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Clone troopers?


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#1 bladerunner_35

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 08:33 AM

Clones are cool m'kay. I have wanted to do a campaign centered around clones for quite a while and Only War might be the right vehicle to make that happen. I know the Imperium doesn't like people thinking for themselves and innovation is very bad. How about cloning? Can anyone give me a reference to some official text about the subject of cloning? Please just clean cut references, not opinions. Black Library novels are cool.


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#2 Bassemandrh

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 11:44 AM

I know the Stryxis aliens can clone people for you.

Im quite sure the Admech is able (but unlikely) to make clones.

I think the Death Korp of Krieg make use of some kind of cloning technology to bolster their recruitment rates.



#3 Sovereign

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 06:25 PM

The AdMech generally frowns upon cloning, but there are two examples in universe:


Afriel Strain Soldiers: Clones of great IG heroes (http://wh40k.lexican...in#.T-lFq_XheUk)

Vitae Womb: Used by the Death Korps of Krieg to bulk up their numbers, but only suspected to be cloning. (http://wh40k.lexican...nt_.26_Training)
 



#4 Kasatka

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Posted 26 June 2012 - 02:35 AM

Cloning(known as replicae) is generally forbidden in the Imperium. Outright duplication of a person through genetic techniques doesn't exist, at least not in a widespread enough manner for a Guard Regiment to make use of it. However there is precedent of accelerated genetic manipulation techniques as seen with Corax and his Raven guard, or Fabius Bile's attempt to clone Horus after the Heresy.

Having a guard regiment that was similar to the gene-hanced troops around the time of the Horus Heresy could be cool, but it'd be have to be done off the books, lest the Commisariat and Munitorum come down on the regiment like a tonne of bricks.


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#5 andrewm9

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Posted 26 June 2012 - 05:14 AM

The Death Korps of Krieg quite probably uses cloned(or vat grown) troopers. There really isn't a possible way for them to meet their tithes otherwise given the small habitable areas on Krieg.



#6 Nameless2all

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Posted 26 June 2012 - 05:39 AM

andrewm9 said:

The Death Korps of Krieg quite probably uses cloned(or vat grown) troopers. There really isn't a possible way for them to meet their tithes otherwise given the small habitable areas on Krieg.

Hehe, always a recipe for something bad to happen here.  Can anyone whisper "Chaos taint?" 

Didn't someone make a movie about this, in a galaxy far far away? 


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#7 bladerunner_35

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Posted 26 June 2012 - 06:12 AM

Nameless2all said:

 

andrewm9 said:

 

The Death Korps of Krieg quite probably uses cloned(or vat grown) troopers. There really isn't a possible way for them to meet their tithes otherwise given the small habitable areas on Krieg.

 

 

Hehe, always a recipe for something bad to happen here.  Can anyone whisper "Chaos taint?" 

Didn't someone make a movie about this, in a galaxy far far away? 

 

 

 

Yea, the Clone Wars would be the greatest source of inspiration. I enjoy Star Wars but I'm not hardcore by any means. But watching the show with the kids I've come to realise that there's a lot of cool rp potential in clone soldiers. I've also read and enjoyed the Clone Republic and the other books by Steven Kent.

Questions of individuality and sacrifice for the greater good could make for a nice philosophical fond and break up the hardcore militaristic bloodletting a little. Not too much though, hardcore militaristic bloodletting is where it's at after all.

Thank you for your input, especially the references. It'll help my research.


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#8 omnimpotent

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Posted 16 July 2012 - 05:10 AM

Not exactly clones, but something that's broadly similar, the Geno Five-Two Chiliad:

 

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Geno_Five-Two_Chiliad



#9 Blood Pact

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Posted 17 July 2012 - 01:20 PM

Sovereign said:

The AdMech generally frowns upon cloning, but there are two examples in universe:


Afriel Strain Soldiers: Clones of great IG heroes (http://wh40k.lexican...in#.T-lFq_XheUk)

Vitae Womb: Used by the Death Korps of Krieg to bulk up their numbers, but only suspected to be cloning. (http://wh40k.lexican...nt_.26_Training)
 

Well, the Afriel Strain aren't so much clones, as they're an attempt to make Solid Snake in 40K form. Take genetic samplings from all kiinds of legendary soldiers and splice them together to try and create super-soldiers

While the Death Korps don't seem so much like clones as they are grown in test-tubes, so to speak (perhaps like the Geno regiments from Horus Heresy series, who grown from eggs extracted from their women.. there's more, but that's the important bit).



#10 Fgdsfg

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Posted 24 July 2012 - 07:16 AM

Despite what the Imperium may or may not do, I'd say that the technology is there, even if it's DAoT/Archeotech. The Dark Age of Technology basically throws together every single high-sci-fi trope and scenario that have ever been produced and cloning is a pretty big staple.

That said, it *is* illegal, so you'd have to - at the very least - heavily involve the AdMech and special sanctions to pull it off in a believable manner.


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#11 Alekzanter

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Posted 01 August 2012 - 06:09 AM

The Emperor strictly forbade cloning. It is a direct Imperial Decree, straight from the Emperor's lips, and carries dire yet succinct punishments, as outlined in the Lex Imperialis. Had something to do with clones being empty, soulless beings, something less than Human. May have read about it in the Inquisition War Trilogy, or the original Rogue Trader…where exactly escapes me at the moment.



#12 Bron

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 11:37 PM

I'd agree with Blood Pact, I've always imagined that female kreigers would be harvested of their eggs and then they were grown in vast complexes of artificial wombs, it might even be possible that the overies would be harvested while they themselves are being birthed and then matured in vitro rather then in vivo.  This has the advantage of the fact that then you don't have to worry about endangering these women during the maturation period allowing them to take part in industry and the guard (what with the grim dark industry is probably fairly dangerous and we know that kreig training is exceptionally so).  If you were being totaly logical then you would probably shift the ratios of women to men to have more women as this would result in more eggs that could be harvested while not effecting the fighting ability of the death corps.   This could also be an explanation as to why we never see the kreig without their helmets even in fluff……. 



#13 Thebigjul

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 02:55 AM

Take a look to the first tome of Enki Bilal Nikopol trilogy.

It take place in a post apo futur and paris is the capital of a facist state where women are tied to hospital bed and are making children as cake in a factory.

Pretty horrific but it taste like W 40K.

In french the book is called "la foire aux immortels"

 

wiki:

The Carnival of Immortals (Original: La Foire aux Immortels) is a science fiction graphic novel from 1980 written and illustrated by the Yugoslavian born French cartoonist and storyteller Enki Bilal. It is the first part of the Nikopol Trilogy, followed up by La Femme piège (The Woman Trap) in 1986 and ending with Froid Équateur (Equator Cold) in 1992. In 2004, Bilal directed the film adaptation Immortel (Ad Vitam), although many plot elements were changed from the comic book.
Plot

Set in the year 2023, the book follows Alcide Nikopol return to Paris after spending 30 years frozen in space as a punishment for dodging the draft. The Paris he once knew is now ruled by fascist dictator J. F. Choublanc, the city is swarming with aliens, decaying and succumbing to chaos. At the same time, a flying pyramid-shaped space craft is hovering over Paris. It is inhabited by Egyptian gods who ask for fuel from the local authorities, as their pyramid vessel has run out of gas. In return for this service Choublanc wants immortality from the gods. One renegade god, Horus, meets up with the disillusioned Nikopol in the Metro, and Nikopol agrees to allow Horus control of his body. Together they go on a journey to oppose the corrupt and megalomaniacal powers of the 21st century.

 

As you see some name are taint for ever



#14 Bron

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 08:24 PM

I believe the gears of war game also has it in its background that women are being used as basically people factories with girls being given hormones so they can beging producing children at age 12…………

I'd say thats grim enough for the 40k universe



#15 Lightbringer

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 11:48 PM

Bron said:

I believe the gears of war game also has it in its background that women are being used as basically people factories with girls being given hormones so they can beging producing children at age 12…………

I'd say thats grim enough for the 40k universe

Arguably TOO grim. The Imperium is big on oppressing the masses of humanity, burning heretics and the like, but I'm a bit wary of saying they routinely force women into sexual slavery.

I mean, usual caveats apply, (it's a big galaxy, there are likely to be extreme practices of all kinds in individual worlds etc etc) but it seems a little…off note for the Imperium to routinely do that kind of thing.

When I wrote up my afreil strain article, I invented "womb servitors," female servitors used as brood mothers for infant afrielis. That seemed a logical extension of the sort of uses servitors were put to in the Imperium already…but I can't see this sort of thing finding itself into official 40k canon because it's a bit too extreme. 

What's interesting to me about 40k and cloning is that the Imperium never QUITE uses straightforward cloning techniques, but they skirt around the edges:-

-The Afrielis (according to my interpretation) are sort of clones, but not of an original human being. They are clones of a genetic template, itself formed from aspects of the genetic material of many different people. As such, they are Chimerae rather than true clones.

-The Kriegans are normal humans, formed from the gametes of normal humans, but rather than gestating in a human womb, they are grown in a vitae womb.

-The technique used to create Astartes resemble cloning, but are in fact far more complex and advanced. Indeed, they seem to allow a degree of cloning of certain characteristics and traits (rather than individuals) while also allowing for geneseed itself to evolve and change over time.  



#16 ItsUncertainWho

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 09:55 AM

 I'm more surprised that 40K hasn't mentioned something like an Axlotl tank, from Dune.

They swiped everything else, why not this?



#17 Face Eater

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 12:27 PM

ItsUncertainWho said:

 I'm more surprised that 40K hasn't mentioned something like an Axlotl tank, from Dune.

They swiped everything else, why not this?

Dark Eldar's got em.

They've stole everything from everywhere, just not given it all the Imperium.



#18 lostguardguy

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Posted 14 October 2012 - 12:15 PM

Did everyone forget the make your own regiment jest say ya'll are clones or have them all wearing masks or encased helmet. Some NPC takes a round to the chest now he is dieing. Asks the medic/Sgt/fellow guardsman "Help. . .[cough, cough] help me with my helmet. I want to see the sky one more time before I die." Like a good comrade he helps him and is froze in shock when he realizes that hes seen this man. This man that hes never served with before every day in the mirror. A glorious mind f@ck and a good way to start a campaign. Now he knows the dark secret. Every memory, every birth day, his parents tragic death that lead him to the guard, his wife and kids, all one big lie. Will he and his squad be able to keep this to them selves or will the officers or the commissarnant find out they know? How far will they go for the the Imperium that lied to them? Find out next time on The Good the Bad and the Cloned .


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