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Unit leader and Command Section


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#1 felkor

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 02:17 AM

So if the unit leader in my command section was killed in the previous round, it looks like from the rules I can't use that unit as a command section anymore.  I need to select a different unit leader to command (assuming this is my only platoon and so I don't have another command section.) 

Then after the next unit phase, I'll have promoted a different figure to lead my command squad, and thus I'm back to using that unit as command section, and I get my 12" command radius back, etc., right?

Is this making sense?



#2 Azrell

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 03:36 AM

 pg 31, if you dont have a unit leader in a command section you must spend an order to promote one in the command phase. 6' range now.



#3 mariettabrit

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 03:55 AM

Azrell said:

 pg 31, if you dont have a unit leader in a command section you must spend an order to promote one in the command phase. 6' range now.

Axis unit leaders get auto-promoted tho right ?



#4 felkor

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 05:17 AM

Azrell said:

 pg 31, if you dont have a unit leader in a command section you must spend an order to promote one in the command phase. 6' range now.

 

Thanks - I'll look that up tonight when I have my book.



#5 Shadow4ce

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 06:01 AM

mariettabrit said:

Azrell said:

 

 pg 31, if you dont have a unit leader in a command section you must spend an order to promote one in the command phase. 6' range now.

 

 

Axis unit leaders get auto-promoted tho right ?

Yes, but not until the start of your next Command Phase. 



#6 Azrell

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 06:44 AM

mariettabrit said:

Azrell said:

 

 pg 31, if you dont have a unit leader in a command section you must spend an order to promote one in the command phase. 6' range now.

 

 

Axis unit leaders get auto-promoted tho right ?

 

They auto promote unit leaders not platoon leaders. 



#7 mariettabrit

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 06:47 AM

Azrell said:

mariettabrit said:

 

Azrell said:

 

 pg 31, if you dont have a unit leader in a command section you must spend an order to promote one in the command phase. 6' range now.

 

 

Axis unit leaders get auto-promoted tho right ?

 

 

 

They auto promote unit leaders not platoon leaders. 

Platoon leader is a unit leader… Axis don't get to auto-promote their command section though if it's wiped out. But if you platoon leader (command section unit leader) is killed, then you should get the auto-promote at start of activation.



#8 felkor

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 06:56 AM

If your command section unit leader dies, it woul only be one turn that you have the 6" command restriction though, right?
The next turn, you are now starting with a command section with a unit leader, so now it's 12", as it's no longer a temporary assignment.
Is that correct?



#9 Shadow4ce

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 06:58 AM

 It's at the start of the Command Phase, not activation. 



#10 Azrell

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 07:01 AM

felkor said:

If your command section unit leader dies, it woul only be one turn that you have the 6" command restriction though, right?
The next turn, you are now starting with a command section with a unit leader, so now it's 12", as it's no longer a temporary assignment.
Is that correct?

 

nope, only the original unit leader of the command section gets 12' the new temp commander only gets 6'.



#11 felkor

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 07:08 AM

Interesting.  I don't remember seeing that anywhere.  I'll have to reread those rules.



#12 Azrell

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 07:20 AM

felkor said:

Interesting.  I don't remember seeing that anywhere.  I'll have to reread those rules.

 

PG 31, "if a player has lost the unit leaders of each of his command sections…"

they glossed over it but each unit leaders are described on pg 23. and they are a different miniature than other squad members. 

 

although looking at it close we might both be right as you only need to promote a temp command if all unit leaders in command squads are dead… i have to run but ill look a little closer when i get back.



#13 Shadow4ce

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 07:37 AM

Azrell said:

felkor said:

 

Interesting.  I don't remember seeing that anywhere.  I'll have to reread those rules.

 

 

 

PG 31, "if a player has lost the unit leaders of each of his command sections…"

they glossed over it but each unit leaders are described on pg 23. and they are a different miniature than other squad members. 

 

although looking at it close we might both be right as you only need to promote a temp command if all unit leaders in command squads are dead… i have to run but ill look a little closer when i get back.

Yah, I spent the last hour looking it over, and while I lean towards if the leaders are gone, 6" replacement, part of the rule; the example, reads as if all members of the unit are gone, pick a new unit & promote its leader. But it also states, keep those officers alive, so I'll be ruling it 6" until an FAQ addresses it. But I think due to the ambiguity of the rule vs the example, this one could really use a FAQ. 



#14 felkor

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 08:00 AM

Yeah, if it says "Lost your unit leaders" and not "Lost your original unit leaders" then it seems like something different than me.  A unit can have a unit leader without it being the original one.  I'll definitely have to read the the rules carefully on this one, and hopefully if it's not clear they put this on the FAQ.



#15 Shadow4ce

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 08:16 AM

 It reads, "If a player has lost the Unit Leaders of each of his Command Sections, he still rolls his Command Pool as normal during the Initiative phase. The player must spend one Order to promote a temporary Command Section…"

The more I read the whole rule, the more I think if you lose your last command section leader, your 12" command is gone. 



#16 felkor

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Posted 24 May 2012 - 08:31 AM

I read this rule totally differently.

As far as I can tell:

Your command section can only function if it has a unit leader.

If you have at least one command section with a unit leader, then you're good to go, but can only use those sections with a unit leader to give orders, etc.

If you have no command sections with a unit leader, then you will have to find a different section that has a unit leader to be your command section, and pay an order (unless the unit leader is a hero) to make that section the command section for that turn, and you only have 6" order radius.

BUT, since you promot miniatures to unit leaders in the unit phase, if during that time your command section gains a unit leader, in the next command phase, everything is back to status quo, and you're good to go with your 12" radius and using your command section to give orders, since you have a command section with a unit leader.

This to me makes the most sense with the rules as written.  This idea of "original unit leader" vs "current unit leader" just isn't anywhere in the rules as far as I can tell, and the example people are quoting from the rules only happens if "each" (i.e. every) command section unit leader is lost, so saying that if one of your multiple command sections loses its original leader, it's down to 6" radius forever, doesn't make sense, as the rules being quoted here wouldn't even be triggered in that situation.



#17 Ariano

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 09:21 PM

felkor said:

BUT, since you promot miniatures to unit leaders in the unit phase, if during that time your command section gains a unit leader, in the next command phase, everything is back to status quo, and you're good to go with your 12" radius and using your command section to give orders, since you have a command section with a unit leader.

You can also promote a unit leader in the Command phase with the regroup order.

How would it work according to your line of argumentation then ? 12" or 6" ?

I must say I did not think about this topic until I saw the discussion here, but now I see the potential problem although not a clear solution, I am afraid…



#18 Warboss Krag

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 10:16 PM

Yeah, this question really really needs a clarification ASAP. I wouldn't have thought it necessary, but today I lost a command squad, and the question came up (not completely; I had a different command squad as well. 400-point game).



#19 felkor

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Posted 04 June 2012 - 12:02 AM

Ariano said:

felkor said:

 

BUT, since you promot miniatures to unit leaders in the unit phase, if during that time your command section gains a unit leader, in the next command phase, everything is back to status quo, and you're good to go with your 12" radius and using your command section to give orders, since you have a command section with a unit leader.

 

 

You can also promote a unit leader in the Command phase with the regroup order.

How would it work according to your line of argumentation then ? 12" or 6" ?

I must say I did not think about this topic until I saw the discussion here, but now I see the potential problem although not a clear solution, I am afraid…

 

Since you decide the Temporary Command Section at the beginning of your turn, even if you used your temporary command section to regroup and promote the unit leader of your original command section, you wouldn't get that command section until the next turn, and at that point your range would go back up to 12"

 

To me, this is the most consistent way to read the rules.  That said, who knows what FFG actually intended, as it's certainly not clear enough.  Hopefully the next version of the FAQ will address this.



#20 Xie

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Posted 04 June 2012 - 05:23 AM

Uh, where does it say that Axis auto-promote unit leaders?






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