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#1 Smilingknight

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 01:38 PM

 Does anyone else find it odd that they never explain where the word ICE comes from in the rule book? Or at least explain the acronym? 

I mean, I figured it out, but I'm the kind of guy who goes on the message boards and per-orders board games. I don't think Jo schmo card player has any idea why they're playing ice cards and it'd be easy enough to have put it in the rule book



#2 booored

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 02:14 PM

 

like 90% of the terminology on the game it comes from William Gibson's book that defined the cyberpunk genre… Intrusion Countermeasures Electronics. There is no need to explain it.. it is a nod to fans geeks… not mentioning it is kinda the point.


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#3 kaffis

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 03:07 PM

 It's not the only common Cyberpunk parlance to not have its origins explained, either. What the heck is "meat" damage? Why does "tracing" allow Corps to do bad stuff to the Runner? What does "link" represent? What's a "rig?" What's a "stack?" Or a "heap?"

All of these are pretty evident and commonplace to a fan of the Cyberpunk genre, as they've become staple terms and concepts.

It's also worth noting that lots of authors don't even capitalize ice anymore, and Gibson himself is the only person I can think of who published stuff that left the periods intact to make it obvious it was an acronym.



#4 booored

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 03:50 PM

that is cause he defined the term.. aftr that everyone was just using a understood slang.. in nuromancer he had to explain what it was.


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#5 kaffis

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 04:59 PM

 Right, I get that. I was just pointing out that after him, the acronym-denoting periods got dropped, and after a while, people tended to stop capitalizing it, too. Also, Gibson credits Tom Maddox for coining the term in an unpublished short story that Gibson edited. He asked permission to use it in Burning Chrome, and Maddox granted it.



#6 photogasm

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 04:08 PM

kaffis said:

 It's not the only common Cyberpunk parlance to not have its origins explained, either. What the heck is "meat" damage? Why does "tracing" allow Corps to do bad stuff to the Runner? What does "link" represent? What's a "rig?" What's a "stack?" Or a "heap?"

All of these are pretty evident and commonplace to a fan of the Cyberpunk genre, as they've become staple terms and concepts.

It's also worth noting that lots of authors don't even capitalize ice anymore, and Gibson himself is the only person I can think of who published stuff that left the periods intact to make it obvious it was an acronym.

 

Ok, so here goes:

 

1.  'Meat damage' is to Meatspace as 'net damage' is to Cyberspace.  It's slang for your actual, physical location, just as cyberspace is slang for the 'Net.

 

2.  Tracing is basically a corp triangulating your meatspace location via all the LDLs or Long Distance Links (I believe, it's been a while) you've been through during your run.  They 'trace' you back through the nodes you've been through back to your origin.  Once they have your actual location, they can send the goons, blow up the block you're on, shut your power off, whatever.

 

3.  A 'link' represents an LDL node, I'm guessing.  Jump through enough hoops and it's harder to trace you.

 

4.  A 'rig' is a cyberdeck, or purpose-built computer made for hacking or 'running.' 

 

5.  'Stack' probably comes from programming code slang.  I don't know enough about programming to answer this one fully.

 

6.  'Heap' is basically 'trash heap.'

 

 

Hope that helps :)



#7 Thee Forsaken One

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Posted 22 September 2012 - 02:40 AM

photogasm said:

5.  'Stack' probably comes from programming code slang.  I don't know enough about programming to answer this one fully.

Speaking as a programmer, a 'Stack' is a type of data structure used inside a program. It uses a FIFO (First In-First Out) order. In the case of Netrunner, naming your deck (Or Library to use the M:TG term) a Stack for Runners isn't particularly accurate but I guess it sounds 'programmerly' enough to work. :)

Heap is actually a programming term too. It's a type of tree-based data structure. Again it's more being used because it sounds like programming rather than being an accurate description of where your trash is stored.



#8 Angus Lee

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Posted 22 September 2012 - 03:13 AM

Thee Forsaken One said:

photogasm said:

5.  'Stack' probably comes from programming code slang.  I don't know enough about programming to answer this one fully.

 

Speaking as a programmer, a 'Stack' is a type of data structure used inside a program. It uses a FIFO (First In-First Out) order. In the case of Netrunner, naming your deck (Or Library to use the M:TG term) a Stack for Runners isn't particularly accurate but I guess it sounds 'programmerly' enough to work. :)

Heap is actually a programming term too. It's a type of tree-based data structure. Again it's more being used because it sounds like programming rather than being an accurate description of where your trash is stored.

'Stack' in programming should dictate a FILO (First-in-Last-out) order (while 'Queue' is FIFO).  However, I regard the "Stack" and "Heap" in Netrunner setting as more about the memory (or storage) rather than those definition in the programming sense.


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#9 Thee Forsaken One

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Posted 22 September 2012 - 05:55 AM

Angus Lee said:

Thee Forsaken One said:

 

photogasm said:

5.  'Stack' probably comes from programming code slang.  I don't know enough about programming to answer this one fully.

 

Speaking as a programmer, a 'Stack' is a type of data structure used inside a program. It uses a FIFO (First In-First Out) order. In the case of Netrunner, naming your deck (Or Library to use the M:TG term) a Stack for Runners isn't particularly accurate but I guess it sounds 'programmerly' enough to work. :)

Heap is actually a programming term too. It's a type of tree-based data structure. Again it's more being used because it sounds like programming rather than being an accurate description of where your trash is stored.

 

 

'Stack' in programming should dictate a FILO (First-in-Last-out) order (while 'Queue' is FIFO).  However, I regard the "Stack" and "Heap" in Netrunner setting as more about the memory (or storage) rather than those definition in the programming sense.

Sorry you're right. I don't know why I said FIFO. (I've been sick all week. I blame it on that. > <)

If you're talking about physical memory then Stack and Heap are pretty meaningless anyway. Could have used Storage and Recycling Bin for Deck and Discard Pile although that might not sound sci-fi enough.



#10 PWBrian

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 04:15 AM

Thee Forsaken One said:

photogasm said:

 

Speaking as a programmer, a 'Stack' is a type of data structure used inside a program. It uses a FIFO (First In-First Out) order. In the case of Netrunner, naming your deck (Or Library to use the M:TG term) a Stack for Runners isn't particularly accurate but I guess it sounds 'programmerly' enough to work. :)

If you ignore the rule-breaking done by cards, I think Stack is reasonably accurate for the Runner's deck.  All the rule book tells you to do with the stack is to pop items off the top of it.

There's no excuse for Heap, though.  Except in that "heap" is synonymous with "pile."



#11 photogasm

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 11:38 AM

Ultimately the lingo is irrelevant.



#12 ArachneJericho

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 01:37 PM

"Stack" and "heap" also refer to locations in memory in programming (especially if you're working in older languages like C or down-to-the-core in machine languages). There's a difference between bytes allocated on the stack (memory allocated on the call stack, usually lasting only temporarily) and the heap (memory that sits outside of the call stack, longer-term and needs to be dealloced specifically).

One could possibly twist these definitions into "draw deck" and "discard" but it's a little reaching.






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