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A potential way to incorporate capital ships


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#1 Budgernaut

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Posted 27 April 2012 - 05:04 AM

I asked this in a different thread, but I guess it didn't really match the topic, so it seemed to get skipped over. Hence, I'm asking it in my own new thread.

I've been thinking about ways to make the game interesting by adding terrain features: asteroids, space mines, etc. Then I got an idea to use capital ships as terrain. 

How do you feel about setting up a capital ship on either side, one representing a Star Destroyer and the other a Mon Calamari Star Cruiser? The capital ships would have turrets on them that the player can place where they want on that small section of the ship. This is important, the battle only takes place in a small space between the two capital ships, but the whole capital ship is not represented on the playing field. Turrets may fire at the lowest initiative level and have a restricted range.

So then the goal might be knocking out all of your opponent's turrets before they knock out yours, while avoiding enemy starfighters and the turret laser fire as well. The biggest problem here is that it is more like a mission, not something you could implement in normal skirmishes. Anyway, just some thoughts I had.


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#2 IG-58

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Posted 27 April 2012 - 07:00 AM

The other thing to consider is, that while the minis aren't the awful "relative scale" of the Wizards of the Coast game, the SPACE involved is still relative. The ships are moving at appalling velocities and aren't really executing a turn inside 100 feet.

SO, you don't want your capital ships taking up an unrealistic amount of SPACE. Don't try to make each ship just a section you're fighting/fighting from. The cruiser is esentially armed terrain. I'd say make each one about 18" long, and represent the whole ship (longitudinally, anyway). The quantities of turrets are kinda relative, too. Just my thoughts.

I actually think this is a more practical/feasable/fun idea than the trench run notion. That scene relied on cinematics & Hollywood heroism and I think will be really thrown off-kilter by a rules set. This one would work.



#3 Parakitor

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Posted 27 April 2012 - 07:47 AM

I agree with IG-58. Good idea Budgernaut. I honestly won't be surprised if there is something like this already in the core starter set scenarios.


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#4 Baphomet69

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 07:21 AM

 Anyone know off-hand the dimensions of the old star destroyer model kits? I had this same idea, more or less, with a star destroyer sideways at one end and rebel at the other, though I've never seen a largish Mon Calamri or other rebel capital ship model…



#5 IG-58

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 07:36 AM

Ooh, it's about 13" long. I don't have mine out (primarily because it's such a horrendous model).



#6 Art Vandelay

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Posted 30 April 2012 - 09:20 AM

I can definitely see them releasing a Correlian Corvette but i'm not sure if there is an imperail ship that is comparable in scale.



#7 Baphomet69

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Posted 30 April 2012 - 10:21 AM

 Well, I've discovered the lighted SD model is about 15.5" long, and I found a guy that sells a 15" Mon Calamari kit, but it's $160… :(

<sigh>



#8 VaultDweller

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Posted 30 April 2012 - 04:06 PM

 Capital ships would need to be added to keep the game going wouldn't they?  Assuming the game stays in the classic trilogy timeline there are only so many ships available.  Adding cap ships rules seems logical at some point.  I'd like to see 10" models ( for star destroyers) for 49.95. 



#9 bsmith13

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Posted 30 April 2012 - 05:38 PM

It seems to me that you could add rules for capital ships without adding capital ship models.  There are very few that would be in scale with the fighters, and yet also affordable.



#10 ironman

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Posted 30 April 2012 - 09:56 PM

bsmith13 said:

It seems to me that you could add rules for capital ships without adding capital ship models.  There are very few that would be in scale with the fighters, and yet also affordable.

thats what i was thinking.

in fact a flat print out picture of the ship to be laid flat on the table, about the size to make it look like it was about 1k away from the fighters, and maybe bombers have to be over the top of it to launch their warheads. Im sure someone good at graphic design could do this.



#11 bsmith13

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 04:42 AM

ironman said:

bsmith13 said:

 

It seems to me that you could add rules for capital ships without adding capital ship models.  There are very few that would be in scale with the fighters, and yet also affordable.

 

 

thats what i was thinking.

in fact a flat print out picture of the ship to be laid flat on the table, about the size to make it look like it was about 1k away from the fighters, and maybe bombers have to be over the top of it to launch their warheads. Im sure someone good at graphic design could do this.

 

That's what I was thinking.  If FFG would like to go the cap ship route eventually, I would prefer that they release the ships in scale, maybe with counters or very small minis representing starfighter squadrons.



#12 Parakitor

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 08:14 AM

I just want to throw in my two cents. Capital ships as a mat with special scenario rules sounds like an interesting way to spice up dogfights, but I do not think capital ships should enter this game as pieces. I really like the idea of having ships to scale (though it looks like they already royally messed up the X-wing). Many people were upset about the non-scale nature of the Wizards of the Coast game that I think FFG should keep it to scale, and keep it centered around the dogfights.

It finally dawned on me that a big problem with Staship Battles was that the fighters were essentially a type of capital ship weapon. There was no heroism or daring or even strategy for the fighters, just luck. Here, we have the opportunity to control our fighters at a finer scale.

If FFG chooses to introduce capital ships I hope they release an entirely new fleet engagement game. Even without capital ships, I think there is a wealth of material they could draw from for new ships for the X-wing Miniatures Game (see the thread "How many ships could there be?") Some of them will probably be from different eras, but there are PLENTY of starfighters to choose from, as well as pilots and weapons/modifications for that matter.


"That starship won't fly, Bastila."


#13 Baphomet69

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 09:10 AM

 I would like to see two separate games as well. A fighter dogfight one (X-Wing, obviously) and a separate one for fleet scale. Hell, hire John Tuffley on as advisor for the fleet game and have him modify Full Thrust rules… ;)



#14 IG-58

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 09:16 AM

Thanks, Parakitor. I was just staying out of the whole 'capital ship discussion,' but I think you're right on target. Remember guys, though the game is called "X-Wing" and the logical place to start is with the iconic X-Wing & TIE fighter that every fan (especially those old enough to have some expendable cash flow) holds near & dear to their hearts, there ARE other eras & ships out there. Right now the whole focus of Lucasfilm is the Clone Wars business, and thet era has ALL KINDS of stuff to draw from. Assuming the game is a success, I imagine there will be loot to empty our wallets for quite some time.

if you really want capital ships, I still think the most practical notion (and in keeping with the flavor of the game) remains basically just a flat piece of paper or cardboard with several 3-D turret or antenna greeblies you can set on it, and then remove when destroyed. A Corellian Corvette or gunship you probably actually COULD do in true scale, but anything bigger would have to be "relative."



#15 Baphomet69

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 09:22 AM

 Not to sound like a snob, but I'll not be participating in other eras. The prequals are dead to me… ;p



#16 Parakitor

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 09:39 AM

Baphomet69 said:

 Not to sound like a snob, but I'll not be participating in other eras. The prequals are dead to me… ;p

Yes, I thought as much. No, I don't accuse you of being a snob at all. In fact, I don't collect LEGO Clone Wars sets because it's too cartoony. Still, it will be interesting to see how FFG responds to a community with such a difference of opinions as we've seen in our discussion of eras and scale.


"That starship won't fly, Bastila."


#17 Budgernaut

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Posted 02 May 2012 - 08:36 AM

 Yeah, I like the prequels and the Clone Wars, but I don't think I'd buy the corresponding ships for this game. They just don't catch my imagination and fuel my excitement like the OT ships. Now if they through in a couple Old Republic ships (Aurek fighters, Chela Fighters, Sith Interceptors, Stingers, Starsabers, Chaos fighters), I think I'd be down with that. Obviously, that doesn't have as much appeal.

If I were them, I'd probably just wrap up the Rebellion era starfighters and then move on to a fleet game. I don't think they'll get a huge response with the Old Republic or Clone Wars era fighters.


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#18 VaultDweller

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 03:45 PM

 Agree. There's no place for prequel ships in this game. There's nothing inspired about any of the designs.  

 

 

 



#19 IG-58

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 08:04 PM

It'll be a short game, then.



#20 Parakitor

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 04:37 AM

IG-58 said:

It'll be a short game, then.

Amen. I think when I have squads of X-wings and TIEs and all manner of Rebel vs. Imperial craft, I'll want to expand my collection. Prequel ships can be fun and add a lot of variety. Especially if they stay away from capital ships.

Do I think it's a little odd that it will still be called X-wing? No, not really. There are Y-wings after all.


"That starship won't fly, Bastila."





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