barrel Roll out of an arc, or, if you've got no escape, either drop a Target Lock to go all-in on the damage dealing potential, or drop an evade to play it safe if you're not certain that you can close out the kill.

It's corner-case, but if you're using someone like Howlrunner to Swarm Tactics and escort some Academy Pilots, Vader works quite well as a Lone Wolf flanker type.



#12 The_Brown_Bomber

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 05:38 PM

Sabre Squadron Pilot (21) + Marksmanship (3) = 24

Sabre Squadron Pilot (21) + Marksmanship (3) = 24

Howlrunner (18) + Marksmanship (3) = (21)

Darth Vader (29) + Squad Leader (2) = (31)

 

Fly as a tight formation + 3 attack die + free reroll with Sabre Squadron. Vader supports with free action (free evade or barrel roll while they go offensive or barrel roll).

 


"There will be a substantial reward for anyone who finds the Millenium Falcon. You are free to use whatever means necessary, but I want them alive. No disintegration!".

Lord Vader


#13 ShadowJak

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 05:49 PM

ShadowJak said:

It is the worst upgrade in the game.

I've explained it on AFM but the main problem with it is that crits suck so all the other upgrades are better and/or cost less. Crits are worth only about 1.2348 damage and they are usually only good on at most 1/3 of a ship's HP. Crit on a shield? Too bad, it is just a hit. Crit on a ship's last point of Hull? Congratulations, you could have done the same thing with a normal hit anyway. All of that is without even taking into account when crits have no additional effect or are negated by abilities and upgrades.

 

1/3 of a ship's HP should have been 2/3



#14 Hrathen

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 06:00 PM

My problem with Marksmanship is that though it can be debated as t whether it is better ot worse than Focus, Focus is free for every ship and Marksmanship  cost 3 points.  That is one of the most expensince upgrades you can take.  There are not Elite Pilot Upgrades that cost more.

There are arguments to be made for its usefulness with cluster missiles, gunner/Luke Skywalker crew upgrade, or with Maarek.  But in each case you have to spend even more points to make the upgrade worth while.  I would also point out that I find both Cluster Missiles and Maarek to be over priced for what you get.  And if you take Luke Skywalker crew upgrade you already get to change one of your focus icons into a hit on the second shot.  So that limits the need for Marksmanship.

Though I don't like it, I will not contend with those who say that it is good, and say that it is worthless.  But I will say that just about any other use of three points is probably better.   R2D2, Swarm Tactics and Vetran Instincts, Steath, not to mention changing one of your ships to one that costs three points better.

Quick examples Maarek + Marksmanship costs one more point than Darth Vader.  I would prefer Darth Vader any time.


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#15 crimzonteerz

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 06:31 PM

Parakitor said:

Icedragon said:

 which can be used for knowledge and defense in addition to attack.

 

Ha, i see what you did there! Yoda ftw!



#16 Sgt. G

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 06:33 PM

 

 well.. i dont know or use all the math behind all the percentages. BUT.. i love to load out Mauler and maybe 1 or 2 academy pilots with it..

 

 its just tactical flexablity and target over load. and i like how it can turn a miss into a crit.

 

i use it alot… and it has only ever failed me when i forget it.



#17 godofcheese

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 06:44 PM

Sgt. G said:

 

 well.. i dont know or use all the math behind all the percentages. BUT.. i love to load out Mauler and maybe 1 or 2 academy pilots with it..

 

 its just tactical flexablity and target over load. and i like how it can turn a miss into a crit.

 

i use it alot… and it has only ever failed me when i forget it.

 

Academy Pilots can't have marksmanship.



#18 Sgt. G

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 07:14 PM

 

 

 good point.

 

 sorry.. alil too much egg nog over here.



#19 The_Brown_Bomber

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 08:10 PM

What is funny is i run hot and then cold on Marksmanship. for 3 pts i agree it is way over costed. for your pts there are simply way better (and cheaper!) upgrades available.

Id like to see the card errated to allow +1 attack die at range two. even with this change tho, im not sure people would play it.

in general is say many people think its really only good on ships that have missiles to enhance the alpha strike tactic. so it seems that its over costed and is only good when u support it with other upgrades???


"There will be a substantial reward for anyone who finds the Millenium Falcon. You are free to use whatever means necessary, but I want them alive. No disintegration!".

Lord Vader


#20 Sgt. G

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 04:20 AM

 

 

 ok,

 

 all egg nog aside.

of the elite upgrades, i like it the best. I know im not in the majority here. But i dont use swarm tactics ( the card ) or squad leader. As i normaly use alot of low pilot TIEs. They are just kinda fluff to the way i play. Where as marksmenship can really add the damage when the time comes.

 

 Marksmenship on Mauler at range 1 with Howlrunner behind him. 4 dice with a reroll and a focus to crit upgrade…scares the sith outa luke or wedge every time. i use this to almost garentee that a ships' sheild are gone at least, by the time the academy pilots start shooting. THis also makes quick work of Y wings.

It may be pricy. But being able to take it on a named pilot and still stay under 20 points..not bad.

 

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