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What influences what during Warp travel?


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#1 wolph42

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Posted 05 September 2012 - 04:03 AM

The following elements (components) influence travelling in the warp:

GELLAR
-Belecane-Pattern 90.r Any Navigation Tests to pilot the ship through the warp gain a +10 bonus. However, subtract -20 from the result of any rolls made on the Warp Travel Encounters table
-Warpsbane hull Shield of Faith: Any Navigation Tests to pilot the ship through the warp gain a +10 bonus. When rolling on Table 7-4: Warp Travel Encounters (see page 186), the GM rolls twice and allows the Navigator to chose which result is applied.

WARPDRIVE
-Markov 1 Overcharged: Reduce the base travel time for a journey through the Immaterium by 1d5 weeks.
-Markov 2 Overcharged: Reduce the base travel time for a journey through the Immaterium by 1d10 days.
-Miloslav h-616.b Haste of the Damned: Reduce the duration of all warp passages by half. However, roll on the Warp Travel Encounters table (page 186 of R ogue T RadeR ) every three days rather than every five days. (my take is warptime passage)

OTHER
-Starchart Collection (Upgrade): allows a ships Navigator to reduce warp travel times by 1d5 days, to a minimum of one. A Poor Craftsmanship Starchart Collection imposes a -10 penalty when rolling on the Warp Travel Encounters Table. Good charts reduce travel times by 1d5+5 days
-Runecaster (Augment): Navigators using this Component to pilot a ship through the empyrean gain a +20 bonus to all Navigation Tests. Additionally, any journeys made using this Component take half their normal time.
-Warp Antenna (Facility): The Navigator receives a +20 bonus to all tests to Locate the Astronomican.
-Warp Sextant (Facility): When using a Warp Sextant, the Navigator receives a +20 bonus on any Perception Tests or Navigation (Warp) Tests made to steer the vessel through the warp.
-Tempramental Warp Engines (Past Histories of ship p198 core): Influence travelling time in while in the warp. Whenever the ship travels through the immaterium, the GM should roll 1d10. On a 6 or lower, the journey takes an additional 1d5 weeks, on a 7 or higher, the travel time is reduced 1d5 weeks instead (potentially causing the ship to arrive before it left!).

On these I have a three questions:
QUESTION 1:
The Markov and Miloslav warpdrives, the starchart, the Runecaster and the temperamental warp engine history: do they reduce travelling time measured in Warp time or in Real time. So say warp travel time is 10 days, thus realtime is 120 days do you deduct the reduced time from the 10 days (and thus also from the 120) or ONLY from the 120 days?
My guess would be that:
- the Markovs reduce the real time e.g. 10 days in warp but only 120 days - 1d5 weeks real time
- Both the miloslav and the Runecaster reduce warp time so the 10 in the warp becomes 5 days warp and 60 days real.
- temperamental warp engine: influence real time warp travel so 10 days warp travel and 120 days + 1d5 weeks
- startchart again warp time so 10 - 1d5 in the warp and thus 120 - 12*1d5 real time.

Is that correct??

QUESTION 2:
The belecane, warpsbane, runecaster Warp Antenna, Warp Sextant influence navigational test, but here too that ambiguous some times.
There are 5 steps in warp travel, WHICH do these influence. Basically in most cases it says ANY NAVIGATION (WARP) test, but if you look at the fluff descrbing this, then it makes no sense. So once again MY opinion, but I'm very curious to others:
Step 1 - Estimate duration of travel (Navigation (Warp)(Int))
Step 2 - Locate Astronomicon (Awareness (Per))
Step 3 - Charting the Course (Navigation (Warp)(Int))
Step 4 - navigating the vessel (Navigation (Warp)(Int))
Step 5 - Leaving the Warp (Navigation (Warp)(Int))

Obviously the Warp Antenna ONLY influences step 2.
And in my opinion: Warpsbane, Belecane, Runecaster and the Warp Sextant ONLY influence step 4.
It could however be argued that these concern ANY navigation (warp) test concerning warp travel, in which case they influence step 1,3 and 5 as well.

So what is it?

QUESTION 3:
Are these elements ALL the elements that influence warp travel or did I forget any?? If so, which?

thanks.



#2 wolph42

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Posted 06 September 2012 - 11:53 PM

no one?!? on any of the three questions?!? i mean if you don't feel like answering them all, pick one!



#3 Emperor Castaigne

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Posted 07 September 2012 - 02:39 AM

I believe that the upcoming supplement Rogue Trader: The Navis Primer will greatly expand on the rules for Warp Travel, hopefully you'll be able to find some answers there. Personally, I feel that the Core rules for warp travel are somewhat lacking, especially considering just how important such a thing is for a Rogue Trader crew.

Official description for Rogue Trader: The Navis Primer:

The warp is a domain of nightmares, filled with insanity made manifest and ethereal predators hungry for souls. Yet it is this shadowy realm that a Rogue Trader must tread to seek fame and fortune amongst the stars.

The Navis Primer is a powerful supplement for Rogue Trader! This powerful volume reveals the secret history of the Koronus Expanse’s Navigator Houses, while unveiling the Astropath Voidfrost and Soul Ward Disciplines. Players can unleash the unpredictable might of the Waaagh! with the Ork Weirdboy Career Path, and uncover new warp-touched powers, alternate career ranks, and elite advances for Explorers of all kinds. What’s more, The Navis Primer provides expanded rules for navigation and astrotelepathic communication, and presents terrifying new hazards and foes from the depths of the Expanse!



#4 Emperor Castaigne

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Posted 07 September 2012 - 03:00 AM

wolph42 said:

QUESTION 2:
The belecane, warpsbane, runecaster Warp Antenna, Warp Sextant influence navigational test, but here too that ambiguous some times.
There are 5 steps in warp travel, WHICH do these influence. Basically in most cases it says ANY NAVIGATION (WARP) test, but if you look at the fluff descrbing this, then it makes no sense. So once again MY opinion, but I'm very curious to others:
Step 1 - Estimate duration of travel (Navigation (Warp)(Int))
Step 2 - Locate Astronomicon (Awareness (Per))
Step 3 - Charting the Course (Navigation (Warp)(Int))
Step 4 - navigating the vessel (Navigation (Warp)(Int))
Step 5 - Leaving the Warp (Navigation (Warp)(Int))

Obviously the Warp Antenna ONLY influences step 2.
And in my opinion: Warpsbane, Belecane, Runecaster and the Warp Sextant ONLY influence step 4.
It could however be argued that these concern ANY navigation (warp) test concerning warp travel, in which case they influence step 1,3 and 5 as well.

So what is it?

Warp Sextant gives a bonus to both Perception and Navigation (Warp) and affect all 5 stages.

Warp Antenna gives a bonus to the Awareness (Perception) test in Step 2.

Any components that give either a bonus or a penalty to Navigation (Warp), each affect stage 1, 3, 4 and 5.

wolph42 said:

QUESTION 3:
Are these elements ALL the elements that influence warp travel or did I forget any?? If so, which?

You left out the Machine Spirit Oddities Blaspemous Tendencies:  "All Navigation Tests made to pilot this vessel through the warp gain a +15 bonus. However, while aboard the ship, all crew suffer -5 to Willpower based Tests."

Also, the Astrarium Koronus, one of the Treasures of the Expanse in Hostile Acquisitions. This priceless archeotech "is an elaborate navigational ship component with a detailed map of the Koronus Expanse, recorded millennia ago by an unknown interstellar cartographer."

"Should some lucky Explorers stumble upon the Astrarium Koronus and decide to make use of it, a skilled Tech- Priest proves invaluable. The ancient technology used in its construction and long years floating amongst the rubble in the Processional of the Damned have made the Astrarium’s machine-spirit temperamental and demanding. An Arduous (–40) Tech-Use Test suffices along with the burning of incenses and enacting of humble supplications. When pleased, the Astrarium provides a +20 bonus to all Common Lore (Koronus Expanse), Navigation (Stellar), Navigation (Warp), Pilot (Space Craft), and Scholastic Lore (Astromancy) Tests. Additionally, when working toward an Exploration endeavour, the Explorers earn an additional 100 Achievement Points toward completing that objective. This relatively small and efficient component takes up 1 Space and 1 Power."

wolph42 said:


thanks.

You're welcome.



#5 wolph42

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Posted 07 September 2012 - 11:53 PM

Thanks for the extensive reply!

 

Couple of remarks: the sextant is an immersion tank that enhances your senses in the warp. So how on earth does this help to estimate the duration, which I gather is something you maybe even do before you enter the warp. Also charting the course sounds like something you do on a table with maps (but that is arguable). Finally with the sextant they mention 'while steering the vessel' which to me sounds like step 4 and not the others

 

Also with some items it states 'when piloting the vessel' again, you could argue about this, but to me this sounds like the actual steering of the vessel, so again step 4 only. Granted any OTHER nav. test made during piloting e.g. evading a warp storm or turbulance on THOSE tests most of the components add a bonus, but just not to any steps other then 4.

At least thats how I read the rules. Can you elaborate on your explanation?

Also thanks for the extra elements which I hadn't seen.



#6 Emperor Castaigne

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Posted 08 September 2012 - 06:41 AM

wolph42 said:

Thanks for the extensive reply!

 

Couple of remarks: the sextant is an immersion tank that enhances your senses in the warp. So how on earth does this help to estimate the duration, which I gather is something you maybe even do before you enter the warp. Also charting the course sounds like something you do on a table with maps (but that is arguable). Finally with the sextant they mention 'while steering the vessel' which to me sounds like step 4 and not the others

 

Also with some items it states 'when piloting the vessel' again, you could argue about this, but to me this sounds like the actual steering of the vessel, so again step 4 only. Granted any OTHER nav. test made during piloting e.g. evading a warp storm or turbulance on THOSE tests most of the components add a bonus, but just not to any steps other then 4.

At least thats how I read the rules. Can you elaborate on your explanation?

Also thanks for the extra elements which I hadn't seen.

Hmm, I think you might be reading to much into the specific description.

Since the description of the Warp Sextant says it helps "in identifying known routes and calculating their current stability", it seems to me that it would include bonuses for things like Stage 3: Charting the Course, and since the ability includes a Perception Bonus, which is only used for Stage 2:  Locating of the Astronomican, it should give a bonus there as well.

My guess is that FFG just screwed up the wording and forgot that there was a specific stage of Warp Navigation called "Steering the Vessel", and that the "steer the vessel through the warp" in The True Path refers to traveling through the Warp in general.

Warp Sextant:

This massive submersion tank enhances a Navigator’s ability to safely sense the ebb and flow of the warp outside of the vessel. A broad spectrum of sensors measures the intensities and currents in the warp outside of the starship. This information is then relayed safely to the Navigator so that it can be more easily analysed and addressed. The Sextant’s array of cogitators further aids the Navigator in identifying known routes and calculating their current stability.

The True Path: When using a Warp Sextant, the Navigator receives a +20 bonus on any Perception Tests or Navigation (Warp) Tests made to steer the vessel through the warp.



#7 Gavinfoxx

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Posted 08 September 2012 - 04:54 PM

There are a few items you missed that can interact with Warp and Warp Travel.

 

The Totem of Subetai from Deathwatch First Founding (this is a particular Space Marine relic…)

Navis Prima from Dark Heresy Inquisitor's Handbook and Rogue Trader Core.

Psy Tracker from Dark Heresy Inquisitor's Handbook.

Void Abacus from Rogue Trader Into the Storm.

Elseways Charts from Rogue Trader Hostile Acquisitions.

A Prognosticator from Rogue Trader Hostile Acquisitions.



#8 wolph42

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 10:04 PM

Thanks for the update, I'll delve into them!

Ok here a full list and a couple of remaining questions concerning these objects:

1. toteM oF subetai (White sCaRs): The
staff helps Stormseers in focusing their powers, channelling ancient spirits and casting their auguries for the great khans. A Stormseer carrying the Totem of Subetai gains a small measure of foresight and, whenever he suffers Perils of the Warp, he may adjust the roll by up to 10 (either up or down) after the dice have been rolled. A Stormseer Totem can only be used by a White Scars Librarian.

2. Navis Prima
Common-Craftsmanship examples of this item grant no bonus, but Good-Craftsmanship primas grant a +10 to Navigation (Stellar) Tests. Best-Craftsmanship primas increase this bonus to +20.

3. Psy-Tracker
are actually used as a common part of the engineering equipment of major starships to monitor the status of the ship’s Geller field and its generators. The Tech Use skill is required to be able use one of these scanners. Awareness Tests taken in conjunction with the device enable the user to determine the presence and relative strength of psychic force, Daemons, the lingering effects of warp disturbances and the like. Psy-trackers are somewhat temperamental devices with an operating range of no more than a few hundred metres (although they might register very powerful spikes and signals from far beyond that). They are also easily clouded and confused by powerful energy fields and psychic “background noise”.

4. VOID ABACUS
when integrated into a ship’s auspex and propulsion systems they can allow a ship to make accurate void jumps four or five times longer than normal without a Navigator’s aid. This allows many more types of ships to travel safely, something the Navigator’s Guild cannot allow. While the Guild cannot directly outlaw their use, they can act to buy, destroy, or sabotage any and all they can find. That they will arrange for the same fate to befall to any vessel found using one is an open secret as well. Having an Abacus networked into a ship’s systems allows the crew to safely plot warp jumps of up to 5-10 days in duration with an Ordinary (+10) Navigation Test.

5. elsewAys ChArts
Elseways charts are folios full of ancient maps and warp-lore that allow a Navigator to plot a course without the aid of the Astronomicon, moving along hidden routes unknown to most. These dark and concealed routes are regarded with dread and foreboding by those who have heard of them, but a few are willing to brave such perilous paths in order to elude the authorities or reach some great prize more swiftly. When navigating the warp, the Navigator may use a set of elseways charts. If he does this, he may skip the normal requirement to locate the Astronomicon, so long as he passes a Difficult (–10) Forbidden Lore (Warp) Test. Success on this test means that a hidden route has been successfully located, adding +15 to any Navigation (Warp) Tests for this voyage for every degree of success. Failure means that the Navigator must search for the Astronomicon as normal. However, if elseways charts are used, the dangers along the route are more difficult to perceive, making it riskier to travel along. Each of the rolls for warp encounters during the voyage suffers a –20 penalty. Poor craftsmanship elseways charts require a Hard (–20) Forbidden Lore (Warp) Test to use. For good craftsmanship charts, this test becomes Challenging (+0), while the test becomes Ordinary (+10) if the charts are best craftsmanship.

6. prognostICAtor
A character using a prognosticator can attempt Psyniscience and Navigation (Warp) Tests untrained in regards to navigating the warp, and may attempt to do so as if a Navigator, but they must pass a Challenging (+0) Willpower Test or gain 1d5 Insanity Points from brief glimpses of the Immaterium. Characters who already possess those skills gain no additional benefit.

7. asTrarium Koronus
An Arduous(–40) Tech-Use Test suffices along with the burning of incenses and enacting of humble supplications. When pleased, the Astrarium provides a +20 bonus to all Common Lore (Koronus Expanse), Navigation (Stellar), Navigation (Warp), Pilot (Space Craft), and Scholastic Lore (Astromancy) Tests.

8. Machine Spirit Oddities Blaspemous Tendencies
All Navigation Tests made to pilot this vessel through the warp gain a +15 bonus. However, while aboard the ship, all crew suffer -5 to Willpower based Tests.

___________________________________________________

ad 1. Im completely missing HOW this helps in warp navigation? What am I missing??
ad 2. This helps with Naviagation - STELLAR, not with Navigation - WARP !! (or again: am I missing something?)
ad 3. Although this actually has something to do with Warp travel, I'm again failing to see how this influences one of the 5 steps of warp naviagation.
ad 4. Now THAT is an interesting find, IRC there is a complete plot somewhere on the web about this object, I didn't know they actually put it in the books. Its however unfortunate that same as with the psy tracker, FFG leaves it completely obscure what it ACTUALLY does. What on earth means 'safely' ?? No warp encounters?? And don't you need a Navigator to operate, they surely imply this but not explicitly. Also WHAT navigation test ? Warp, Stellar ?? And 5-10 days, what is it and lets say I choose 9 days what happens then??
ad 5. Clear, thanks
ad 6. Also interesting, I've got the feeling that this description should also apply to the Void Abacus. One question though: does this mean that a character WITHOUT the skill: Navigation (warp) can attempt to navigate the warp OR does the character NEED Navigation (Warp) skill and can use that to attemtpt to navigate the warp (WITHOUT being a Navigator!). Its not entirely clear which of these two. Although I have the impression that that skill is only available to Navigators so its a moot question.
ad 7. Clear!
ad 8. Clear!

 

 

 



#9 Gavinfoxx

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 05:30 AM

As far as the ones that don't directly help with warp travel…

I was using a cheat sheet that didn't, you know, go into much detail.  I just gave a really big net of anything that could possibly help with warp navigation.  Apparently you actually went and looked up the actual items! ;)

 

As far as the questions on the details and the rules issues… well… I can't answer that; there seems to be a LOT of missed stuff with regards to warp travel!






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