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CotDP (revised) Clarification on Mask Artifacts


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#1 Thomas Cartwright

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Posted 27 October 2012 - 08:36 AM

We just got the revised Curse of the Dark Pharaoh expansion and I'm wondering if I can get some confirmation that we're using the various "Mask of …" artifacts correctly. Mask of the Black Pharaoh, for example, reads:

"Any Phase: Exhaust this card to either use your Fight -1 instead of your Will for making a Will check or use your Will - 1 instead of your Fight for making a Fight check."

We've been allowing this mask to apply to Combat and Horror checks too, on the basis that they are subsets of Fight and Will checks. Same with Spell Checks and the Mask of Wisdom, and Evade Checks and the Mask of the Messenger. Is this the intent of these cards or are we making them too powerful?



#2 Julia

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Posted 27 October 2012 - 12:53 PM

The way you played it's fine for me. Items boosting your Will also boost your Horror checks (unless it's specifically said on the card, like the Make up kit, IIRC), so for me it's ok


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#3 The Professor

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Posted 27 October 2012 - 06:10 PM

I'm completely in agreement with Julia on this one ~ unless the card indicates something to the contrary, all primary skills (Fight, Will, Lore, etc,) affect secondary skills (Combat, Horror, Spell, etc.


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#4 Tbla

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 10:09 AM

I agree with the previous posts.



#5 Tibs

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 09:10 AM

Sounds okay to me, though I would say that Psychology and the ancillary ability from Persuade no longer work for this Horror check (it is now a Fight check, not a Will check!)



#6 Tbla

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 10:39 AM

Tibs said:

Sounds okay to me, though I would say that Psychology and the ancillary ability from Persuade no longer work for this Horror check (it is now a Fight check, not a Will check!)

I have to disagree on that since I think the card actually states that it is still a Will check:

"Exhaust this card to either use your Fight -1 instead of your Will for making a Will check or use your Will -1 instead of your Fight for making a Fight check."
(quote from the Arkham Horror Wiki)



#7 Tibs

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 11:36 AM

I believe that wording is there to declare that the mask can only be used on Will or Fight checks (not any other). It then goes on to swap one for the other. How else would it be worded assuming this were the case?

It seems unlikely that the checked stat would change, because then you could argue that both a Fight and a Will skill would aid you: a Fight skill naturally boosts your Fight, and a Will skill adds to Will checks, which is what you're asserting this is.

In other words, I don't think the semantic wording is cut-and-dried proof that the check changes skills.

 



#8 jgt7771

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 03:55 AM

I don't see how any of those Masks are any different than the Lore/Fight substitutions of the Storm of Spirits or the Black Pharaoh (what a coincidence, eh Tibs?).  I think if you drop the "-1", they're all worded the exact same way: use X for Y for a Y check.  In the example, you can boost your Fight directly, but not use "Fight Check" abilities on a Will Check: i.e. you can use the "Fight +1" of a Fight Skill, but not the Clue bonus; you can use the reroll ability of Persuade, but not the +1 boost; and you can use Psychology, but not Grapple.  (And reverse all that for Will on a Fight Check, etc…)


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#9 Thomas Cartwright

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 06:31 AM

I agree with your take on this, jgt7771. I think all of the modifiers from cards can be divided into those that give +/-n to an ability and those that say something about "[ability] check." The former get converted by the mask, the latter don't.

Since my initial question was about using the mask for Horror and Combat checks, I'm thinking that, in those situations, +/- Fight or Will get converted but +/- Combat or Horror do not. So you can still use your weapons when you use the mask to base a combat check on Will-1, and other cards affecting "combat checks" still apply.



#10 Tibs

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 11:55 AM

I think all of us will agree there. The base stat may have muddled things, but it is still a combat check.

A precedence for this is that, when you combat the Dark Pharaoh monster, you make a combat check with Lore as your base. However, Kevin has confirmed that weapons still offer their bonuses. "You are perhaps using the weapons in an unusual way" or something like that.






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