Jump to content



Photo

Cleaving, Quick Casting, Rapid Fire


  • Please log in to reply
4 replies to this topic

#1 BerserkOL

BerserkOL

    Member

  • Members
  • 9 posts

Posted 16 July 2012 - 10:40 PM

 These skills grant you extra attacks on a triggering condition and after spending an amount of fatigue.
From the FAQ i have seen that these skills can be triggered even by attacks made through a guard order or made by the overlord through dark charm.
This extra attack from these skills must be used immediately after the triggering attack, so nothing can happen between them.
And only Quick Casting became exhausted after using it.


My questions arise from the marked part of the following sentences (from the last FAQ):

“Q: Can heroes attack an empty square? For example, could a blast effect be centered in an empty square or could a hero fire his Staff of Knowledge off into a corner to burn the overlord’s threat?
A: Yes. However, if after spending surges there are no valid targets in the area of the attack (hero or monster), the entire attack is canceled without effect. This means that if the blast is not large enough, the attack fails, and the Staff of Knowledge must actually hit something to use its ability.”


To be considered a valid attack to trigger these skill cards, the attack must:
1- Be declared, roll the dice, and the attack must affect an area (also only 1 square) containing AT LEAST 1 figure, but doesn't matter if the attack HITS or HURTS anyone.
or
2- The attack must HIT at least 1 figure (also without damaging it), if for any reason the attack miss the attack is canceled and so can't trigger Quick Casting and Rapid Fire.
Wich of these definitions is the correct one?

3- And if the correct one is the second:
For purpose of considered the attack canceled, does something change if the attack misses because of insufficient range or because the area radius of the blast attack is too small (so, there are no figures in the target area), or if instead the attack misses because the hero rolls a "X" on a dice or targets have Fear skill and the hero doesn't roll enough surges (so, there ARE figures in the target area, but you don't HIT anyone)?

 

4- Then one other thing about the interaction of these skill cards with Dark Charm:
Reading the last faq i have learned that is up to the hero player, not the overlord, decides which if any of the hero’s skills are used for the attack controlled by the OL.
But can a skill, deactivated by the hero for the OL attack, be reactivated and used on an attack generated by an extra-attack-skill and triggerd by the OL attack? the words "immediately" and "with the same weapon" of these skill cards don't prevent him from using the skills that weren't usable for the attack that triggered the new one? The "immediately" word prevents players to do everything between the triggering attack and the extra-attack-skill, even spend MP, does it prevent to turn on the deactivated skills?
Here an example to clarify:
Let's say that the hero has one of these skills cards (quick casting, rapid fire or cleaving) and another skill or hero's ability that gives him a bonus to damage (for example Mad Carthos's ability: "When making Magic attacks, Mad Carthos gains 2 damage." or Wild Talent skill card:"You have the Sorcery 1 ability…").
After that the overlord dark charm the hero, the player of the "possessed" hero declares he will not use the skill/ability which grants him bonus to damage, to lower the ovelord damage.
Now the overlord attacks without using the extra damage skill, he hits another hero and he inflicts wounds to the target. Control of the hero passes from the OL to the hero player.
Now the player of the dark charmed hero declares immediately that he uses the attack done by the OL to trigger his extra-attack-skill (quick casting,…) and spends the right amount of fatigue.
Now he must use the same weapon used by the overlod, but does this imply that the player can't reactivate the extra damage skill that he turned off for the attack of the overlod?

 

Thank you.



#2 Parathion

Parathion

    Member

  • Members
  • 954 posts

Posted 17 July 2012 - 07:06 AM

The answer to your first question is Nr 1. Granted, the wording in the FAQ answer may be misleading and it would be better worded as "the attack becomes a miss" and not "it is cancelled". Any attack with any outcome may trigger the skills in question.

The answer to Nr 4 is: Yes, the hero may use all his skills in his extra attack. There is basically no "memory" in Descent that stores previous "states" (beyond those where a marker is applied or something got spent). The hero gets an attack with all usual rules in force.



#3 Rajamic

Rajamic

    Member

  • Members
  • 81 posts

Posted 17 July 2012 - 12:13 PM

Cleaving wouldn't be able to trigger regardless, since it requires you to kill with the previous attack.



#4 Parathion

Parathion

    Member

  • Members
  • 954 posts

Posted 17 July 2012 - 10:48 PM

Of course Cleaving still requires a kill. The focus of the question was which "kind" of attacks (Guard, Dark Charm, any) would trigger the skills.

 



#5 BerserkOL

BerserkOL

    Member

  • Members
  • 9 posts

Posted 18 July 2012 - 02:18 AM

 
Yes, I was wondering if an attack that does not hit any target may still be considered a valid attack to trigger quick casting or rapid fire.
And the same question for an attack that targets an area without targets (figures).

But Parathion solved the problem rewording the faq from "it is cancelled" to "the attack becomes a miss". My doubts were dependent on the word "cancelled".
So now I know that if an attack is made, doesn't matter if it hits something or affect an area without figures. If an attack is made, it can be used to trigger these skill cards.

Yes, you're right, cleaving is the only one that does not create problems as it stands its description.

Dark Charm and extra-skill-attack:
OK, i misinterpreted the rule and started to think that the player can turn-off and turn-on skills, while instead looks like that skills remain avaiable but is up to the player decide when use it (so he could decide to use a skill on an attack and not on the following one).
My error.

Thank you Parathion and Rajamic.






© 2013 Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc. Fantasy Flight Games and the FFG logo are ® of Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc.  All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Contact | User Support | Rules Questions | Help | RSS