Jump to content



Photo

Nitpicking questions


  • Please log in to reply
41 replies to this topic

#1 florrat

florrat

    Member

  • Members
  • 9 posts

Posted 04 September 2012 - 10:19 AM

Below there are a lot of questions about very specific situations and which won't matter that much. So if you don't like nitpicking questions, consider to stop reading. Also, I'm not really waiting for answers like "play as you want", but would rather like to know the "official" ruling. Or, if there's no official ruling, hear opinions why one alternative is more logical than the other.

Thanks in advance for answering these questions!

1 What happens if a monster is placed in the outskirts when the terror level is 10? (for example by Mother Hydra). If this happens as normal, what happens if the outskirts limit is reached? The terror level increases as normal? (meaning that a doom token is added to the doom track?). Related: if the terror level is 10, do you immediately add 1 doom token to the doom track or only for every additional terror level increase?
2 What do fliers do if they do not move to the Sky (for example with environment Angry Red Skies) and they move (with no investigator nearby)? Do they move as though they were a normal monster or do they stay where they are? (if they move as a normal monster: what happens with a gate burst: "all flying monsters move"? White or black?)
3 Exactly when can you default a bank loan? Is there indeed no penalty of defaulting if you currently have no items (except that you can't gain another one)?
4 When returning from LiTaS just before upkeep, do you pick up the clue tokens of you destination? In general, if you move somewhere in some other phase than the movement phase (for example in an encounter like: "move to … and immediately have an encounter there"), do you pick up the clues there?
5 Can you use items/spells in the movement phase if you are delayed (as long as they don't use movement points)? Or is the only action allowed standing up your investigator? In the last case, what happens if monsters are in the same location as you. You have to fight them, right?
6 Related to 5: When you're arrested and move you're investigator to the police station in the next movement phase, do you have to fight monsters that are in the police station (for example Hound of Tindalos)?
6.5 If you've had an encounter which says "lose your next turn" (as opposed to "be delayed" or "stay here next turn") you won't get any encounters and cannot use any cards next turn, right? Do you have to fight monsters in your location as normal, tough? Without weapons?
7 The .18 Derringer states ".18 Derringer cannot be lost or stolen unless you choose to allow it". How does this exactly work? If you have to discard a (common) item, can you choose the derringer, and after that say "but that item cannot be stolen, so I'll keep it", effectivelty negating the effect? Same question if you lose half of your items (for example when knocked unconscious). If both answers are "no", is the text of the Derringer then only useful if you lose all your items?
8 When you can use an item or spell in the upkeep, need this to be done in the "Perform Upkeep Actions"-subphase, or can you also do this in the "Adjust Skills"-subphase after using focus? If you can do it in the "Adjust Skills" phase, can you then move skill slider, cast spell, move skill slider back (provided that you have enough focus)?
9 Can you use "Powder of Ibn-Ghazi" (lose 1 sanity and discard to gain +9 to combat checks) when you have only 1 sanity to defeat a monster (and then go insane)? Or, if you're stupid enough to use it, will you merely go insane?
10 Sometimes the price of an item is relevant (there's an encounter which says you have to discard your most expensive item or something like that). What's the price of spells? What's the price of deputy's revolver and Patrol Wagon?
9.5 Are "The White Ship" and "The Great Seal" items? Are there other special cards considered items (except of Deputy's revolver and patrol wagon)?
11 If you use an item or spell to automatically pass some check, or add successes to that check, but the card does not state if it has to be used before rolling for the check or after rolling, when can you use it? Examples: Blue Watcher of the Pyramid, Mists of Releh,Bind Monster
12 Suppose you have an explored marker on a (moving) gate which is NOT in an unstable location. Can you use an elder sign (maybe only to close the gate)? If so, what happens?
13 About Flute of the Outer Gods ("Lose 3 Sanity and 3 Stamina and discard Flute of the Outer Gods before making a Combat check to defeat all monsters in your current area. This does not affect Ancient Ones."): Can it be used in a combat check from an encounter? If so, what happens to that combat check? If used against monsters, do you get damage from overwhelming of the monsters defeated this way? If there's a warlock (or something) in your location, do you get the clue tokens just as if you have passed a combat check against it?
14 Do "Blue Watcher of the Pyramid" and "Flute of the Outer Gods" work against the Dunwich Horror (which will make him a whole lot less unbeatable)?
15 Can Ruby of R'lyeh be used by more than 1 investigator in a single movement phase? If no, shouldn't the text be replace with "Exhaust to gain 3 movement points"? If yes, can an investigator during its movement grab the Ruby from another investigator, use it, and give it back immediately afterwards to gain 3 movement points?
16 Can Warding Statue ("Discard Warding Statue after failing a Combat check to reduce the monster's combat damage to 0 Stamina. This can also be used to cancel an Ancient One's entire attack for 1 turn.") also be used when failing an evade check against a monster? Does it also remove other effects when failing a combat check? (like losing an item against an Elder Thing)
17 Please give an algorithm to determine how much monster go where when a monster surge occurs. Please include the following problems:
-monsters being sent to the outskirts by the monster limit
-monster limit removed since this monster surge raised the terror level to 10
-expansions where monsters do not count against the monster limit
-the card "Warding of the Yellow Sign" being placed on the board ("When you gain this card, choose a location in Arkham and place this card there. No monsters may appear via gates in this location. Monsters that appear during encounters in this location may automatically be Evaded.")
If a general algorithm is too hard to give, please state what happens in the following scenarios:
(a)In the following example: 7 player game, 3 gates open: Devil Reef (Innsmouth), Independence Square and Graveyard. There are 9 monsters in Arkham, and the terror level is 0. A monster surge occurs in the Graveyard. Am I correct that there will be placed 2 monsters on Devil Reef, 1 in Graveyard, 0 in Independence Square and 4 in Outskirts (and then resolving that the outskirts is too full, raising the terror level by 2)?
(b)Same situation, except that the terror level now is 8 and there's 1 monster already in the Outskirts. Then after placing 3 monsters in the Outskirts, the terror level reaches 10 and Arkham is overrun. So then the logical place for the last monster would be Independence Square, right? But then we are in the confusing situation that there have been placed 2 monsters on Devil Reef, 1 in Graveyard, 1 on Independence Square and 3 in Outskirts, while the monster surge occurred in Graveyard, and no game mechanic prohibits the fact that 1 extra monster would have been placed in Graveyard (instead of Devil Reef).
©What does the card "Warding of the Yellow Sign" exactly do? Does this card work when monsters appear via a monster surge? If so, does this reduce the amount of monsters which appear as a result of this monster surge? Or will there appear more monsters from different gates? What happens if some or all monsters are placed in the outskirts? Will they be treated as "visited the location for a fraction of a second and then moved to the outskirts" (such that the card still has effect)?
18 In the encounter "You touch Founder's Rock. Make a Luck (-1) check. If you pass, there is an electrifying shock that opens your mind to the elder things of eons past. Lose 1 Stamina, but gain 2 Clue tokens and draw 1 Spell. If you fail, you find a strange carving. As you finger the grooves, a gate opens here and you are drawn through it." how many monsters appear out of this gate? The same number as if it stated "A gate and a monster appear" (so 1 or 2)?
19 What is the Hound of Tindalos distance function (include travel across different boards, devil's reef, y'ha-ntlei and kingsport head locations)?
20 Do spells still have effect when you go insane by paying its sanity cost?
21 Can you spend more sanity/stamina than you currently have? For example use bind monster on a very dangerous monster when you have only 1 sanity?
22 If you're arrested (or instructed by some encounter), you skip your next turn. What if the ancient one awakens later the same turn as you're arrested in, do you fight it normally the first turn?
23 When you're devoured (not in the final battle) exactly when does your new investigator enter play? Begin of the next upkeep phase? In the last case, can he get an arkham encounter before having a movement phase?
24 There are quite some encounters which state that you move to some other world, have an encounter there and immediately return. What happens if the encounter in the other world makes you Lost in Time and Space (you do not return then?), return to Arkham (do you just return to your original location, or to an open gate with an explored marker? Or are you lost in time and space if there's no open gate?), or delay you (you're just delayed after returning to arkham?)?
25 In the encounter "You are mistaken for an inmate. Doctor Mintz has the guards subdue you and conducts an experiment. Make a Will (-1) [2] check to discover the results. If you pass, the injections seem to increase your capacity for learning. Draw 1 Skill. If you fail, his memory drug fails miserably, resulting in lost knowledge. You must discard one of the following (your choice), if able: 4 Clue tokens, or 2 Spells, or 1 Skill.", if you fail, can you choose an option which you cannot discard (while you can discard one of the other options)? What if you can only partially discard something (for example you have 1 clue token, but two spells, are you allowed to discard the clue token)? If you cannot fully discard any of the options, should you choose an option where you can discard "most"? Does the same logic apply to the encounter "Sheriff Engle notes that you're carrying an awful lot of weapons. Either pay him $5 or discard all of your Weapons."? Because there it would seem rather silly that you have to pay 5 dollar if you do not carry any weapons.
26 If you get an Arkham Encounter "A gate and a monster appears", is it true that you will have 3 other world encounters before you can return to Arkham? (given that you won't be delayed, sent to LiTaS, return to Arkham early, etc.)
27 Some mythos cards (Strange Sightings!) have no gate opening, but say (in the headline) that a monster surge occurs. When does this happen, in the "open gate" part of the mythos phase or the "Activate Mythos Ability" part? Also, the first player gains a clue token, when is that done, "place clue token" part or "Activate Mythos Abililty" part (this does matter in rare cases)
28 Questions about The Black Man ("Before making a Horror check, pass a Luck (-1) check or be devoured. If you pass, gain 2 Clue tokens. In either case, return the Black Man to the cup."). Can you claim it as monster trophy with John Legrasse? Does passing the Luck -1 check count as "killing" the monster? (for encounters like "Two monsters surface from the island's dark waters. If you kill them both, you are Blessed.")
29 An encounter in the Curiositie Shoppe states "Draw a mythos card and move to the gate location shown on it". What happens if you draw a mythos card with 0 or 2 gates on it? Draw again?
30 If you go insane or unconscious during an encounter, but you have not done everything yet, do you complete the encounter? If so, when do you go insane/unconscious? Immediately upon reading "Lose X sanity/stamina", or after the encounter? Or does it depend on what happens next? What if you get "lose 1 sanity but gain 1 clue token"? Do you get the clue token (and before or after losing half of your clues)? And in "Lose 1 sanity and a monster appears", it is pretty clear that you won't have to find the monster if you go insane from the "lose 1 sanity". But what is less clear (and sometimes matters (Rhan-Tegoth)) do you have to draw a monster and immediately return it to the cup?
31 Related: Suppose an encounter says "Lose 2 sanity and 2 stamina". If you go insane from the "Lose 2 sanity", you'll also lose 2 stamina, right? If you are knocked unconscious from that too, you're devoured, right? If so, it means that the "lose 2 sanity" and "lose 2 stamina" will happen simultaneously. So, can you invoke the "Timing conflicts" rule and take the 2 stamina loss first? (this might be of critical importance in some case. Suppose you have 1 sanity, 1 stamina and your only items are 2 food cards…)



#2 Tox

Tox

    Member

  • Members
  • 313 posts

Posted 04 September 2012 - 10:53 AM

2. They don't move.

3. No penalty.

4. No, only when you end the movement phase.

5. Yes, but nothing that involves movement points.

6. Yes. You end movement there.

6.5. I don't think there are encounters that make you lose a turn, except going LiTaS. If there are, skip that investigator, so no fighting (or anything else).

7. If you have other Common Items, you have to choose one of those.

8. Only before adjusting focus.

9. Yes.

10. No price, I guess.

11. Before, of course.

12. No.

 

That's all I'm willing to read. Hope these help.

 

 



#3 florrat

florrat

    Member

  • Members
  • 9 posts

Posted 04 September 2012 - 11:27 AM

 Thank you very much for your fast first answers. Most answers are more or less what I expected. Some remarks

3: Can you also default a bank loan if you actually have money to pay it (but do not want to)? Because this would make bank loans seem rather overpowered. If you have some spare turns (which is not that strange with enough investigators), player 1 could get a bank loan, give all his possessions away to player 2 and then they can both shop for items, until player 1 loses his bank loan, after which you can redistribute items and move on.

6: Are you sure. In the game rules it states that when you're arrested "The player completely skips the next turn, simply standing his investigator marker and placing it in the main area of the Police Station during the Movement Phase.", so it would be logical that it would have the same result as question 6.5

6.5: There are two such encounters in the base game. In the Woods: "You meet an old wise man in the grove who offers to share his wisdom with you. If you accept, lose your next turn and make a Lore (-2) check. If you pass, you may draw 1 Skill, or draw 2 Spells, or gain 4 Clue tokens. If you fail, nothing happens." and in Arkham Asylum "Nurse Heather accidentally injects you with a sleeping draught. You may make a Fight (-2) check to resist. If you fail or choose not to resist, lose your next turn and gain 2 Sanity from the prolonged rest. If you pass, nothing happens."

9: Could you please answer this again, because I don't know which part you're answering.



#4 Tbla

Tbla

    Member

  • Members
  • 122 posts

Posted 04 September 2012 - 12:43 PM

Tox said:

5. Yes, but nothing that involves movement points.

This is actually wrong.
www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_foros_discusion.asp
I was very surprised by this.

And now I'll try to take it up where Tox left.

13. Not sure about the encounters (I allow it in my games, since thematically there shouldn't be any difference) but you do get the clues from a warlock etc.

14. Yes

15. Here are some good arguments www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_foros_discusion.asp

16. I would say that you can use it after an evade check (because I think it would be ridiculous otherwise) but not to remove any other effects since they are not really connected to the damage.

17. Ok here we go

First of all I will assume you are aware of the "# of open gates < # of investigators# situation.

Otherwise resolve one monster at a time, place one monster (2 if playing with 5 or more investigators) on each gate starting with the one that caused the gateburst, 1st player decides the order of the rest. If any monster would exceed the monster limit place it in the outskirts instead (and if it exceeds the outskirts limit, raise the terror level and empty the outskirts). If the terror reaches 10 place any remaining monsters on their gates instead of the outskirts.

On expansion boards you should always place one (or 2) monsters on every gate IMHO.

I'm not sure about the "warding of the yellow sign" but this is my interpretation: treat the location as having no open gate when dealing with monster surges.

Maybe not a very good algorithm, I could probably do better (a more mathematical/programing style) with some time and a pen and paper. So I will go for your examples too.

a) You are correct

b) I would place it in independence square and treat the expansion board separate. I think it would be to complicated to do otherwise (this is could be  wrong though).

c) As I said, I would just ignore that gate. I don't think it would make sense that monsters that can't get through a gate would somehow appear from another gate, from a different world.

That's the best I can do for now.



#5 The Professor

The Professor

    Member

  • Members
  • 1,347 posts

Posted 04 September 2012 - 01:34 PM

Okay, as I move toward my 100th game and three-and-a-half years posting …I'm willing to give a few of these a shot…

 

2 What do fliers do if they do not move to the Sky (for example with environment Angry Red Skies) and they move (with no investigator nearby)? Do they move as though they were a normal monster or do they stay where they are? (if they move as a normal monster: what happens with a gate burst: "all flying monsters move"? White or black?)

If there are no Investigators in the Streets, Monsters in the Sky do not "move" at all.


3 Exactly when can you default a bank loan? Is there indeed no penalty of defaulting if you currently have no items (except that you can't gain another one)?

In the case you've described (no Items), then there's no penalty other than the one stated.


4 When returning from LiTaS just before upkeep, do you pick up the clue tokens of you destination? In general, if you move somewhere in some other phase than the movement phase (for example in an encounter like: "move to … and immediately have an encounter there"), do you pick up the clues there?

This one you'll find a number of interpretations ~ strict rules lawyers will pick-up Clue Tokens ONLY at the end of the Movement Phase, but others, like myself, will allow Investigators to "pick-up" Clue Tokens during any phase in the game.


5 Can you use items/spells in the movement phase if you are delayed (as long as they don't use movement points)? Or is the only action allowed standing up your investigator? In the last case, what happens if monsters are in the same location as you. You have to fight them, right?

Don't confuse 'Delayed' with a Lose a Turn ~ you still must deal with Monsters at your location (Fight or Evade).  With regard to Items/Spells, I interpret it as no using anything requiring Movement Points


6 Related to 5: When you're arrested and move you're investigator to the police station in the next movement phase, do you have to fight monsters that are in the police station (for example Hound of Tindalos)?

Not the Turn you arrive, but during the next Movement Phase


7 The .18 Derringer states ".18 Derringer cannot be lost or stolen unless you choose to allow it". How does this exactly work? If you have to discard a (common) item, can you choose the derringer, and after that say "but that item cannot be stolen, so I'll keep it", effectivelty negating the effect? Same question if you lose half of your items (for example when knocked unconscious). If both answers are "no", is the text of the Derringer then only useful if you lose all your items?

You may choose anything before this item…but you may choose to do so…and it's discarded.


8 When you can use an item or spell in the upkeep, need this to be done in the "Perform Upkeep Actions"-subphase, or can you also do this in the "Adjust Skills"-subphase after using focus? If you can do it in the "Adjust Skills" phase, can you then move skill slider, cast spell, move skill slider back (provided that you have enough focus)?

This is quite nitpicky…sorry, play this one as you want.


9 Can you use "Powder of Ibn-Ghazi" (lose 1 sanity and discard to gain +9 to combat checks) when you have only 1 sanity to defeat a monster (and then go insane)? Or, if you're stupid enough to use it, will you merely go insane?

Short answer…yes, it works, and then you're off to the Asylum.


14 Do "Blue Watcher of the Pyramid" and "Flute of the Outer Gods" work against the Dunwich Horror (which will make him a whole lot less unbeatable)?

I would allow either one against the DH


15 Can Ruby of R'lyeh be used by more than 1 investigator in a single movement phase? If no, shouldn't the text be replace with "Exhaust to gain 3 movement points"? If yes, can an investigator during its movement grab the Ruby from another investigator, use it, and give it back immediately afterwards to gain 3 movement points?

Most play it with the implied "Exhaust" clause


18 In the encounter "You touch Founder's Rock. Make a Luck (-1) check. If you pass, there is an electrifying shock that opens your mind to the elder things of eons past. Lose 1 Stamina, but gain 2 Clue tokens and draw 1 Spell. If you fail, you find a strange carving. As you finger the grooves, a gate opens here and you are drawn through it." how many monsters appear out of this gate? The same number as if it stated "A gate and a monster appear" (so 1 or 2)?

This most likely corresponds to the number of Investigators in play


19 What is the Hound of Tindalos distance function (include travel across different boards, devil's reef, y'ha-ntlei and kingsport head locations)?

Anywhere…anytime!


20 Do spells still have effect when you go insane by paying its sanity cost?

Sure, why not


21 Can you spend more sanity/stamina than you currently have? For example use bind monster on a very dangerous monster when you have only 1 sanity?

You should not have the ability to spend more than you currently possess.


22 If you're arrested (or instructed by some encounter), you skip your next turn. What if the ancient one awakens later the same turn as you're arrested in, do you fight it normally the first turn?

You're out of jail and ready to fight…the cops are gone, buddy!


24 There are quite some encounters which state that you move to some other world, have an encounter there and immediately return. What happens if the encounter in the other world makes you Lost in Time and Space (you do not return then?), return to Arkham (do you just return to your original location, or to an open gate with an explored marker? Or are you lost in time and space if there's no open gate?), or delay you (you're just delayed after returning to arkham?)?

An oldie, but a goodie…not to sound like Yogi Berra, but, "You return…unless you don't."  If an encounter takes you elsewhere…bye-bye.

 
…I've gone as far as possible right now…


The Professor

http://crafthulhu.squarespace.com

 

 


#6 Tox

Tox

    Member

  • Members
  • 313 posts

Posted 04 September 2012 - 09:53 PM

florrat said:

 Thank you very much for your fast first answers. Most answers are more or less what I expected. Some remarks

3: Can you also default a bank loan if you actually have money to pay it (but do not want to)? Because this would make bank loans seem rather overpowered. If you have some spare turns (which is not that strange with enough investigators), player 1 could get a bank loan, give all his possessions away to player 2 and then they can both shop for items, until player 1 loses his bank loan, after which you can redistribute items and move on.

6: Are you sure. In the game rules it states that when you're arrested "The player completely skips the next turn, simply standing his investigator marker and placing it in the main area of the Police Station during the Movement Phase.", so it would be logical that it would have the same result as question 6.5

6.5: There are two such encounters in the base game. In the Woods: "You meet an old wise man in the grove who offers to share his wisdom with you. If you accept, lose your next turn and make a Lore (-2) check. If you pass, you may draw 1 Skill, or draw 2 Spells, or gain 4 Clue tokens. If you fail, nothing happens." and in Arkham Asylum "Nurse Heather accidentally injects you with a sleeping draught. You may make a Fight (-2) check to resist. If you fail or choose not to resist, lose your next turn and gain 2 Sanity from the prolonged rest. If you pass, nothing happens."

9: Could you please answer this again, because I don't know which part you're answering.

 

5.Tbla is totally right. I've only recently started playing it correctly (as per the general consensus), so I was thinking of the "old" ruling in my mind :P

 

3. Well yeah, there is nothing preventing you from doing just that. A lot of people think it's kind of cheesy (and I agree), but I think the consensus is that it's possible.

6. Hmm, now you're giving me some doubts as well :P I

6.5. Nice. Never seen those (I've played about 70 games) :P

9. Yes, you can use the powder to add to the combat check, then go insane (and take the trophy if you pass the check, before being whisked away to the asylum).



#7 Tox

Tox

    Member

  • Members
  • 313 posts

Posted 04 September 2012 - 10:14 PM

florrat said:

23 When you're devoured (not in the final battle) exactly when does your new investigator enter play? Begin of the next upkeep phase? In the last case, can he get an arkham encounter before having a movement phase?

26 If you get an Arkham Encounter "A gate and a monster appears", is it true that you will have 3 other world encounters before you can return to Arkham? (given that you won't be delayed, sent to LiTaS, return to Arkham early, etc.)


27 Some mythos cards (Strange Sightings!) have no gate opening, but say (in the headline) that a monster surge occurs. When does this happen, in the "open gate" part of the mythos phase or the "Activate Mythos Ability" part? Also, the first player gains a clue token, when is that done, "place clue token" part or "Activate Mythos Abililty" part (this does matter in rare cases)


28 Questions about The Black Man ("Before making a Horror check, pass a Luck (-1) check or be devoured. If you pass, gain 2 Clue tokens. In either case, return the Black Man to the cup."). Can you claim it as monster trophy with John Legrasse? Does passing the Luck -1 check count as "killing" the monster? (for encounters like "Two monsters surface from the island's dark waters. If you kill them both, you are Blessed.")


29 An encounter in the Curiositie Shoppe states "Draw a mythos card and move to the gate location shown on it". What happens if you draw a mythos card with 0 or 2 gates on it? Draw again?


30 If you go insane or unconscious during an encounter, but you have not done everything yet, do you complete the encounter? If so, when do you go insane/unconscious? Immediately upon reading "Lose X sanity/stamina", or after the encounter? Or does it depend on what happens next? What if you get "lose 1 sanity but gain 1 clue token"? Do you get the clue token (and before or after losing half of your clues)? And in "Lose 1 sanity and a monster appears", it is pretty clear that you won't have to find the monster if you go insane from the "lose 1 sanity". But what is less clear (and sometimes matters (Rhan-Tegoth)) do you have to draw a monster and immediately return it to the cup?


31 Related: Suppose an encounter says "Lose 2 sanity and 2 stamina". If you go insane from the "Lose 2 sanity", you'll also lose 2 stamina, right? If you are knocked unconscious from that too, you're devoured, right? If so, it means that the "lose 2 sanity" and "lose 2 stamina" will happen simultaneously. So, can you invoke the "Timing conflicts" rule and take the 2 stamina loss first? (this might be of critical importance in some case. Suppose you have 1 sanity, 1 stamina and your only items are 2 food cards…)

These are easy ones.

23. Someone gets devoured, he is removed from play. The next turn, before upkeep, a new investigator starts playing. I don't understand what you mean by having an AE phase before movement phase. Do you have AEs during upkeep? No.

26. Yes, it's true. 3 OEs.

27. In the activate Mythos ability (so the new monsters do NOT move after appearing). The clue is gained during the activate Mythos ability phase (after the surge).

28. I'd say you do not pass the encounter. Not sure about Legrasse (can't remember his ability, is it about Endless monsters taken as trophies? In that case, thematically, you don't "kill" the Black Man, so no)

29. 0 gates, draw again. 2 gates, I'd use always use the 1st one.

30. You get the clue if you go insane at the same time. You do not get the clue if it's "Lose 1 sanity, fight a monster, if you defeat it get a clue" and you only have 1 sanity. If it's "lose 1 sanity and draw a monster", it's simultaneous, so I'd draw a monster and then go insane, returning it to the cup (or not, Rhan Tegoth).

31. It's simultaneous. In the last example, you'd just go insane (lose 2 sanity and 2 stamina, but you have 2 food so you lose that and only go insane). You're devoured if you reach 0 stam and san simultaneously.

 

Hope these help.



#8 Chronicles

Chronicles

    Member

  • Members
  • 12 posts

Posted 05 September 2012 - 05:32 AM

 4. I consider myself strict, but I say you can pick up clues during upkeep. Why? Because Kate Winthrop starts with the clue that normally is on the Science Building.



#9 Walk

Walk

    Member

  • Members
  • 461 posts

Posted 06 September 2012 - 02:40 PM

Alright, I'll weigh in on questions for which the answer I espouse has not yet been put forward:

1. To be blunt, I don't know.  Personally, I would play it that you do place monsters in the Outskirts.  Anyone else have any thoughts?  Also: you do not add a Doom token when the Terror hits 10, only when it increases thereafter.

9. Just wanted to say that I'm with The Professor on this one.  When you use a spell or item that costs Sanity and it drives you insane, its effect activates, and then you are immediately sent to the Asylum/LiTaS.  That means that, while you will indeed get the bonus of the Powder of Ibn-Ghazi, you'll be packed off to the Asylum before you can make a Combat check.

16. I'm going to have to disagree with you here, Tbla.  It says the item triggers on a Combat check, so it triggers on a Combat check and a Combat check alone.  Why would it be ridiculous to say it doesn't trigger on an Evade check?

19. At first, I thought you were asking something else and The Professor had misinterpeted your question, but then I realized that I had.  I'll give my original answer anyway, since it's related: strange as it may seem, the Hound traces proximity along the railroads (thus, if the Hound is on Joe Sargent's Bus Stop and an investigator is on Bishop's Brook Bridge, the investigator is considered to be one space away from the Hound).  Yes, I know it doesn't make sense, but the depots are the only standard point of entry for inter-board movement, so….

25. I would definitely say that you must make a choice to which you can "fully commit", if possible.  (In other words, if you have two clues, a spell, and a skill, you must choose to discard the skill.)  As to your second question…I really don't know.  Personally, I would rule it that you have to choose the option for which you can discard the highest percentage of the requisite item, strange as that may seem; there's just no easy way to rule it, so that would be my solution.  Your final question touches on one of the more annoying points of Arkham rules syntax: whether or not it is a requirement to "pay" something.  This also ties into your Bank Loan question, and honestly, I think it could be either one.  I generally rule that "pay or else ____" situations give you the option to do either, but then, some encounters seem to treat "pay" the same as "lose", so I really don't know.



#10 Tbla

Tbla

    Member

  • Members
  • 122 posts

Posted 07 September 2012 - 11:10 PM

Walk said:

16. I'm going to have to disagree with you here, Tbla.  It says the item triggers on a Combat check, so it triggers on a Combat check and a Combat check alone.  Why would it be ridiculous to say it doesn't trigger on an Evade check?

I have been debating this one with my self for some time.

Like you say, it says combat check and that should be clear enough. But the reason I would allow it are for thematical reasons (I put a great value in thematical reasons). I simply can not see why the monster would hurt you in a different way if you fail to sneak away than if you fail to defeat it.

If you (or someone else) provide me with a plausible explanation for that, I would gladly change the way I play. I actually want to follow the cards/rules as literally as possible but for me everything has to make sense.



#11 Tibs

Tibs

    Member

  • Members
  • 4,598 posts

Posted 08 September 2012 - 09:30 AM

In order to confuse the situation further, the penalty for failing the evade check is identical to the penalty for failing the combat check.

Subsequently, I recall reading that if you fail the evade check and the horror check against The Beast, you are devoured (the token says horror and combat checks).

In light of these, it would seem that the Warding Statue could indeed be used on a failed evade check.

Just something to think about.



#12 florrat

florrat

    Member

  • Members
  • 9 posts

Posted 09 September 2012 - 12:10 PM

Thanks for the great responses so far!

 

The following questions are "open" as far as I know:

1 (except last question)

6/6.5 (I received two answers, but I still don't find it very clear: If you "lose your next turn", do you have to fight monsters next movement phase? Does this include the case of being arrested?)

10

9.5 (sorry about the ordering)

13 (except Warlock part)

17 (couldn't find all answers, see below)

19 (see below)

 

-----------------------------------------

@Answers:

About 7: So am I right that "(…) cannot be lost or stolen unless you choose to allow it" is only useful if you get an encounter/effect which says "lose/discard all your items" or "lose/discard X items" and you have less than X items? (which means that it is most often very useless since you have enough other items to discard)

16: My 2 cents: I think you should be able to use Warding Statue after failing an evade check against a monster. In the game there are a lot of occurrences where they wrote "after failing a combat check" when they meant "when receiving combat damage". Examples include monster special damage (Nightgaunt/Elder Thing/Dimensional Shambler and probably all Dunwich Horror cards).

17: @Tbla: About "#investigators>#open gates", I don't think it's the easier case… But I think your algorithm can be extended: do the same, but if you've chosen all gates, you do another round, starting with the surging gate (if it was specified), and continuing until you've done (max(#players,#open gates)) steps.
I don't think your interpretation of "warding of the yellow sign" is very logical. In the case "#investigators>#open gates" your interpretation would mean that more monsters will come from the other gates if you place that card on one of the open gates.
Example: 8 players, 2 open gates, 1 of them containing warding of the yellow sign, 0 monsters in Arkham. In a monster surge, your interpretation means that 8 monsters will come from the gate without the card? Wouldn't 4 be more logical?
Next example: same, except 11 monsters in Arkham? How many monsters in the Outskirts? 4? 8?

19 Sorry for the vague statement, and thanks for the useful comment, Walk.
I meant with the question: "For any two locations, what is the distance between them w.r.t. Hound of Tindalos movement". Of course adjacent locations have distance 1, and now I know train depots have distance 1, too. But what is the distance from, say, Innsmouth Shore to Devils Reef? 2? Some distance larger than all other distances (but still reachable)? unreachable?

24: So if you have an encounter which says "return to arkham", you'll return to Arkham with explored marker, if a corresponding gate happens to be open? That's a quick (but of course, very unpredictable/unreliable) way to close gates. I guess this WILL end your arkham encounter phase (so that you cannot close the gate the same turn?)

25: Thank you for your answers about the different options. I think that is the best way to define it, too (discarding the thing where you can discard the highest percentage of it). About the "pay $X or (…)" issue; that's indeed exactly which causes my confusing about the bank loan. For the time being (unless other good arguments are supplied) I will read it as "choose to either pay $X or do (…)".

28: Harsh, but doesn't sound unreasonable.

30/31: So if you have an encounter which instructs you to do multiple things, they all happen simultaneously? So if you have 1 sanity, and you get the encounter "gain 1 clue token, but lose 1 sanity"; you can choose to get the clue token after losing the sanity (where you might have to discard half of your clues), and if you get "lose 1 sanity and 1 clue token", you may choose to first lose the clue token?

 

---
New questions:
32: Is there a difference between "losing" and "discarding" (example: "Lose all your items" vs "Discard all your items")?
33: Is the following rule correct: "If some monster special damage cannot be executed, and its combat damage is 0, then the combat immediately ends"
Examples:
-Dimensional Shambler vs Sister Mary (or does the fight continue?);
-Dunwhich Horror card "if you fail a combat check, lose all of your items" when you have no items (for example if you failed the combat check for the second time)
-Nightgaunt without open gates (this one was the reason I think this rule is reasonable)
 



#13 Gamemaster

Gamemaster

    Member

  • Members
  • 63 posts

Posted 09 September 2012 - 02:39 PM

florrat said:

Thanks for the great responses so far!

 

The following questions are "open" as far as I know:

1 (except last question)

6/6.5 (I received two answers, but I still don't find it very clear: If you "lose your next turn", do you have to fight monsters next movement phase? Does this include the case of being arrested?)

10

9.5 (sorry about the ordering)

13 (except Warlock part)

17 (couldn't find all answers, see below)

19 (see below)

1.  It is in the rule book that a doom token is added when the Terror Level reaches 10. Icons on the Terror Track are reminders (colors on 3, 6, and 9 to close the appropriate shop and a doom token on 10). A doom token is also added for every point the Terror Level should have increased past 10. 

6/6.5  The FAQ does state that you skip all phases when you lose a turn (only stand your figure up during the Movement Phase).  Therefore, you do not conduct any actions at all; no Upkeep phase refreshes or skill adjustments, no combat, no encounters, etc.  I still allow trades though.

10  If there is an encounter that does not specify which type of Items to lose, then I would say Spells and Deputy's revolver would be a cost of zero and you choose which Item to lose. 

9.5  The only Special card that I consider to be an Item and treated as an Item (can be traded, lost, etc.) would be the Rail Pass.

13  Encounters that specify a Combat Check, you cannot use the Flute.  As far as the second part, you do not receive any rewards or consequences from monsters that specify passing a Combat Check such as on a Mi-Go, Riot, or The Dunwich Horror.  Overwhelming you would suffer because it is for defeating that monster.  Some people house-rule that you would ignore Overwhelming too.

17  Monster Surge:  The amount of monsters drawn = # on players or # of open gates, whichever is greater.  The monsters are spread as evenly as possible on every open gate.  If the number of monsters are uneven, then the surging gate receives the extra monster(s).  If there are monsters already on open gates, do not count those.  Only count the amount of monsters being placed.  Draw monsters for one gate at time.  If Monster Limit is met, then the new monsters go to the Outskirts.  Warding of the Yellow Sign card prevents any monsters appearing via gates, including surges.  So, if this card is on one of your open gates, you do not place any monsters there.  You still place the same amount of monsters as evenly as possible on the remaining gates.

19  The Hound of Tindalos moves to the closest investigator in a location.  If there are no investigators on the same board as the Hound, then use the Train Depot to determine the closest investigator.

 



#14 Gamemaster

Gamemaster

    Member

  • Members
  • 63 posts

Posted 09 September 2012 - 02:59 PM

florrat said:

---
New questions:
32: Is there a difference between "losing" and "discarding" (example: "Lose all your items" vs "Discard all your items")?
33: Is the following rule correct: "If some monster special damage cannot be executed, and its combat damage is 0, then the combat immediately ends"
Examples:
-Dimensional Shambler vs Sister Mary (or does the fight continue?);
-Dunwhich Horror card "if you fail a combat check, lose all of your items" when you have no items (for example if you failed the combat check for the second time)
-Nightgaunt without open gates (this one was the reason I think this rule is reasonable)
 

32  No.

33  Dimensional Shambler vs Sister Mary:  If Sister Mary fails a Combat or Evade Check against Dimensional Shambler, she moves to South Church.

       Dunwich Horror: Fail a combat check and lose all of your Items.  If you fail a second time, combat ends.  I would also say you can go three rounds if you have any Items that you cannot lose unless you allow it.  So, first fail: Lose all of your Items except the ones you cannot lose unless you choose to allow it (ex. Deputy's Revolver).  Second fail: Lose all remaining Items.  Third fail: Combat Ends. 

       Nightgaunt: No open gates: Combat Ends.

The main point to remember regarding this question is that there are never any "instant-kills."  There are also never any combat loops that would never end.



#15 Walk

Walk

    Member

  • Members
  • 461 posts

Posted 12 September 2012 - 02:41 PM

Tbla: Fair enough, I suppose.  But, well…there are a great many things in-game that don't really make sense, such that I've more or less given up on things making sense.  I have a feeling that this will turn into an extended argument, but how do you explain, for instance, trophies?

florrat: Again, there's no really way to tell with Devil Reef.  From a mechanics perspective, I would say this: the Hound only goes for someone in Devil Reef/Y'ha-nthlei if there's no one else to go for.  If, on the other hand, it is in Devil Reef/Y'ha-nthlei, it would go for anyone in the adjacent location first and then count closeness from Falcon Point thereafter.  From a logistical perspective…well, the Hound isn't really operating on a logistical perspective to begin with, since there's no way you could argue that a train station is closer to a train station in another town than to a building on the other side of town because the two stations are connected by a railroad.  Of course, the Hound doesn't follow human rules of space-time….

Gamemaster: Are you sure about there being a Doom token added when the Terror hits 10?  I can't seem to find it in the rulebook.  Can you specify the page?  Also, I distinctly remember someone saying that any investigator in an infinite loop is driven insane.  Can anyone back me up on this?



#16 Tbla

Tbla

    Member

  • Members
  • 122 posts

Posted 12 September 2012 - 07:20 PM

Walk: There are indeed a lot of stuff going on that are very hard to explain. I try my best to explain them but sometimes I just have to give up, after all I don't want to change the rules in obvious ways, only where there are room for interpretations.
The trophies though are not really a problem, I think of them as parts (claws, teeth etc) taken from the monsters or small objects collected from the OWs. These are then given to various people in arkham to convince them to help you fight the coming horror.

I'm looking forward to coming arguments.



#17 Tbla

Tbla

    Member

  • Members
  • 122 posts

Posted 12 September 2012 - 07:36 PM

florrat said:

17: @Tbla: About "#investigators>#open gates", I don't think it's the easier case… But I think your algorithm can be extended: do the same, but if you've chosen all gates, you do another round, starting with the surging gate (if it was specified), and continuing until you've done (max(#players,#open gates)) steps.
I don't think your interpretation of "warding of the yellow sign" is very logical. In the case "#investigators>#open gates" your interpretation would mean that more monsters will come from the other gates if you place that card on one of the open gates.
Example: 8 players, 2 open gates, 1 of them containing warding of the yellow sign, 0 monsters in Arkham. In a monster surge, your interpretation means that 8 monsters will come from the gate without the card? Wouldn't 4 be more logical?
Next example: same, except 11 monsters in Arkham? How many monsters in the Outskirts? 4? 8? 

Oh I didn't exactly mean that it was the easier case but rather that I was hoping that you could extend my algorithm just the way you did.

Your new example: Hmm tricky one. Perhaps you are right, otherwise the WotYS would loose significant power in a game with many investigators.
Next example: Same as above.



#18 Gamemaster

Gamemaster

    Member

  • Members
  • 63 posts

Posted 14 September 2012 - 03:05 PM

Walk said:

Gamemaster: Are you sure about there being a Doom token added when the Terror hits 10?  I can't seem to find it in the rulebook.  Can you specify the page? 

Last page of the AH rulebook under Terror Level Summary.



#19 Walk

Walk

    Member

  • Members
  • 461 posts

Posted 28 September 2012 - 05:52 PM

Well, school has been rather hectic and I haven't had a chance to come here in a while.  Nevertheless, I think I'll pick up where I left off.

Tbla: Yes, but why, precisely, do the people want the trophies?  Yes, they're a sign of the investigators' prowess, but why do the people actually want you to hand them over?  Are they going to do anything with them?  And, most of all, why are trophies transferred to the new investigator upon a devouring when nothing else is?

Gamemaster: Hmm, I hadn't noticed that.  However…the last page is a summary, a recap of rules that have appeared previously, and the bit about adding the Doom token at the moment when the Terror Track hits 10 appears nowhere else in the rules.  Thus, I'm inclined to stick with the main body of the rules.  Does anyone know if this ever received an official response?



#20 Julia

Julia

    I survived Avi's apocalypse

  • Members
  • 6,435 posts

Posted 28 September 2012 - 09:40 PM

Walk, it was said that when the doom track reaches ten, you add a doom token to the doom track and you double the monster limit. For each terror increase above ten, you add an extra doom token.

However, this is not written on anything official that I'm aware of. I guess this is part of the proto-FAQ that once were partially revealed. Hence, for this to be official, we have to wait until we see them published (which in normal human time means: one day, our grandsons and granddaughter, now elder, coming to our graves to pray, will whisper "we have them, we have them all, now you can rest in peace")


We have dragged Reason from her Throne and set in her place the Empress of Dreams [liber Endvra]
Custom Arkham Horror material / Arkham Horror Advanced Players League




© 2013 Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc. Fantasy Flight Games and the FFG logo are ® of Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc.  All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Contact | User Support | Rules Questions | Help | RSS