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Anyone playing as Chapter Marines instead of Deathwatch?


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#1 Khyron

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 09:08 PM

I was just curious to see if anyone here played as a Chapter squad rather than as the Deathwatch?

 

If so do you think the rules lend itself good enough to do this?

 

Many thanks,

G



#2 Thebigjul

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Posted 03 July 2012 - 12:35 AM

Hi,

Some times ago I run a little story with chapter marines, all of then was playing Iron Hands.

I have to say it had been a good game for my part and it looks the same for my player.

The problem with this kind og game is the way chapters are organised and you will never see a devastator,with an assault, with a tactic … in the same squad. Of course you can play chapter master or captain level and play with the command group but then why should they been their without chapter or compagny…

But for one shot scenario it is quite good.



#3 Kshatriya

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Posted 03 July 2012 - 02:32 PM

In theory you shouldn't need a Cohesion mechanic as a squad of all Ultramarines would theoretically be able to spam their Squad Modes constantly without affecting groupthink.



#4 professor_kylan

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Posted 03 July 2012 - 03:54 PM

My recomendation would be starting the group out as initiates, learning to trust each other. It gives the cohesion mechanics a reason to exist, and you can slowly advance people through the ranks before making them choose a specialty (it requires a little houseruling, I'll admit, but it's worth it).



#5 Dulahan

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Posted 03 July 2012 - 06:39 PM

I have to say, it is my most sincere hope our 'big book' for 2013 will be a book to have two things.

 

1: Optional advancement that lacks classes.

 

And 2:  Rules to play as all in the same chapter instead of the Deathwatch.



#6 Kshatriya

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 04:19 AM

Dulahan said:

I have to say, it is my most sincere hope our 'big book' for 2013 will be a book to have two things.

 

1: Optional advancement that lacks classes.

 

And 2:  Rules to play as all in the same chapter instead of the Deathwatch.

1. That seemed to be the biggest criticism of Black Crusade.

2. Uh…what additional rules do you really need? If you want to keep the Cohesion system maybe double the size of the pool. It's not like playing all Ultramarines really requires a lot of new crunch.



#7 Dulahan

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 08:15 AM

Kshatriya said:

 

1. That seemed to be the biggest criticism of Black Crusade.

 

 

Seriously?  That was always the thing people liked most about BC in my opinion.  The Biggest Criticism was always "I don't want to be a villain…"  And BC sorta forces that on you.  RPGnet and other big RPG circles, at least, the Class System is seen as the biggest weakness of the entire line.  I'm SO happy that Only War has finally done away with it in a way that works and lets you be the… well, not Chaos Guys.



#8 Lucius Valerius

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 11:36 AM

Dulahan said:

Kshatriya said:

 

 

1. That seemed to be the biggest criticism of Black Crusade.

 

 

 

 

Seriously?  That was always the thing people liked most about BC in my opinion.  The Biggest Criticism was always "I don't want to be a villain…"  And BC sorta forces that on you.  RPGnet and other big RPG circles, at least, the Class System is seen as the biggest weakness of the entire line.  I'm SO happy that Only War has finally done away with it in a way that works and lets you be the… well, not Chaos Guys.

 

Yeah and that's why I started the thread asking for a classles advance system for DW.



#9 CaptainStabby

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 04:23 PM

You still had classes, they were just called Chaos Gods.

I like the intent behind both the DW class system and the BC "classless" one, I just dont like how they actually got implemented.



#10 professor_kylan

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 04:34 PM

Lucius Valerius said:

 

Yeah and that's why I started the thread asking for a classles advance system for DW.

 

Did you get a chance to look at the one I linked? I'm still trying to get feedback so I can start fixing it up for the v1.2 version.



#11 andrewm9

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 08:36 AM

Thebigjul said:

Hi,

Some times ago I run a little story with chapter marines, all of then was playing Iron Hands.

I have to say it had been a good game for my part and it looks the same for my player.

The problem with this kind og game is the way chapters are organised and you will never see a devastator,with an assault, with a tactic … in the same squad. Of course you can play chapter master or captain level and play with the command group but then why should they been their without chapter or compagny…

But for one shot scenario it is quite good.

Why not a devastator? Surely every tactical sqaud has one heavy weapon. There is no reason why a few people can't be assault marines either in a tactical sqaud,. Every one is trained with a bolter, heavy bolter, etc. They just favor their hand to hand training more. What you probably won't see though is an Apothecary or a Librarian or a Tech Marine unless assigned to yoru battlegroup for a campaign.



#12 Thebigjul

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Posted 31 July 2012 - 02:24 AM

andrewm9 said:

Thebigjul said:

 

Hi,

Some times ago I run a little story with chapter marines, all of then was playing Iron Hands.

I have to say it had been a good game for my part and it looks the same for my player.

The problem with this kind og game is the way chapters are organised and you will never see a devastator,with an assault, with a tactic … in the same squad. Of course you can play chapter master or captain level and play with the command group but then why should they been their without chapter or compagny…

But for one shot scenario it is quite good.

 

 

Why not a devastator? Surely every tactical sqaud has one heavy weapon. There is no reason why a few people can't be assault marines either in a tactical sqaud,. Every one is trained with a bolter, heavy bolter, etc. They just favor their hand to hand training more. What you probably won't see though is an Apothecary or a Librarian or a Tech Marine unless assigned to yoru battlegroup for a campaign.

 

Yes for a devastator marine in a tactical squad, but assault marines in tactical… seems better used in an assault squad…

SM aren't free, they have a place, there's an order for assignement and Assault marines are in assault squad and only 10% of would be devastator are in other squads.

Librarian, techmarines and apothicary would be found in command squad.

So if you want to have a wide choice of character play rank 5 or more and play command squad or be codex line and deal with the fact of having more or less the same character for each player.

Right now, before protest,  even none codex SM chapter are organised, red claws are assault marines and have no heavy weapons ect…

Sure you could have a tactical SM with a better swordmanship than the other and one being the sniper but they all are tactical SM;



#13 Callous

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Posted 31 July 2012 - 04:51 PM

Now why wouldn't you see assult marines mixed into a tactical squad.  They just wouldn't have a jump pack.  Tactical squads can be organized as either all bolters or bolt pistol and chain swords.  It would therefore be a fair assumption that on a mission where one might not know what to expect they would send a squad with a fair mix to handle the task.  I agree with some of the more specialized units only being tasked to a command squad or only being committed to larger engagements but you could also use similar reasoning as to why they might be in the squad. 

Forced Organization, though mentioned in the codex astartes, was also a method of balancing the table top game. 

I don't think it would be impossible to field a campaign as all one chapter (maybe save for the Ultramarines who's devout adherence to the codex astartes borders on the crazy) because as Sun Tzu teaches us, we are nothing if we cannot adapt.






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