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Request to FFG for alternate advances


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#1 Lucius Valerius

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 03:41 AM

Posting here hoping someone at FFG actually check the forum from time to time. I know some of the guys that work with FFG does and post regularly so maybe someone else does.

I'm a big fan of FFG work on 40K rpg and every new game brings more interesting developments to the core mechanics for combat, advancements and so forth and been a Ultramarine player in TT (6000 points of army so far and growing) I love playing DW as one of the smurfs =D. 

What I didn't really appreciated was the way how advance tables works as I have always found them either too rigid or not making much sense from a fluff standpoint (I understand the need for balance classes and avoid minmaxing  but still..) and I overjoyed when BC was released and allowed to play marines with a little bit more freedom in term of choices for how your character advances. 

From what I understand OW works similarly to BC for what concerns advances while retaining a DW feel to classes and that makes me much more inclined to buy the the product once it's released. Between BC and OW it looks like we are witnessing a 2.0 evolution of the game and that bring me hope for the whole game. 

I would be possible to publish an update, much like it was done with the FAQ with the updated weapon dmg, for DW to have alternate advances progression or whatnot that follow BC/OW template ? 



#2 HappyDaze

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 06:39 AM

Lucius Valerius said:

Between BC and OW it looks like we are witnessing a 2.0 evolution of the game and that bring me hope for the whole game.

Abandon that hope. FFG moves forward and rarely looks back. Each game that comes out uses a more updated and refined version of the rules, but you don't really see these put back into the older games (look at the psyker rules in DH which have been updated and refined four times now). Even the 'revised/errata weapon stats' were, IIRC, made for Deathwatch and then showed up in the next product -  BC.


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#3 Lucius Valerius

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 07:44 AM

HappyDaze said:

Lucius Valerius said:

Between BC and OW it looks like we are witnessing a 2.0 evolution of the game and that bring me hope for the whole game.

 

Abandon that hope. FFG moves forward and rarely looks back. Each game that comes out uses a more updated and refined version of the rules, but you don't really see these put back into the older games (look at the psyker rules in DH which have been updated and refined four times now). Even the 'revised/errata weapon stats' were, IIRC, made for Deathwatch and then showed up in the next product -  BC.

 

So my only hope is to dream of an hypothetical future release of a SM oriented game or an expansion of OW that has nothing to do with DW ? 



#4 Dulahan

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 09:40 AM

I was thinking there has to be a way to do OW style advances in DW too…

 

And hoping it will happen in such a way as to not invalidate older books.



#5 Lucius Valerius

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 10:34 AM

Dulahan said:

 

I was thinking there has to be a way to do OW style advances in DW too…

 

And hoping it will happen in such a way as to not invalidate older books.

 

 

 

Well, OW isn't even out yet and unless someone that worked on it is willing to do the legwork (then again they are going to do it anyway either way I guess =P) we'll have to rely on FFG for this, hence the request thread.



#6 Onyx Bana

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 12:12 PM

Heck, I'd be happy just to get an updated Errata/FAQ document out of them.



#7 Dulahan

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 12:29 PM

Lucius Valerius said:

Dulahan said:

 

I was thinking there has to be a way to do OW style advances in DW too…

 

And hoping it will happen in such a way as to not invalidate older books.

 

 

 

Well, OW isn't even out yet and unless someone that worked on it is willing to do the legwork (then again they are going to do it anyway either way I guess =P) we'll have to rely on FFG for this, hence the request thread.

 

It's out if you are doing the Beta.  ;)   And it's advance scheme is marvellous. 

 

Honestly, it shouldn't even be that hard to port over to DW.  Other than we'd  need new costs.  And figuring out what the Aptitudes are for various chapters and 'specialties'  (Which make a LOT more sense for Marines if you ask me)  Probably only one, MAYBE two Aptitudes (Possibly even none, but then a likely bonus talent or skills or something) per chapter.  But  still important to know

 

Frankly this would be perfect for representing Space Marines.  By the time they make the Deathwatch odds are they have gotten to Tactical Marine level.  Or were particularly skilled at lower levels.  It makes sure all have the sort of opportunities of a Tactical Marine, but if you're particularly inclined to more melee focuses, or shooting, or whatever.  Your aptitudes will help give you a better advance schema.  Plus  it will can the  artificial "Sorry, you can't take the next melee talent you want because you're still two Career Ranks away" - so much for being an amazing Astartes Swordsman who got accepted to the Deathwatch!



#8 Kshatriya

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 03:35 PM

Dulahan said:

Frankly this would be perfect for representing Space Marines.  By the time they make the Deathwatch odds are they have gotten to Tactical Marine level.  Or were particularly skilled at lower levels.  It makes sure all have the sort of opportunities of a Tactical Marine, but if you're particularly inclined to more melee focuses, or shooting, or whatever.  Your aptitudes will help give you a better advance schema.  Plus  it will can the  artificial "Sorry, you can't take the next melee talent you want because you're still two Career Ranks away" - so much for being an amazing Astartes Swordsman who got accepted to the Deathwatch!

It's stated in the Core that Codex DW marines have served in the Devastator, Tactical, and Assault roles at least once in their home Chapter before taking the Specialty in the Deathwatch.



#9 professor_kylan

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 03:47 PM

*coughcough http://www.fantasyfl...=3&efidt=668600 cough*

 

Sorry, had something stuck in my throat there for a second. Now, I'm not going to say the rules I'm working on are esactly what you're looking for - I'm just going to sit back and let you come to that conclusion on your ownsome.

 

(In fairness warning: These are still pretty new. Hoping to have v.1.2 up soon, which are a lot neater and have a great more options in there.)



#10 Lucius Valerius

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 05:37 PM

Kshatriya said:

Dulahan said:

 

Frankly this would be perfect for representing Space Marines.  By the time they make the Deathwatch odds are they have gotten to Tactical Marine level.  Or were particularly skilled at lower levels.  It makes sure all have the sort of opportunities of a Tactical Marine, but if you're particularly inclined to more melee focuses, or shooting, or whatever.  Your aptitudes will help give you a better advance schema.  Plus  it will can the  artificial "Sorry, you can't take the next melee talent you want because you're still two Career Ranks away" - so much for being an amazing Astartes Swordsman who got accepted to the Deathwatch!

 

 

It's stated in the Core that Codex DW marines have served in the Devastator, Tactical, and Assault roles at least once in their home Chapter before taking the Specialty in the Deathwatch.

 

Yes that's exactly my problem with how advances works for DW, no regard for the fluff whatsoever.. They erving in Reserve Companies where you as a devastator, assault and then tactical marine BEFORE been shipped to Battle Companies where they decide what they are going to be. And I'm assuming it's at that point that you might be selected for a role in the DW. That is mandatory for all codex chapters and blood angels (and descendants) so how come they lack any skill/talent to simulate that like IE jump packs skill ?

Please FFG Look this up and delivers us with cool new advances rules like BC and OW =D



#11 Dulahan

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 06:42 PM

To be fair.  It DOES say in the corebook that there's nothing to stop a particularly talented Scout from being forwarded to the Deathwatch either. 

 

But as it stands, the Marines we play seem to have even forgot how to be Scouts, let alone any of the other roles… 



#12 andrewm9

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 03:32 AM

Dulahan said:

But as it stands, the Marines we play seem to have even forgot how to be Scouts, let alone any of the other roles… 

How so, all Marines in Dw have Silent Move and Concealment thus enabling them to be stealthy. Also all Marines have Awareness at trained along with their elevated senses enabling them to be observant. Those seem to be the hallmarks fo what it means to be a basic scout.

The only thing any marine can't do despite the fluff of training is use a jump pack,. In my opinion all Deathwatch marines should have Pilot: Personal at the start of the game.



#13 Decessor

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 04:48 AM

One way to approach the Deathwatch specialties is to throw in the word "veteran" in there, as Deathwatch recruits are either veterans or extremely gifted younger marines. If all marines have gone through the training of assault, devastator and tactical, then the Deathwatch specialties can represent the stage *after* that when they perfect their craft in their chosen field. For example, any marine can swing a chainsword but only an assault marine is focusing on how to get the most out of it






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