Jump to content



Photo

Nutrition: Servitors vs. Servo Skulls


  • Please log in to reply
16 replies to this topic

#1 Gregorius21778

Gregorius21778

    Member

  • Members
  • 2,802 posts

Posted 27 August 2012 - 08:50 PM

Greetings, fellows

I am currently (while planning a game) wondering about the need of Nutrition of a Servo Skull compared to Sevitor.

Since a Servitor has a rather large amount of still organic parts I do assuem that they need some kind of nutrition in addition to other maintenance (like the "baby food" in the original Robocop movie). But what about Servo Skulls?

Based on the articles found in the Forgeworld section of the IH they do not seem to have any organic parts. Comparable simple machine spirits and other technical devices build into the skull of a loyal but now swoon servant. 

Based on this, a Servoskull would not need any nutrition (only energy) and would make for the better long-duty-guard in an environment where other maintenance is rather minimal (like in an airtight locked room).

What do you think? Do you know about contrary sources where Servoskulls where mentioned to have biological parts?

Thank you



#2 Plushy

Plushy

    Member

  • Members
  • 811 posts

Posted 27 August 2012 - 09:34 PM

 The Imperium is terrified of AI and uses brains as the base for all things that can be perceived as such. Servo-Skulls would therefore most likely have the brain of whoever had the skull. Something to keep that bit of meat alive would be good.


My apologies to anyone I offend; FFG staff, playtesters, and forum users alike. 

 

Please check out my Dark Heresy to Only War conversion! You can find it on the main Only War forum. I'm always looking for more people to playtest it!


#3 Gregorius21778

Gregorius21778

    Member

  • Members
  • 2,802 posts

Posted 27 August 2012 - 10:31 PM

Plushy said:

 The Imperium is terrified of AI and uses brains as the base for all things that can be perceived as such. Servo-Skulls would therefore most likely have the brain of whoever had the skull. Something to keep that bit of meat alive would be good.

Hi. I am aware of the first part, but the IH states a machine-spirit. Any source for "their is brain inside"? A story, a section of a rules text? A tabletop codex?
I try to puzzle out as much along the line of published text as possible :)  Thanks!



#4 jabberwoky

jabberwoky

    Member

  • Members
  • 210 posts

Posted 29 August 2012 - 01:51 PM

While I'm not a complete expert when it comes to Warhammer 40K fluff, I believe that the machine spirit of a servo skull does not require "nutrition".  As a machine spirit, it probably needs a maintenance job from a tech-priest now and then, but I doubt that it needs a tank of nutrients to keep it satiated.

Besides, if the machine spirit of a servo skull would need nutrients, would an advanced machine spirit (like that of a Rhino APC) need an IV tube to keep it "fed?"

Now a servo-skull made by the Dark Mechanicus, however, may need a bit extra… "oomph" in its diet.



#5 CeilingSquid

CeilingSquid

    Member

  • Members
  • 2 posts

Posted 29 August 2012 - 02:22 PM

I have never once assumed that servo skulls had still-living grey matter in them, and none of the literature indicates that. To begin with, being turned into a servitor is usually the lot of criminals. Servo skulls are often explicitly stated to be made from the skulls of "honored servants",though as of right now the source on that quote escapes me. In this case, I think that implies post-mortem conversion, along with cleaning and polishing the skull and installing all the electronics. You don't convert someone into a servo skull while their brain is still alive. That would be akin to servitor conversion, which again, is a fate reserved for criminals and hereteks, not a servant you want to memorialize. We're talking about lobotimization, here!

As far as I understand it, a true AI (which the imperium fears) and a "machine spirit" are also not one and the same. The tech-priesthood is primarily concerned with automata that display self-awareness and free-will, which servo skulls do not. Similarly, most "machine spirits" do not behave like the feared Men of Iron - high-level spirits occasionally act autonomously, but they do not form complex thoughts or self-awareness. Machine spirits can exist with purely non-organic CPUs and not impinge upon the ban against AI. Machine spirits can be willful if mistreated, but they are ultimately bound by their programming.

The Legio Cybernetica is a prime example. They're not often referred to nowadays (the most recent reference, I recall, was in the Titanicus novel), but, as a subsect of the tech-priesthood, they themselves employ robots. Robots, not servitors.  No organic parts. The priesthood wouldn't have a whole legion of robots if they thought only organic servitors could prevent true AI from emerging.

If I recall, Imperial Robots in the tabletop had a pretty strict IF/THEN flowchart that determined how they acted in various situations. The player could set their "programming" before a match.  The safeguards against rogue AI rest in strict programming and controls on machine spirits, not in the physical composition of the CPU itself.

Long story short, servo-skulls most likely do not have organic parts. There's nothing in the fluff that ever indicated that.  They're simply very low-level robots controlled by simple machine spirits that aren't smart enough to rebel.

So you were likely correct in assuming that servo-skulls have the benefit of not requring organic sustenance, which is a point in their favor.

One has to wonder why using living brains is so common -- probabaly because it's simply easier to produce complex automata that way, and ensure they don't rebel.  Actual robots are limited to simple things like servo-skulls.  The robotic equivalent of servitors are pretty much restricted to the Legio Cybernetica. Perhaps the Legio Cybernetica closely guard the secrets of programming complex robots?  Maybe only they can produce honest-to-god robots that won't rebel?

Just a thought. It's mostly speculation.

 

 

 

 



#6 Gregorius21778

Gregorius21778

    Member

  • Members
  • 2,802 posts

Posted 29 August 2012 - 10:55 PM

So no quotable source about any living tissue inside a servo SKULL so far. Phew…. that helps me with my plot. Thank you all so far!



#7 Kiton

Kiton

    Member

  • Members
  • 370 posts

Posted 30 August 2012 - 05:37 AM

A "A "machine spirit" isn't an AI, but not because its some spiritual thing [given how the warp is working that would be a daemon]. The machine spirit is anything from an actual low grade AI like the adaptive computers in a Land Raider, Titan or some Voidships, to the basic calculator. Basically any program or OS.

The term also gets used in a general fashion for the mysticism angle the mechanicus feeds everyone, but that does not mean they necessarily themselves believe there's little souls in every calculator waiting to go to silicon heaven when their warranty expires.

I'd be quite willing to believe the only organic part of a servo-skull is the skull itself. They're monotask anyways for the most part, which is well below any worries they may have. Its dumber than a Tau Drone [and those things can network into higher intelligence]



#8 N0-1_H3r3

N0-1_H3r3

    Former Contributing Freelance Writer

  • Members
  • 3,312 posts

Posted 30 August 2012 - 08:58 AM

Kiton said:

A "A "machine spirit" isn't an AI, but not because its some spiritual thing [given how the warp is working that would be a daemon]. The machine spirit is anything from an actual low grade AI like the adaptive computers in a Land Raider, Titan or some Voidships, to the basic calculator. Basically any program or OS.

The term also gets used in a general fashion for the mysticism angle the mechanicus feeds everyone, but that does not mean they necessarily themselves believe there's little souls in every calculator waiting to go to silicon heaven when their warranty expires.

In recent years, I've taken to a particular belief for what the concept of the "machine spirit" represents… not in practical terms, but as a linguistic concept.

The primary language of any member of the Cult Mechanicus is the Lingua-Technis - an ancient, pre-Imperial form of communication vocalised and transcribed in binary. As those who speak and comprehend Lingua-Technis are all augmented, communion between Tech-Priests and their servants - whether done vocally (carefully-modulated sonic pulses) or through wireless signals (such as the noosphere mentioned in several novels) is extremely rapid and efficient, conveying potentially vast amounts of data in moments. The 'flesh voice' - that is, actually speaking - is comparatively inefficient, lacking the mechanical precision of the Lingua-Technis.

With that in mind, it seems entirely reasonable to assume that when Tech-Priests talk amongst themselves, they can communicate in exacting detail and with flawless precision, distinguishing between basic machine intellects (such as those found aboard starships, titans and some advanced Astartes vehicles) and the more common anthropomorphic "spirit of the machine" concept used to describe the particular quirks and inclinations of a specific mechanism. When speaking with their flesh voices, the same Tech-Priests literally lack the words to effectively describe the distinction to outsiders, and quite deliberately - when you want to keep secrets within an organisation, ensuring that secret concepts cannot easily be translated makes it far harder for those secrets to be shared.


Writing Credits for Fantasy Flight Games: Into the Storm, Edge of the Abyss, Battlefleet Koronus, Hostile Acquisitions, Black Crusade Core Rulebook, First Founding, The Jericho Reach, The Soul Reaver, Only War, The Navis Primer and Ark of Lost Souls


#9 Kasatka

Kasatka

    Member

  • Members
  • 1,084 posts

Posted 31 August 2012 - 02:51 AM

N0-1_H3r3 said:

Kiton said:

 

A "A "machine spirit" isn't an AI, but not because its some spiritual thing [given how the warp is working that would be a daemon]. The machine spirit is anything from an actual low grade AI like the adaptive computers in a Land Raider, Titan or some Voidships, to the basic calculator. Basically any program or OS.

The term also gets used in a general fashion for the mysticism angle the mechanicus feeds everyone, but that does not mean they necessarily themselves believe there's little souls in every calculator waiting to go to silicon heaven when their warranty expires.

 

In recent years, I've taken to a particular belief for what the concept of the "machine spirit" represents… not in practical terms, but as a linguistic concept.

The primary language of any member of the Cult Mechanicus is the Lingua-Technis - an ancient, pre-Imperial form of communication vocalised and transcribed in binary. As those who speak and comprehend Lingua-Technis are all augmented, communion between Tech-Priests and their servants - whether done vocally (carefully-modulated sonic pulses) or through wireless signals (such as the noosphere mentioned in several novels) is extremely rapid and efficient, conveying potentially vast amounts of data in moments. The 'flesh voice' - that is, actually speaking - is comparatively inefficient, lacking the mechanical precision of the Lingua-Technis.

With that in mind, it seems entirely reasonable to assume that when Tech-Priests talk amongst themselves, they can communicate in exacting detail and with flawless precision, distinguishing between basic machine intellects (such as those found aboard starships, titans and some advanced Astartes vehicles) and the more common anthropomorphic "spirit of the machine" concept used to describe the particular quirks and inclinations of a specific mechanism. When speaking with their flesh voices, the same Tech-Priests literally lack the words to effectively describe the distinction to outsiders, and quite deliberately - when you want to keep secrets within an organisation, ensuring that secret concepts cannot easily be translated makes it far harder for those secrets to be shared.

That's actually a real good spin on Nathan, even if a bit of a cop out from anyone having to actually explain what a machine spirit is. I agree that to a certain degree the intricacies of the Tech-priests is beyond the ken of unaugmented humans, but it's easy enough to point out that there are no true AI that are sanctioned anywhere. The machine-spirits mentioned with regards to things like Space Marine vehicles are instead more equivalent to an advanced auto-pilot function, not an AI. That Tech-Priests use the term machine-spirit as most people would use the term soul is hardly helpful though.

 

Back on topic however, i believe that servo skulls are literally just the skull of favoured servant - a trivial boon to a now dead servant of the Emperor to utilise their body after death. The fact that it'd be just as easy, and in fact more reliable to use ceramite or some other metallic or ceramic material to make servo-skulls is beside the point - this is the grim, dark 41st millenium where scrimshawing is an honourable, and widely practiced profession and the line between cybernetics, organics and souls isn't particularly discussed.


Only the insane have strength enough to prosper.

Only those that prosper may truly judge what is sane.


#10 Lynata

Lynata

    Member

  • Members
  • 2,920 posts

Posted 02 September 2012 - 06:28 PM

I think the exact nature of a Machine Spirit depends a lot on whatever book you're reading. Personally, I've always run with the idea that it's a very generalised term for the supposed "ghost in the machine" within any kind of technology - whether purely existing within one's superstition or actually present in the form of a cyborg intelligence.

"True" Machine Spirits would be comparatively rare and incorporate a lobotomised human brain slaved to the machinery they control, thus conferring a certain level of autonomy. GW once published a poster cross-section of the Land Raider tank, where the item labeled "machine spirit" was just that. An organic brain.
"Fake" Machine Spirits on the other hand are the imaginary spirits within the equipment people use from day to day. In our real world it would be praying to the car to please start this time, or yelling at your display because all the precious and unsaved writing you spent a full hour on just turned into a nasty bluescreen. Ported over into 40k, such things would simply be taken for granted, with everyone actually believing that this is how it works. So don't forget reciting the litany of cleansing as you polish that lasgun of yours, lest you may incur the wrath of its machine spirit!

This in turn brings me to the actual topic at hand. I'm with those who think that servo skulls do not actually have a brain but are simply an organic bone shell for a set of optics, a basic processor and a suspensor unit, plus whatever tools are fitted to the device. This little guy's programming is so limited in capacity and dependent on its owner's supervision that it does not actually qualify as an "intelligence", hence it is not under risk of breaking the ban. I suppose you could compare them to those robotic vacuum cleaners that are being sold as of a couple of years. And this is why servo skulls are rarely used as anything more than floating candle lighters, toilet paper dispensers or music boxes which are perfectly happy with a recharge of their power cell once in a while. Come to think of it, they might even have some sort of station for this where they return to when not needed. Just like those vacuum cleaners. Or your iPhone.

At least that would be my interpretation.


current 40k RPG character: Aura Vashaan, Astromancer Witch-Priestess
previous characters: Captain Elias (Celestial Lions Chapter -- debriefed), Comrade-Trooper Dasha Malenko (1207th Valhallan Ice Warriors -- KIA), Sister Elana (Order of the Sacred Rose -- assassinated), Leftenant Darion Baylesworth (Rogue Trader Artemisia -- retired), Taleera "Raven" Nephran (Hive Ganger & Inquisitorial Assassin -- mindwiped)

#11 Manyfist

Manyfist

    Member

  • Members
  • 100 posts

Posted 03 September 2012 - 12:57 PM

Servitors are fed nutrient paste made for servitors. It's done automatically when they connect into a wall socket for recharging, cleaning, and/or repairs. Servos lulls on other hand require little if any maintenance. 



#12 Kasatka

Kasatka

    Member

  • Members
  • 1,084 posts

Posted 04 September 2012 - 03:57 AM

Manyfist said:

Servitors are fed nutrient paste made for servitors. It's done automatically when they connect into a wall socket for recharging, cleaning, and/or repairs. Servos lulls on other hand require little if any maintenance. 

 

Not quite sure i agree on that front - most fiction i've read concerning servitors mentions tech-priests or trained assistants that would go about administering holy machine oil and making the proper prayers and incantations in machine-cant to keep the servitors properly maintained. Also as servo skulls use anti-gravitic drives to hover, i would say they are actually more advanced than what is essentially a lobotomized person with cybernetic implants, though this difference in rarity would depend entirely on what the local forgeworld or forgeworld of origin specializes in.


Only the insane have strength enough to prosper.

Only those that prosper may truly judge what is sane.


#13 BangBangTequila

BangBangTequila

    Member

  • Members
  • 267 posts

Posted 09 September 2012 - 08:44 AM

 On the difference between machine spirits:

I will expand on Nathan's explanation with my own little relative comparison. By the general populace's understanding, Chess Masters is heretical to the point of exsanguinating a player for having it. To an adept of the Mechanicus, however, the basic programming is apparent and the distinguishing fact that it isn't actually thinking, but rather following a complicated series of if-then scenarios to form the opposing side of a game. In this way, I think Mr Dowdell's theory is half of the right of it.

By propagating the general understanding of Machine Spirits (It's mechanical, and I don't know why it's doing that… Machine Spirit!) the Mechanicus does not have to worry about anyone non-mechanicus figuring out the way to program, create, and engineer functioning electronic software to empower hardware devices which are often devised by non-mechanicum personnel. Within the ranks of the Mechanicus, however, AI does exist. Not AI as in Cortana, with thoughts and feelings, but AI such as a Terminator. Complicated, intelligent, capable of adaptation, but governed by an unassailably empowered higher function (John Connor's reprogrammed unit is my example, or even all other individual terminators - not Skynet). This wouldn't be seen as heretical within the Mechanicus, for the simple reason that they understand it. They develop the code, they build the routines, and thus they know that all these AIs consist of is a very, very, very convoluted sense of "if-then" as decreed by the organic programmer that commands them.

As for why they use servitors, they are common, cheap, and easy to replace and repair. Robotics to form a full humanoid would be very resource intensive, because not only are they creating those simple functions the servitor would be made for (the clamps of a cargo servitor, for example), they are creating the skeletal frame, the locomotion, the various balance gyros and servo-muscles required to allow for motion and adaptation to changed loads, orientation, speed, direction, and positioning. They would have to build all the thousands of joints and muscles required by a human to function in an upright position, and likely have a pricetag well above that of a modern day APC, and massive factory complexes devoted to producing a relative few, complex and highly precise parts. Why do that, when instead you can use the generic copy-paste programming on the mass produced cogitator-brains, and then augment the human chassis with whatever the required function-limb they need for a tiny fraction of the cost?

Servitors, then, require organic matter to supplement the electric charge they rely on. I would imagine hyper-dense nutrient packs are located somewhere where the digestive tract used to be, and likely contain enough "rations" for months, if not years, of continued function. Waste would be nearly non-existent, since the waste we produce is a result of inefficiencies in digestion and the wasted energy used for breaking down foods that we only use a fraction of anyways. Remove that process and replace it with directly supplied nutrients tailored precisely to everything the body needs to function, and govern metabolism and energy usage by computer, and that goes away, allowing the weight-space equivalent of an apple to feed a semi-organic life for exorbitant amounts of time.

Servoskulls, relying on the hover-pad propulsion and bearing no organic movements at all, would likely be able to have the equivalent of a ketchup pack last them longer then the preserved and reinforced organic components are likely to, even if they do run off a human brain-fragment. The only issue would be powering the mechanical aspects.



#14 Lynata

Lynata

    Member

  • Members
  • 2,920 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 04:30 AM

BangBangTequila said:

Within the ranks of the Mechanicus, however, AI does exist. Not AI as in Cortana, with thoughts and feelings, but AI such as a Terminator. Complicated, intelligent, capable of adaptation, but governed by an unassailably empowered higher function (John Connor's reprogrammed unit is my example, or even all other individual terminators - not Skynet). This wouldn't be seen as heretical within the Mechanicus, for the simple reason that they understand it.
So … you are suggesting that the Adeptus Mechanicus would violate the Emperor's Ban on Abominable Intelligences that has been in place ever since the Dark Age of Technology?

It is my understanding that the usage of human brains is the AdMech's way to circumvent it, and given the Cult Mechanicus' opinion on steel over flesh they would not be used if the Mechanicus would also employ True AIs alongside them. By augmenting an organic brain with technology and wiring it into their machinery, they can essentially point to it and say "no AI, it's cool" - somewhat similar to the Ecclesiarchy using the Sisters of Battle to circumvent the No Man Under Arms deal.

That said, as I had to learn 40k is all about interpretations, so I apologise if this is an intentional deviation.


current 40k RPG character: Aura Vashaan, Astromancer Witch-Priestess
previous characters: Captain Elias (Celestial Lions Chapter -- debriefed), Comrade-Trooper Dasha Malenko (1207th Valhallan Ice Warriors -- KIA), Sister Elana (Order of the Sacred Rose -- assassinated), Leftenant Darion Baylesworth (Rogue Trader Artemisia -- retired), Taleera "Raven" Nephran (Hive Ganger & Inquisitorial Assassin -- mindwiped)

#15 BangBangTequila

BangBangTequila

    Member

  • Members
  • 267 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 09:31 AM

The Imperial definition of Abominable Intelligence is a fractious, self-enhancing mind possessed of a consciousness. Nothing which I have described (using the modern term standing for Artificial Intelligence, rather then Abominable Intelligence) falls under that definition. The ability to think and reason is different then the ability to improve oneself in a very fundamental way. As exemplified above, with the Legio Cybernetica. Hell, look at a Land Raider Machine Spirit, capable of full autonomous function if needed. Artificial Intelligence? Absolutely! What I was saying was that the Mechanicus make liberal use of Artificial intelligence without crossing the line into Abominable, by rendering all of their creations unable to improve themselves.

Now, having a human brain would solve a considerable number of problems even if it wasn't in control, simply by virtue of governing the myriad biological functions that the organic "chassis" uses. But, even with a human brain, they still can't actually think, only follow programming, so the AI thing doesn't even really apply.



#16 N0-1_H3r3

N0-1_H3r3

    Former Contributing Freelance Writer

  • Members
  • 3,312 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 09:46 AM

Lynata said:

BangBangTequila said:

Within the ranks of the Mechanicus, however, AI does exist. Not AI as in Cortana, with thoughts and feelings, but AI such as a Terminator. Complicated, intelligent, capable of adaptation, but governed by an unassailably empowered higher function (John Connor's reprogrammed unit is my example, or even all other individual terminators - not Skynet). This wouldn't be seen as heretical within the Mechanicus, for the simple reason that they understand it.

So … you are suggesting that the Adeptus Mechanicus would violate the Emperor's Ban on Abominable Intelligences that has been in place ever since the Dark Age of Technology?

We don't know precisely how Abominable Intellects are defined in the Treaty of Mars, so we can't say for certain what the ban specifically covers, particularly as Artificial Intelligence is something of a fuzzy and ill-defined term.

Thing is, though, we do have plenty of sources depicting machines that, while not intelligent, are far from inanimate. Titans in particular are depicted as having drives and personalities all their own, with the relationship between Princeps and Engine being one of handler and war-beast as much as one of pilot and vehicle. The advanced machine spirits of these creations - titans, starships, advanced Astartes vehicles, and similar sophisticated constructions - appear to be animalistic in nature, the confluence of run-time processes, system automation, recorded situations, programmed routines and other elements of extremely sophisticated programming that have created some semblance of instinct and rudimentary self-determination.

For example, a Reaver Titan is an aggressive, violent machine because its software and systems are designed to make it an efficient and responsive war engine. When the engine's augurs detect an enemy, countless process, subroutines and base-level systems come into effect automatically - the reactor steps up from idling to battle-ready, servos and actuators switch gear for faster physical response or greater firing stability, the weapon cogitators begin calculating firing solutions, and weapons are prepared to fire. The whole process is an aggressive act, and a Princeps - connected by MIU to the engine - 'feels' the engine's building wrath, as its synthetic instincts urge it to battle, and the intimacy of the MIU link means that a weak mind may be overwhelmed by the flood of automated imperatives and unable to suppress, control or direct them. The entire process of operating a Titan is such a complex and nuanced affair that any lesser degree of automation is too inefficient, but the ultimate authority of a Princeps over the Titan is employed as a final control measure and as a singular guiding force alike.

The machine isn't intelligent, but it's far from being inert. This is, IMO, the kind of thing that BangBangTequila is talking about.

The next level below that, in terms of defining "Machine Spirits" is the anthropomorphism of machinery - something that everyone is familiar with to some degree or another. Those moments where a car or computer or other device doesn't work quite as you want and you shout at it, or when you come to know a machine you work with so well that you know its particular quirks of operation - the right way to get it running again when it stops, etc. Due to all manner of things like variances within manufacturing tolerances, interaction between specific components, and simple wear and tear, every machine is subtly different. Add to that the spiritual inclinations of the Imperium, the rote-learning commonplace in the Imperium, and the tendency to conceal knowledge behind ritual, and you get a whole other pile of concepts. A lasgun's 'spirit' is an eager one, easily pleased and compliant, taking well to simple rites of maintenance and forgiving of minor errors. A plasma gun is a truculent, ill-tempered machine, quick to anger and volatile when mistreated even slightly. Add to that any number of complex systems within a machine's greater operation - an electronic scope may be regarded as having its own spirit, an anthropomorphised representation of the software and function of the device, and the concept of "machine spirit" gets quite complex.

It gets worse when you consider that a device with an advanced machine spirit - like a Titan - may also be subject to the same nuances of manufacture, maintenance and use as any other device, and individual components of the Titan may be viewed as having their own spirits distinct from but related to the larger creation they are part of.


Writing Credits for Fantasy Flight Games: Into the Storm, Edge of the Abyss, Battlefleet Koronus, Hostile Acquisitions, Black Crusade Core Rulebook, First Founding, The Jericho Reach, The Soul Reaver, Only War, The Navis Primer and Ark of Lost Souls


#17 Lynata

Lynata

    Member

  • Members
  • 2,920 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 11:11 AM

The definition used on the material once hosted on GW's homepage seems pretty simple. "Sentient machinery" and "machines that can think fully for themselves", which to me is exactly what an Artificial Intelligence is all about. 

To me it would seem that "Abominable Intelligence" is just a 40k'ified term for "Artificial Intelligence". They both use the same abbreviation and mean the same thing; the full name simply morphed into its current term following countless years of decline in technological knowledge and propagation of the belief that AIs are an evil thing. Just like the Men of Iron occasionally mentioned in Imperial history are obviously not actual men of iron but simply robots (with an A.I.) with a fancy name bestowed by people who don't understand them anymore.

It's part of the Grimdark theme, and I am relatively sure there are more examples for such "falsified" terms to be found in the setting. Take the "Hellgun" for example, which just used to be called HEL-gun (for High Energy Laser). Or the RH-1N0, which is "now" called a Rhino. Nobody in the Imperium remembers the actual names these things were once called, and with "Abominable Intelligences" it's the same.

But I guess our perceptions of the topic are just different. For the record, I also think that a Titan would use a similar means to compute its information than a Land Raider.

BangBangTequila said:

Hell, look at a Land Raider Machine Spirit, capable of full autonomous function if needed. Artificial Intelligence? Absolutely!
Yet Land Raiders (if we go by GW's own fluff) are hardwired to a human brain, not an A.I.

No big deal, though. When you follow your own interpretation for this, it does line up and make sense, so it's all good.


current 40k RPG character: Aura Vashaan, Astromancer Witch-Priestess
previous characters: Captain Elias (Celestial Lions Chapter -- debriefed), Comrade-Trooper Dasha Malenko (1207th Valhallan Ice Warriors -- KIA), Sister Elana (Order of the Sacred Rose -- assassinated), Leftenant Darion Baylesworth (Rogue Trader Artemisia -- retired), Taleera "Raven" Nephran (Hive Ganger & Inquisitorial Assassin -- mindwiped)




© 2013 Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc. Fantasy Flight Games and the FFG logo are ® of Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc.  All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Contact | User Support | Rules Questions | Help | RSS