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Syrio/Epic Phase deck?


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#1 HomerJ

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 03:20 AM

Last year, at the Fire and Ice event, I played against someone playing a deck based around Epic Phases and Syrio.  I was wondering if anyone knows who played it, or what the list was like?  I'd like to put it together for the casual Melee stuff my group does, and I'm not sure what all the pieces were.

Side question about the same:  If I play 2 or more of the Epic Phase events, each one creates it's own Epic Phase, correct?  So Syrio or any other shadows character has a chance to come into play at the start of each?


Thanks



#2 HomerJ

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 09:39 AM

Wow.  35 views and no comments?

Could someone at least confirm the rules question about the Epic phase?



#3 jmccarthy

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 09:51 AM

 Here's my version:

 

House Card (1)
House Stark Core Set 1

Agendas (1)
The Siege of Winterfell Lords of Winter 1

Plots (7)
Storm of Swords Lords of Winter 1
After the Mummer's Ford Kings of the Sea 1
City of Lies City of Secrets 1
Blockade Core Set 1
Valar Morghulis Core Set 1
Fear of Winter Beyond the Wall 1
Rule by Decree Core Set 1

Characters (34)
Northern Cavalry Flank Scattered Armies 3
Direwolf Pup Core Set 3
Carrion Bird The Winds of Winter 3
Shadowcat Kings of the Sea 2
Arya Stark City of Secrets 1
Catelyn Stark Lords of Winter 3
Bolton Refugee Refugees of War 3
Hungry Mob City of Secrets 3
Wolf Pack Lords of Winter 3
Lucas Blackwood Gates of the Citadel 1
Syrio Forel Tales from the Red Keep 3
Meera Reed Tourney For The Hand 3
Rickard Karstark Where Loyalty Lies 1
Ser Jorah Mormont Princes of the Sun 1
Hodor Core Set 1

Events (12)
Endless Endurance Lords of Winter 2
The Battle of the Whispering Wood Epic Battles 3
At Night They Howl Lords of Winter 3
War of Five Kings Refugees of War 3
Battle of Ruby Ford Battle of Ruby Ford 1

Locations (14)
Kingdom of Shadows Kings of the Sea 2
Winterfell Kennels Core Set 1
Narrow Sea Kings of the Storm 3
Street of Steel Core Set 1
The Searoad Kings of the Storm 1
Wolfswood Lords of Winter 2
Great Keep Lords of Winter 3
Borderland Keep The Wildling Horde 1
 



#4 jmccarthy

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 09:51 AM

 @Rules: yes, Syrio can come out each turn.



#5 jmccarthy

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 09:52 AM

jmccarthy said:

 @Rules: yes, Syrio can come out each turn.

I meant to say, each phase, including each new Epic phase.



#6 Skowza

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 11:04 AM

HomerJ said:


…I'd like to put it together for the casual Melee stuff my group does, and I'm not sure what all the pieces were.


The basic strategy is still the same as it was a year ago - weenie rush with Epic Battles. Northern CF and Vanguard Scouts are also really helpful, the only problem is that as more and more cards get added to the card pool, the build becomes weaker and weaker. There's so many ways to shut down M challenges these days, this build really hasn't gotten any useful new cards, opponent's First Snow will be really bad for you and playing pre-plot Epics is a dead giveaway that you're up to no good.
jmccarthy's build is pretty standard - Round 1 FoW with pre-plot Epics is common, followed by Blockade and Rule by Decree in whatever order you prefer.  When I played it, I used 3x each of Whispering Woods, Battle of the Bay, WotFK, and 2x Ruby Ford; a typical setup for me would have been Syrio in Shadows, with 2-3 M-crest weenies (Refugees, Hungry Mob) and two 0-cost discounters, if you can get the Vanguard Scout in setup too, or get enough reducers to play NCF in Round 1, thats just a bonus.  After drawing back up I would usually have 2+ Epics (since I'm using 11 in the deck). 

HomerJ said:


Side question about the same: If I play 2 or more of the Epic Phase events, each one creates it's own Epic Phase, correct? So Syrio or any other shadows character has a chance to come into play at the start of each?


Yes, like jmccarthy said, that is how it works… Syrio can win for you Round 1 if you get enough Epic Battles.

 



#7 HomerJ

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 01:19 PM

Uuuuuuummmmm wow?  Did not expect this sort of response.  Thanks to BOTH of you for all the input, I was WAY off on what I was thinking about building.  I was kind of hoping I could play a bit of a 'surprise' style deck.  Showing a theme or unusual Stark build (Tully maybe?) that just does just enough to not lose until I could play Rickard Karstark and my Epic Phase tricks.  But the stuff you are talking about is clearly more than my playgroup gives me for testing.

You guys rock!



#8 HomerJ

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:11 AM

OK, so I've been playing around with the above deck, as well as my own pile, and the questions that have come up are:

1)  In your opinion, how critical are the Shadow cards?  My original build was just a top heavy Stark-Military build, with a surprise push of Syrio turn 2 or 3.  I never tried to play Shadow stuff other than Syrio because of the pressure.

2)  Direwolf support?  Is that just thematic, or is that the 'right' play?  Sure a 2M for 1 or a 3M for 2 is good, but good enough to force direwolf events and locations into the list?

3)  I really like Qhorin and a couple of the other Night's Watch characters.  Does the deck HAVE to play Siege at Winterfell to win?  I think it might, but looking for other opinions.

 

Thanks



#9 Skowza

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Posted 15 July 2012 - 06:31 PM

Your build is going to be a bit different since you are playing Melee while I was building Joust decks… I'm guessing jmccarthy put up a Joust build as well; if I'm wrong, props, cause it doesnt look like a viable Melee deck.  Vanguard Scouts that I advocated use of in the earlier post would be pretty useless in Melee; your lack of I icons will also encourage unopposed farming from everyone at the table. 

QUOTE efidm=680514]

1)  In your opinion, how critical are the Shadow cards?  My original build was just a top heavy Stark-Military build, with a surprise push of Syrio turn 2 or 3.  I never tried to play Shadow stuff other than Syrio because of the pressure.

 

Which ones are you using?  I don't want to speak for him, but jmccarthy probably has the Shadowcats just because they are cheap Stealth and free to bring out; I didnt run any Shadows other than Syrio and 1-2x Arya in my build (since she can be used for claim soak and then brought right back out for Epics).

HomerJ said:

 

2) Direwolf support? Is that just thematic, or is that the 'right' play? Sure a 2M for 1 or a 3M for 2 is good, but good enough to force direwolf events and locations into the list?

 

I wouldnt bother with Direwolf themed cards, but it depends on your build I guess.  Pups are good cheap stark guys, good for setup and with a Round 1 FoW plan you want as much cheap M in setup as possible.  If you aren't planning a rush build then you might be able to slot some Direwolf support in, but I've always felt Direwolves are for a different type of deck, flooding board with more M crests than your opponent can defend against and guaranteeing you can win M challenges.  Given the amount of non-unique hate available right now I wouldn't recommend using too many of them.

HomerJ said:

 

3) I really like Qhorin and a couple of the other Night's Watch characters. Does the deck HAVE to play Siege at Winterfell to win? I think it might, but looking for other opinions.

 

If it isnt running Siege then you can't do a rush build like this; you're too dependent on M challenges providing all your power.  I think Qhorin is a pretty weak card right now with fewer and fewer non-uniques being played.  He's also pretty expensive for what he does when you consider his lack of icons and the "by 4 STR" condition; the vulnerability to VB and burn is just the icing on the cake.  I do think you could run a Stark kill build with Epics for that extra M punch, but you'll need a different bunch of cards and its going to end up pretty Event-heavy; you'd almost certainly need to include Forgotten Plans to shut down any Power of Bloods that get revealed.  Another option may be to run KM as your Agenda and figure some way to jump Beserkers into play at least 2x per Round, murdering everyones board and making enemies all over the place.
I'm really not a fan of Siege for Melee builds; maybe its just my meta, but seeing a Muster the Realm first Round is not uncommon, and when you consider that 3 other people could also be running Uneasy Truce, Shadows and Spiders and Lineage and Legacy, an entire game may be played without you being able to make a single M challenge.  With Siege the Epics could help you push for the win in Melee since you can just go after the weakest player, but Siege in Melee is just too much of a gamble for me.



#10 jmccarthy

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Posted 17 July 2012 - 06:45 AM

 Here's why I like shadows in the build:

1) Surprise Epic phase military wins.

2) In my Siege decks, my hand gets destroyed by INT decks.  Shadows protects your characters from INT challenges, and from Valar.






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