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Kessel Run Imperial list.


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#1 BTJ

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 06:42 AM

Ok, first of all, my first game of x-wing will actually take place during the Kessel Run event. So there's that. My proposed list is:

Vader with swarm tactics-31pts.

Mauler Mithel-17pts.

2xBlack Squadron Pilots-28pts.

2xAcademy pilots-24pts.

I only have Vader and 2 ties, so I'm prepared to buy another 3 ships for this list, so I'd rather work arounf that. Lastly, does anyone have any basic advice on using this stuff, cause I really haven't ever played this game before.



#2 Vorpal Sword

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 07:06 AM

BTJ said:

Ok, first of all, my first game of x-wing will actually take place during the Kessel Run event. So there's that. My proposed list is:

Vader with swarm tactics-31pts.

Mauler Mithel-17pts.

2xBlack Squadron Pilots-28pts.

2xAcademy pilots-24pts.

I only have Vader and 2 ties, so I'm prepared to buy another 3 ships for this list, so I'd rather work arounf that. Lastly, does anyone have any basic advice on using this stuff, cause I really haven't ever played this game before.

First off--nothing wrong with your list. 6 ships is a sweet spot for the Empire in my (admittedly fairly limited) experience, and you've got a nice mix of ships.

But if it were me, I would demote one of the Black Squadron Pilots to an Academy Pilot, then use the 2 points I save to upgrade the other Black Squadron Pilot into something more interesting--like Backstabber, for instance.

Alternatively, I might demote them both and use those 4 points to buy additional upgrades for Mithel and Vader--a concussion missile for Vader would be my preference, but there's an outside argument for Marksmanship on Mithel.



#3 BTJ

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 07:21 AM

Dark Curse might be an interesting one as he basically ignores focus and target locks when he's being shot at. I'm kind of worried about the amount of skill 1 pilots I have then though.

Are there any basic tactics that might help me struggle through? I'm banking on it being a small tourney at my LGS, so hopefully I can struggle into fourth place if I don't mess up too much.



#4 Eruletho

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:48 AM

The squad 1 pilots may shoot last, but they have 1 important disadvantage that you can easily turn into an advantage - they move first. If you can correctly guess where your opponent is going to move, you can stick a PS1 TIE there and either focus/evade, depending on if you think he's gonna move another ship into that TIE's firing arc. Then the rebel player hits you, and loses both his action and the ability to shoot your PS1 guy. Then your higher skill guys focus that guy down before he gets to shoot at anyone.

 

As for what to swap out, I'm a fan of 18 point Howlrunner, since she helps your army while they are within 1 range of her. All the 14 point TIEs do that the 12 point ones don't is shoot before rookiee X-wings and other PS1 TIEs, they may only barely make up their extra 4 points.

 

For tactics, you definitely want to focus fire. All TIEs have only 2 attack normally, (3 if range 1 or with Howlrunner, 4 with both) to try to punch through 2-4 defense die, depending on what you're shooting and where. Imp v Imp matches, I've heard, are a lot of shoot-miss-reposition, shoot-miss-reposition. The more firepower you're throwing at a single (preferably high-value) target, the more likely that your opponent will have 1 less ship to move next turn.



#5 BTJ

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:11 AM

Ok so, revised list is looking like:

Darth Vader with swarm tactics-31pts.

Mauler Mithel-17pts.

Dark Curse-16pts.

3xAcademy Pilots-36pts.



#6 Melkor503

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:31 AM

I think that your revised list looks great!  Mostly because I was planning on running the same list for my Kessel Run event.

I realize that a lot of the points go into Vader, so keeping him alive is very important.  Otherwise, your opponent might have the option to just let time run out.



#7 Hrathen

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:39 AM

I see you go rid of your Black Squadron for Obsidian Pilots, They are still better than Rebel Rookies, and Black Pilots are not better than Red-Squadron.

Dark Curse is Awsome, ignoring target locks and focus tokens is awsome when you realize that Rebels can target lock just about every turn.  He is harder to hit than Luke   Love him the curse.


Putting an end to this distructive conflict and bringing order to the galaxy.

#8 Hrathen

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:39 AM

I see you go rid of your Black Squadron for Obsidian Pilots, They are still better than Rebel Rookies, and Black Pilots are not better than Red-Squadron.

Dark Curse is Awsome, ignoring target locks and focus tokens is awsome when you realize that Rebels can target lock just about every turn.  He is harder to hit than Luke   Love him the curse.


Putting an end to this distructive conflict and bringing order to the galaxy.

#9 BTJ

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 10:16 AM

Hrathen said:

I see you go rid of your Black Squadron for Obsidian Pilots, They are still better than Rebel Rookies, and Black Pilots are not better than Red-Squadron.

Dark Curse is Awsome, ignoring target locks and focus tokens is awsome when you realize that Rebels can target lock just about every turn.  He is harder to hit than Luke   Love him the curse.

Nah, I went for academy pilots. If I had the 3 points spare I'd upgrade them all, but I'd better things to pick up. Besides, swarm tactics on Vader should help a bit with the low pilot rating with regards to shooting. How do I want asteroids set up? around the edges or to corral the other player somehow



#10 BTJ

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 01:46 PM

Another list I was thinking would be:

Darth Vader with swarm tactics-31pts.

Mauler with swarm tactics-19pts.

Either:

2xObsidian Squadron Pilots-26pts

Academy Pilot-12pts.

OR

Black Squadron Pilot-14pts.

2xAcademy Pilots-24pts.

Ok, I lose Dark Curse and his ability, but I can chain the two Swarm tactics together to focus fire something to death, or against other Imperial lists to shoot out TIEs pretty fast by splitting into pairs. Only issue is Mauler gets a nice big target painted on him, as he's kinda pricey for a TIE at this stage, and can possibly punch above his weight.

Just played a couple of practice games against myself though, and Vader is awesome for his two activations. Also discovered the joy of barrel rolling to get something into a fire arc. What's people's experience of Mauler though? I'm mainly asking because he is a little pricey so if he's less great at a competative level I'll drop him, but his four red dice at range one is amazing with a target lock or focus to really ruin an X-wing's day, or even to annoy a Y-wing.



#11 bergs206

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 02:43 PM

Here is a great list:

Vader + swarm tactics: 31

Howlruner + swarm tactics: 20

Obsidian Squadron Pilot: 13

Academy Pilot: 12

Academy Pilot: 12

Academy Pilot: 12

Thats a total of 100 points.  This is extremely similar / same to what the world champion won with this year.


Howlrunner:  Right now I feel like I could take on the whole Rebel Alliance myself. ...

Ten minutes later...  

Howlrunner:  Hey look I did...

 


#12 hothie

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 03:24 PM

Actually Berg, that's exactly what I played. But it's not just the squad, it's how you play it. Any experienced gamer will tell you that.

Honestly, I'd stick with this one:

Darth Vader with swarm tactics-31pts.

Mauler Mithel-17pts.

Dark Curse-16pts.

3xAcademy Pilots-36pts.

 

You asked about asteroid placement earlier, and with this build, you can be more flexible with where your opponent sets up his asteroids. Generally speaking, Imperial squads want to fly in formation and focus fire. With 6 TIEs and asteroids, that can get a little dicey, especially considering this will be your first tournament. With this build, you can split your squad up into 2 (or more) groups if you desire, and still not lose too much of your effectiveness. You'll still have 2 strong wings of TIEs coming in, and you'll be able to avoid asteroids better. Best advice is to practice some opening maneuvering with asteroids either by yourself or against someone. Try it with one formation and with 2, and see what you learn from that. Have a couple of xwings do their maneuvers as well, so you get a feel for ranges during the second turn, which is generally when combat starts. And you want to keep asteroids out of your way, but you can bet your opponent will be placing his in your way, which is why a 2-wing attack might be better at avoiding them. It's also less predictable, which is more flexibility for you.

And most of all, have fun! :)



#13 Eruletho

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 03:33 PM

question for you Doug: Why run the 13 pointer and give up initiative against 99-point builds for a few extra pilot-skill ranks on a single TIE. I can't imagine having the OSP over an AP was that huge of an advantage, over Vader and his swarmed buddy shooting firt every turn, with Howlrunner and her buddy right after them before the hortons and lukes of the world (NTM other howlrunners)



#14 hothie

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 03:41 PM

No one that I played brought 99 point builds. I actually won the coin flip every time and had initiative every game, which was a huge advantage. I ran the Obsidian because he's a pilot skill 3, and all Rebel scrubs are pilot skill 2, not to mention AP's are a 1. So, here's how it broke down:

Vader gives swarm tactics to 1 AP
Howlrunner gives Swarm tactics to another AP
Obsidian is level 3

That's 5 attacks before any Rebel scrubs or Academy Pilots can attack, with Howlrunner allowing my TIEs to reroll 1 attack die. That's a lot of successful hits all day long, and luckily, it was. That's why I chose the Obsidian. And I still had 3 AP's to "block" my opponent, so I still was able to use that tactic to my advantage as well.

But, with the talk here on the boards, it seems a lot of Rebel players will be bringing 99 point builds, just to win initiative. That's a whole different dynamic than we had a month ago.



#15 Eruletho

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 03:46 PM

When building my squads, I have only settled into one build using the full 100 points
Darth Vader
Cluster Missiles
Swarm Tactics

Tempest Squadron Pilot

Howlrunner
Swarm Tactics

Academy Pilot

Academy Pilot

Ironically enough, the idea here was similar to your build, with Howlrunner and Vader pumping the other TIE-A and one of the AP's. I[m pretty sure I'm going to run Rebel though, so there is that… Even my version of the TIE swarm uses only 99 points (3 OSP's and 5 APs instead of the 4/4 split at 100) to shoot for initiative



#16 BTJ

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:39 PM

Thanks for that Doug, that was pretty helpful. Is it worth dropping curse down to a plack squadron pilot to guarantee initiative though? Or even to night beast so I can contest it or even grab the initiative against people running the full hundred? And I'm assuming Vader runs with two of the APs and then Mauler, Curse and the last AP run together, if only to spread the pain around more. Or should I run the three APs together and then run my named pilots. That way I can wreck a rebel ship a turn(hopefully) and use the APs as a distraction. And in peoples experience, is there a particular size of Asteroid people tend to place down or does it matter?



#17 hothie

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 11:46 PM

If you keep your named pilots together, they become the main target. I'd go with vader in one wing and Mauler in the other, so your opponent will have to decide who to go after. The others you can divide however you want. And you will be placing 3 asteroids as well as your opponent. I'd go with the smaller ones, although it doesn't matter that much which ones you choose to use.

Also, given:
1. If you want to go with a less than 100 point build to help with initiative
2. If you want to fly as 2 wings (you honestly don't have to listen to a word I say. You can play however you want)

Then I would personally downgrade Mauler to Backstabber. That will really force your opponent to second guess his decision to go after Vader. Mauler gets an extra die at Range 1, backstabber gets it at all ranges, and if your opponent is going after vader, you'll get lots of chances to use backstabber's ability.



#18 voidstate

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 01:55 AM

I have been tinkering with a similar squadron: http://x-wing.voidstate.com/view/151

Except instead of Swarm Tactics, I give Vader Sqad Leader so he can pass off his 2nd action, and Howlrunner Expert Handling to shake off target locks. Between the +1 dice from howlrunner and +1 action from Vader, the Academy PIlots should become a lot more threatening…


· Try my Unoffical X-Wing Squadron Builder or see the 45,000+ squadrons other players have created.

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· Currently, I'm backpacking around SE Asia for a year with my wife and three identical triplet girls. Check out our blog to see where we've got to: Travels With Triplets.


#19 BTJ

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 02:54 AM

I was thinking squad leader, but I like Vader having a buddy to gang up on someone with.



#20 Grave13

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 12:06 PM

BTJ said:

Thanks for that Doug, that was pretty helpful. Is it worth dropping curse down to a plack squadron pilot to guarantee initiative though? Or even to night beast so I can contest it or even grab the initiative against people running the full hundred? And I'm assuming Vader runs with two of the APs and then Mauler, Curse and the last AP run together, if only to spread the pain around more. Or should I run the three APs together and then run my named pilots. That way I can wreck a rebel ship a turn(hopefully) and use the APs as a distraction. And in peoples experience, is there a particular size of Asteroid people tend to place down or does it matter?

  Im also planning on running a 99 point list just so i can in hopes get the initiative, My fears came true tonight when it was confirmed that I will be going against alot of empire lists, So I fear that there is going to be alot of Tie fighter spam , and there is the one guy who is going to be playing Rebels.

I'm almost half tempted to try and run a Rebels lists myself just so I wont be another guy playing an Impire list.  Now me only having three Rebel ships 2 x  X-wings and 1 x Y-wing i dont know how i could build a list with them that could hold there own against Tie fighter spam lists, And me not having much experience in playing Rebels i wonder if there is a way to run a solid four ship squad for Rebels. The hard thing is the rebles have so many goodies that I want to throw on the ships and they all cost so much, by the time I get a decent  looking list going im looking at 3 ships :(  Not trying to steal the thunder of this post but what would you do in this situation?






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