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Earning Points -- What actually counts and why?


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#1 JerusalemJones

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Posted 06 February 2009 - 07:33 AM

In many ways, I look at the points and the ways to earn them and I wonder if they really match up with who should be earning what, and when. It seems that there are some people in our community who contribute ALOT to the forums (or perhaps just their little corner), but who end up not having alot of points. For example, in the Game of Thrones LCG section "ktom" posts multiple times daily, most often answering rules questions, yet he hasn't broken 100 points. The GoT LCG community would be at a severe loss without his presence, but his points don't refelct what he does for the community.

Similarily, when I was close to approaching 200 points, the first thing I did was start looking for sections of the website I had not posted in so that I could start a related thread just to up my points over 200. While I may have contributed slightly to the discussion, I would not have posted there except for the fact that I wanted to get higher points. Since then I have gone over 200 points, and the issue is sorta moot, but I often don't know when a post I create will get me points or not. I guess that is the real reason -- we shouldn't actively be seeking out ways to earn points, but that is what is happening.

I know that this is part of why FFG created a point-based system, and anytime points are given a value (in this case for the monthly prize drawings) people will try to find ways to increase their points. But is the system actually working for the betterment of the community or just encouraging us to find ways to earn more points?



#2 AulayanD

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Posted 06 February 2009 - 10:15 PM

It's just causing people to seek points, on the average.

Some people are naturally forum posters, eager to help (or show their knowledge).  But given human nature, and how much things tie into greed, throwing things like points allows for people to post more.

Granted, inso doing, this becomes a more vibrant community.  And I have seen very few "Me too...extra text" responses so that is a huge plus. 

I figure, while some people, maybe even many people, are seeking to only increase their point totals, they're not doing so in asinine ways and so they're actually trying to give something to the community.

Anyway.  In forums that have no reward system, you'll often see 5 people answer the same question, the same way, in the same thread anyway.  So it's not like this is any different....



#3 ColtsFan76

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Posted 08 February 2009 - 12:41 AM

The points do seem skewed to favor people branching out into other games instead of focusing on one or two products.

And while this has prompted a deluge of substandard questions/answer/"me too" posts, it probably had the effect of generating some new business for FFG.  And that is why they would spend money to offer a community - to make more money!  On the old site, I went to Arkham's forum and then BattleLore's when they took that over and never had to scroll down to see anything else going on.  No motivation to get involved in a game I did not know.

But I got excited and purchased Android in part because of the new website launch and forums.  I just picked up BSG yesterday in part because of the forums.  I am looking to pick up Condottiere because I found it on this website.  So the encouragement of exploring the rest of the site led indirectly to at least 2 game purchases and most likely a 3rd.  Shoot, forgot about Red Novemeber; that was mostly a result of this site as well.  So FFG got me good by offering points that really aren't worth much more than bragging rights and they sold some games.

I am near the top of the list in pooints.  But most of my contributions are legit.  I am involved in quite a few threads as I own the games and play them.  There are a few that I am full committed to and read and post in daily - like BattleLore and Arkham Horror.  Me being in the top 10 posters reflects that, though most of my points didn't come from posting (maybe a third).  I'll admit I gamed the system a bit with the friends network.  But I did it mostly because a lot of others were doing it.  My rational is to limit it to people I actually communicate with here and over on BGG (which accounts for about half of them) and the other half are regular posters on the AH and BL forums.  So there is a method behind the madness and not just random collection of inviting all of the users to be my friend and hope to get great numbers that way.

The balance of my points has come directly from FFG as bonus points.  They rewarded me with about a third of what I have for helping them in the AH and BL arenas.  They rewarded Thelric, I am sure, with his work on AH.  So there are legitimate opportunities to get rewarded for going above and beyond. Not a guaranteed way, but one is out there if you work hard enough.

I think the point system is decent and it is the perogative of FFG to run it how they want.  My only suggestions would be too employ some anti-flood mechanism in that you can't post "is this game good?" in every forum.  But it seems most of those cases were dealt with in the beginning.  I would also like to see some reward system go up for people that are active in forums.  Maybe 1 point for every 5 or 10 posts in the same forum.  That way, people are rewarded for loyalty and commitment to a specifc game as well.  But if you throw that up, you may see people gaming the system again.



#4 The Sundance Kid

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Posted 18 February 2009 - 11:04 AM

Don't care about points.

 

I mostly just go to the Tannhauser forums and the wings of war forum. if I happen to see a question on latest post or something I can help with I'll do it. And once in a while I come in this forum, this is only my 4th time or so going into this forum.



#5 Jayrome007

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 11:20 AM

Is there any specific post made by FFG to help clarify the issues of the points system? I can't seem to find one anywhere. Personally, I'm new to these forums and didn't even notice the point system until someone point it out to me. Is there some kind of tangible benefit for collecting massive amount of points? Should points be awarded based purely on number of posts and then rewards be handed out based purely on the number of points, it won't be long before the greedy public picks up on this and takes advantage of it. And then say hello to Spam City! Right now I think the only thing keeping these forums relatively clean is the natural slow spread of information about the point system. Maybe this is purposeful.

I've posted this question in a couple other forums already seeking a response, but still no reply so I thought I'd try here as well.

 


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#6 Jayrome007

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Posted 05 March 2009 - 12:03 PM

This is interesting.

I was just looking at the Stats page and discovered that out of the top 10 users with most messages posted, only 2 (Jadrax, ColtsFan76) are listed in the top 10 in points earned. Conversely, out of the top 10 users with the most friends, 6 are listed in the top 10 in points earned. With the analysis of these findings, I think it's pretty easy to hypothesize that this dubious point system is intended on creating a spurious social network more akin to the competitve "friend fishing" of Myspace or Facebook than to the helpful discussion boards of BoardGameGeek. Granted, this is a pretty small sample size to draw from. So far, this is just a theory. More time and further research needs to be done to reach any forgone conclusion (or they could just tell us!). But keep an eye on this trend.

Apologies about the negativism. Though I'm always a skeptic at heart, I actually do think the point system is a great idea. I'm just not to keen on its potential consequences.


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#7 Omnicrazzy

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Posted 07 March 2009 - 11:50 AM

I think I agree with coltsfan that they are sparking interest by forcing people who want a few more points to post in other forums. I recently began to drool over the prospect of the Doom game.

So anyways... your question, what earns points?

1 point per friend (as far as I can tell, having 1 friend so far :P but am accepting more.)

5 points for posting in a forum or sub forum

5 points for making an account

5 points for editing your profile (I think)

So even assuming there are 100 different forums and sub forums, I dont see how anyone got over 500 points (except for frouvne's 700+ friends) and certainly am amazed by thelric's 2500 points.

My personal goal is to get 400 pts so I can take JerusalemJones' place on the bottom of the 'top 10' list. No hard feelings. :)



#8 ColtsFan76

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Posted 07 March 2009 - 12:09 PM

Jayrome007 said:

Is there any specific post made by FFG to help clarify the issues of the points system?

Scroll down to about the bottom 1/3 of the page on this link:

new.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_comunidad_ventajas.asp

It is not the most obvious.  I found it when I registered but try8ing to find it again always takes me some time.  And this is like the 10th time I looked for it.



#9 ColtsFan76

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Posted 07 March 2009 - 12:15 PM

Omnicrazzy said:

 

I think I agree with coltsfan that they are sparking interest by forcing people who want a few more points to post in other forums. I recently began to drool over the prospect of the Doom game.

So anyways... your question, what earns points?

1 point per friend (as far as I can tell, having 1 friend so far :P but am accepting more.)

5 points for posting in a forum or sub forum

5 points for making an account

5 points for editing your profile (I think)

So even assuming there are 100 different forums and sub forums, I dont see how anyone got over 500 points (except for frouvne's 700+ friends) and certainly am amazed by thelric's 2500 points.

My personal goal is to get 400 pts so I can take JerusalemJones' place on the bottom of the 'top 10' list. No hard feelings. :)

 

 

I posted this elsewhere so don't remember them all off the top of my head.

Registering = 10 points

Friends = 1 point each

First Thread in each forum = 5 points (this is where lots of people were racking up points in the beginning)

First post in each thread = 5 points (and so if your first post is also your first thread, you get 10 points combined.)

In the beginning there appeared to be points awarded for editing your profile but I think that was removed.  There also seems to be a connection for adding games to your collection but I haven't been able to decipher it.

Gift from FFG = X points - they have rewarded a few for their contributions.



#10 Sartredes

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Posted 08 March 2009 - 08:47 AM

I haven't noticed that that your first post in a given thread gives 5 points.



#11 ColtsFan76

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Posted 08 March 2009 - 04:07 PM

Sartredes said:

I haven't noticed that that your first post in a given thread gives 5 points.

Sorry, meant first post in a forum.  If you post in a new forum and start a thread in a new forum, you get 5 points each.



#12 flervk

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Posted 08 March 2009 - 10:45 PM

ColtsFan76 said:

 

  There also seems to be a connection for adding games to your collection but I haven't been able to decipher it.

 

 

hmm, I don't think so. At first, I've added bunch of games that I've played but don't have, and didn't get any points; then, I figured, collection's only for the games that are owned so I've removed those that I don't have, and still no change of point status. not that that's the most important thing ever, but still :)

plus, It seems  you get point for every post, but it's cumulative - only after 5, you get 5.

 



#13 ColtsFan76

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 09:21 AM

I am basing my "games owned" points off of when my points were going up when I first registered. As I added games, points were going up but I couldn't figure out the pattern. It may be that the first game in each category gives 1 point. It may just be that modifying your profile gave points (which I think has since been discontinued). So points for games is purely speculative.

As far as points and posts, I am 100% certain what you get. I have made a lot of posts and I know exactly when my points go up and for what reasson when it comes to the forums.

  • You get 5 points the first time you post in a thread on a forum that you have never posted in before.
  • You get 5 points the first time you create a thread in a forum you have never posted in before.
  • If you happen to create a thread and post for the first time simultaneously, then you get the 10 points at once.

You do not get any more points for multiple posts. If all you ever do is post in the "Support" forum, even if it 1,000 posts, all you will get is 10 points. If you ask how long a game plays in every single game forum (which many were abusing), you will get 10 points per game forum (unless FFG steps in and removes your points - which I believe they have done for many).



#14 flervk

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Posted 09 March 2009 - 10:31 AM

ColtsFan76 said:

You do not get any more points for multiple posts. If all you ever do is post in the "Support" forum, even if it 1,000 posts, all you will get is 10 points. If you ask how long a game plays in every single game forum (which many were abusing), you will get 10 points per game forum (unless FFG steps in and removes your points - which I believe they have done for many).

 

OK then. it seemed to me that I got points for several posts in the same forum.

nevermind, it's not important; I'm here to find out some new stuff, points are just a bonus and I don't even think I'll win anything.



#15 kmedlinnc

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Posted 13 March 2009 - 01:08 AM

The point behind my registration was to get all the goodies for the games I own actually.  I made a bunch of friend invites so I could keep tabs on folks who are the "big psoters" in the games I also own.

In the end, the post count "gaming" is just going to happen.  I think though that it drives business and at a minimum eyes to the FFG site which can't hurt!  The thing that I don't really like is the crossposting between BGG and here.  I've seen a TON of people just posting what they post over on BGG verbatim in these forums.  I wonder if they'd be a way to set up a sub forum for each game that's just an RSS feed of that game's BGG forum?



#16 ColtsFan76

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Posted 13 March 2009 - 11:41 AM

Ask and you shall receive:

new.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_foros_discusion.asp

March winners along with prizes and other tidbits on the raffles.



#17 JerusalemJones

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Posted 13 March 2009 - 01:33 PM

Omnicrazzy said:

My personal goal is to get 400 pts so I can take JerusalemJones' place on the bottom of the 'top 10' list. No hard feelings. :)

Well, I'm higher than that now (insert manical laughter here: mwahahaha). There is no hard feelings, but I tell you I was migty stoked when I made it into the top 10 for points. If I posted like I used to in the Game of Thrones section, I might even get into the top posters -- I hit 500 posts pretty quickly in the last set of board, IIRC. I even remember when I first passed 1000 posts (I wanted to see what my "title" changed to). That was pretty cool.

After awhile you do sort of plateu out on points, and I refuse to "thread spam" just to get points, but I do have an edge. I am a co-onwer of a game store, so that sometimes puts me into games where I announce we're doing a demo or a league or something similar. And I like to invite people into my friends group, just because I enjoy the community, and now with the PM system working I can pass on information to people. I just wish there was some way to know by looking at another person's avatar if you had friended them -- I found out yesterday that someone I thought I had friended I actually had missed, which made it hard to send them a PM. Fortuntely, the two of us rectified that problem.



#18 Antigoth

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Posted 13 March 2009 - 07:00 PM

ColtsFan76 said:

I posted this elsewhere so don't remember them all off the top of my head.

Registering = 10 points

Friends = 1 point each

First Thread in each forum = 5 points (this is where lots of people were racking up points in the beginning)

First post in each thread = 5 points (and so if your first post is also your first thread, you get 10 points combined.)

In the beginning there appeared to be points awarded for editing your profile but I think that was removed.  There also seems to be a connection for adding games to your collection but I haven't been able to decipher it.

Gift from FFG = X points - they have rewarded a few for their contributions.

The edit profile points are gone, and you no longer earn extra points for adding additional FFG games. (Recently just started toying with the COC:LCG myself... I love those figs that come with it!)

I can confirm that there are random points awarded. I came on earlier today to randomly find me bumped up 100 points for no discernable reason.

(But thanks to which ever powers that be hooked me up!)

 

 



#19 Jayrome007

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Posted 27 March 2009 - 08:52 AM

Is anybody else here not ok with this concept? No need to start a revolution or spam the moderators with angry messages, but I am just curious if there is anyone else who isn't sold on the direction this could be headed. It's not a horrible idea. In fact, from FFG's point of view it's actually quite genious. But from a user's perspective, I just don't know if I like the possibilities of this exploding into a who-has-more-friends-and-games competition.


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#20 sigmazero13

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Posted 27 March 2009 - 10:40 AM

Well, I've decided for myself to give up on caring about this new forum altogether.  The point system is lame, for the reasons you point out.  But it's far less lame than the lack of useful functionality the rest of the forum software has.

I come here occasionally to look at the TI3 forum (and to see if there's any glimmer of hope in the Support forum for the web guys to actually FIX the problems with this software, rather than ignoring it or producing lame half-solutions like the so-called "Private Message" feature).  Beyond that, I've stopped caring about the forums, because it seems to me that the forum software developers don't care about what the users want, in terms of "good" forums.

Which is fine, because there are far better forums out there for discussing the game I most care about (Twilight Imperium) than this one.






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