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Does this game defy accepted deck-building doctrine?


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#1 Syd

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Posted 21 December 2012 - 05:03 AM

I just picked up the game and have built some decks. Naturally I followed the almost ingrained principle of deckbuilding. Try to stick to the minimum allowed size, as this will maximize your chance of drawing what you need, when you need it. Now this holds true for any game that puts draw at a premium. But this game is different. You blaze through your deck so fast in this game, it seems to change that accepted credo of min. deck size being the best. Especially in Sith, where their Obj. allow you to turbo through your deck, I have found that a 50 card command deck may even be too small. I am going to try and build some large decks to test it, but I'm optimistic that it can work quite well.

Has anyone tried a large deck against a min size deck?



#2 Hurdoc

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Posted 21 December 2012 - 05:15 AM

Syd said:

I just picked up the game and have built some decks. Naturally I followed the almost ingrained principle of deckbuilding. Try to stick to the minimum allowed size, as this will maximize your chance of drawing what you need, when you need it. Now this holds true for any game that puts draw at a premium. But this game is different. You blaze through your deck so fast in this game, it seems to change that accepted credo of min. deck size being the best. Especially in Sith, where their Obj. allow you to turbo through your deck, I have found that a 50 card command deck may even be too small. I am going to try and build some large decks to test it, but I'm optimistic that it can work quite well.

Has anyone tried a large deck against a min size deck?

I think that larger decks are going to be quite viable, right from the get go. I don't mean 100 card decks but 60-70 would be acceptable. It depends on the synergy between the objectives you choose. I do love the way this game makes you go through your deck. In so many other games, the cards you want may never come out unless you can search for them, or you have to keep 3-4 copies in you deck.



#3 Ulairi

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Posted 21 December 2012 - 06:21 AM

Syd said:

I just picked up the game and have built some decks. Naturally I followed the almost ingrained principle of deckbuilding. Try to stick to the minimum allowed size, as this will maximize your chance of drawing what you need, when you need it. Now this holds true for any game that puts draw at a premium. But this game is different. You blaze through your deck so fast in this game, it seems to change that accepted credo of min. deck size being the best. Especially in Sith, where their Obj. allow you to turbo through your deck, I have found that a 50 card command deck may even be too small. I am going to try and build some large decks to test it, but I'm optimistic that it can work quite well.

Has anyone tried a large deck against a min size deck?

 

Isn't the decksize determained by the objective sets? IF we have 10 objective sets at 5 cards each, we end up with a 60 card deck. Am I missing something? 



#4 vandertramps

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Posted 21 December 2012 - 06:25 AM

10 objectives is just the minimum, you can include as many objective sets as you'd like



#5 Entropy42

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Posted 21 December 2012 - 07:56 AM

Ulairi said:

Syd said:

 

I just picked up the game and have built some decks. Naturally I followed the almost ingrained principle of deckbuilding. Try to stick to the minimum allowed size, as this will maximize your chance of drawing what you need, when you need it. Now this holds true for any game that puts draw at a premium. But this game is different. You blaze through your deck so fast in this game, it seems to change that accepted credo of min. deck size being the best. Especially in Sith, where their Obj. allow you to turbo through your deck, I have found that a 50 card command deck may even be too small. I am going to try and build some large decks to test it, but I'm optimistic that it can work quite well.

Has anyone tried a large deck against a min size deck?

 

 

 

Isn't the decksize determained by the objective sets? IF we have 10 objective sets at 5 cards each, we end up with a 60 card deck. Am I missing something? 

Also, your objectives are not part of your command deck, so your actual deck is only 50 cards (5x10).



#6 Magni

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Posted 21 December 2012 - 09:10 AM

Expanding to 60 might strenghen some combos however in most of my games i have noticed that the game is won with about 15 cards left, the Deathclock makes it hard to draw a game out to long. 

I could see in the future building rebel decks with more cards and focusing all my objectives on card draw just to burn through to that 1 killer combo.

but yeah, depending on what future objectives do, i could see myself going through my deck much much faster.

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#7 dbmeboy

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Posted 21 December 2012 - 09:58 AM

I think going to 11 or 12 objective sets will not be a horrible idea.  However, you'll still have less variation on your draws with 10 sets than you will with 12 so 12 will still have that slight disadvantage.  Arguably, making a Magic deck with 61 cards is barely a disadvantage as well, but (almost) nobody does that either…



#8 carnage4u

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Posted 21 December 2012 - 11:19 AM

so since some of the objectives can have 2x of them I suppose buying 2 base sets and 2 of every expansion would be required?

 

Or am I reading that wrong?



#9 Vaapad

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Posted 21 December 2012 - 12:26 PM

carnage4u said:

so since some of the objectives can have 2x of them I suppose buying 2 base sets and 2 of every expansion would be required?

 

Or am I reading that wrong?

 

From the annoucnement describing the first Force Pack:

"Because Star Wars: The Card Game introduces a new set-building design to our collection of LCGs, the distribution of cards in each Force Pack also differs from the model used for our other LCGs. Instead of gaining three copies of each new card, you’ll gain ten complete objective sets, including one copy of each “Limit 1” objective set and two copies of each other objective set."

so you should not have to buy multiple copies of the same force pack


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#10 alpha5099

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Posted 21 December 2012 - 07:37 PM

carnage4u said:

so since some of the objectives can have 2x of them I suppose buying 2 base sets and 2 of every expansion would be required?

 

Or am I reading that wrong?

To expand on Vaapad's comment: you will absolutely not need to buy two of the Force Packs and other expansions when they come out, unless you for some reason need more copies of a pod than you can fit in a deck. In order to have all the Core Set objective sets in duplicate, you will need to buy a second Core, but whether that's "required" is up to you.



#11 Aahzmandius_Karrde

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 12:42 AM

alpha5099 said:

carnage4u said:

 

so since some of the objectives can have 2x of them I suppose buying 2 base sets and 2 of every expansion would be required?

 

Or am I reading that wrong?

 

 

To expand on Vaapad's comment: you will absolutely not need to buy two of the Force Packs and other expansions when they come out, unless you for some reason need more copies of a pod than you can fit in a deck. In order to have all the Core Set objective sets in duplicate, you will need to buy a second Core, but whether that's "required" is up to you.

Force Packs, definately not.  I won't be suprised if 2 copies of Edge of Darkness isn't advised.  It "contains pre-assembled decks" for the other 2 factions so I won't be suprised if it's just 1 copy of each Objective set.


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#12 vandertramps

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 03:36 AM

Aahzmandius_Karrde said:

alpha5099 said:

 

carnage4u said:

 

so since some of the objectives can have 2x of them I suppose buying 2 base sets and 2 of every expansion would be required?

 

Or am I reading that wrong?

 

 

To expand on Vaapad's comment: you will absolutely not need to buy two of the Force Packs and other expansions when they come out, unless you for some reason need more copies of a pod than you can fit in a deck. In order to have all the Core Set objective sets in duplicate, you will need to buy a second Core, but whether that's "required" is up to you.

 

 

Force Packs, definately not.  I won't be suprised if 2 copies of Edge of Darkness isn't advised.  It "contains pre-assembled decks" for the other 2 factions so I won't be suprised if it's just 1 copy of each Objective set.

going by their other lcg's (esp agot, which has deluxe expansions that introduce new factions) i would imagine you'd only need one copy.

but i guess we'll find out



#13 alpha5099

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 08:02 PM

vandertramps said:

going by their other lcg's (esp agot, which has deluxe expansions that introduce new factions) i would imagine you'd only need one copy.

but i guess we'll find out

Yeah, FFG has been extremely consistent in providing a complete set of cards in every non-Core Set release for all of their LCGs. They didn't start out that way, so the original AGOT Chapter Packs were forty cards (ten distinct cards in triplicate, ten distinct cards as singles), and the first expansion packs contained one copy of each card. But everything's been revised in triplicate releases for the older LCGs like AGOT, and all new products have provided three copies of every card.

The only objective sets we'll see as singletons in the upcoming deluxe expansions will be pods that are One Per Deck.



#14 DrNate

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 07:39 AM

Sometimes they offer a more than complete set of cards in an expansion pack, with more copies of a card that you would ever use (netrunner identities).

This thread makes me feel a little better about the two or three decks that are currently sitting at 11 objectives and I can't get them narrowed down to 10 (it's hard for me to figure out which objective sets aren't working in my deck unless I have the entire set list memorized, unlike single cards: if any of them aren't working you just remove them).  I still kind of feel obligated to try to get them to 10, though. 



#15 Magni

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 10:42 AM

I have a jedi deck that i really want Ben in, but i cant give up the "In you must go" to justify the Mind Trick and the Ben, i just wanna pull luke/red5/redemption as fast as possible and any cards getting in the way of my luke/yoda are just not worth it.

Magni


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magni strikes with greedo for 2 unit damage to Han Solo and 1 Blast Damage.


#16 snaggrriss

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Posted 28 December 2012 - 10:20 AM

both deck suggestions from ffg have you using 2 cores. helps you zero in on a strategy. wonder how they're going to do the expansions? are they going to make you buy multiple expansions to get multiple objectives that you want in  your deck. I wish thrones did the 3 of a kind thing from the start!



#17 LMKComaBlack

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Posted 28 December 2012 - 05:30 PM

Magni said:

I have a jedi deck that i really want Ben in, but i cant give up the "In you must go" to justify the Mind Trick and the Ben, i just wanna pull luke/red5/redemption as fast as possible and any cards getting in the way of my luke/yoda are just not worth it.

Magni

 

I know Redemption is 5, but as for Luke/Ben/Yoda, I played an ultra tight game where I only had 4 resources the whole game.  Yoda was out.  Yoda died. Return of the Yoda.  Luke.  Buff Yoda.  Win.  Two characters out and that was it.  Ben was only good for Edge that game, and his 5 cost was what made that the case.  If you realiably can get your 5th resource out, (which if you're running Redemption) you'll be fine, but there's a lot to be said for a max cost of 4.  You can always play every card you draw, often times two cards, one zero cost trick, and two or three cards for the edge battle.  If you're taking your time until you can destroy and objective with one strike, that gives you turn after turn of slow build and control of the force.

 



#18 Toqtamish

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 01:14 AM

snaggrriss said:

both deck suggestions from ffg have you using 2 cores. helps you zero in on a strategy. wonder how they're going to do the expansions? are they going to make you buy multiple expansions to get multiple objectives that you want in  your deck. I wish thrones did the 3 of a kind thing from the start!

 

As was already said earlier in this thread and also in FFGs announcement of the expansion cycles. You get two of each objective set except for the ones that say limit of 1 per deck. And it wasn't just Thrones that started the other way and then changed to 3 of each and Thrones has reprinted everything to be 3 of each card.






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