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Imrahil, Boromir, Dúnhere


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#1 lleimmoen

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Posted 27 February 2012 - 03:48 AM

I have introduced this deck on the geek site. Here I would like to give my thoughts for including each card in it and ask about opinions of others, what would they do differently perhaps, which cards they would not choose to go with and/or which others might fit instead.

This deck is meant for coop. It fits well with a questing deck (using Rohan allies like Escort, Scout, or Finnest that leave play easily).

Heroes:

Imrahil

An easy choice for the Leadership representative here. Fits well thematicaly as well. His ability is supported by all allies in the deck.

Boromir

Again, an easy thematic choice for the Tactics hero. May seem counter-productive with Dúnhere but the two tend to take care of enemies on both sides of the barricades.

Dúnhere

Support the "Red Arrow" union.

Deck:

Vassal of the Windlord

Easy combo with Support of the Eagles, Valiant Sacrifice, Horn of Gondor, Imrahil.

Winged Guardian

As the above, just this time it can help defending.

Gondorian Spearman

The extra hit. It is not easy to always make it work so he finished a wounded enemy but here (for the combo reasons above) it is sometimes beneficial when he leaves in process.

Descendant of Thorondor

A bit expensive. Good alternative for Sneak Attack when Gandalf is not around. More and more enemies tend to have no more than 2 hp, and if they have 3, the Spearman can finish the job.

Gandalf

Obvious.

Song of Battle

For Dúnhere, so he can play the Support.

Dúnedain Mark

For Dúnhere or Boromir. Or others like Legolas if he is around in the company of other players.

Horn of Gondor

There were games when (especially with three players, and it would be moreso with more) Horn made more money than Steward of Gondor. I still think Steward is universally more powerful but since the card is present with the other player, it is better to have Horn here as it fits all the leaving allies.

Support of the Eagles

Not easy to have this one out and going. Boromir can make a huge use of it right away, Dúnhere needs the Song first. When he does have it though, it can become a great fun to fell the Nazgul, trolls or gigantic spiders without engaging them.

Feint

Obvious.

Quick Strike

Obvious for Dúnhere to make questing easier. Good for Boromir too, so he can attack an enemy for the second time.

Sneak Attack

As written above, no need to always wait for Gandalf, the Descendant can use this very well, either for questing to help Imrahil ready right away or to fight (can make Support more agressive when Vassal is not in play).

Valiant Sacrifice

All allies leave easily.

For Gondor!

Imrahil, Boromir, Spearman benefit some extra, Faramir or whoever has the Steward in the other deck as well.

A Light in the Dark

Can work as Feint, one can wait after the shadow card is revealed, and combos perfectly with Dúnhere.

The Galadhrim's Greeting

Not easy to play right away. Horn helps with this, and it is such better to always be attached to Dúnhere (together with the Song, if able). Helps both the Boromir and Dúnhere aspect of the deck.

Stand and Fight.

Not only you can "re-use" the allies, sometimes (with the Horn logic above) you can end up with more Spirit resources than Tactics ones.

 

There are some cards I have considered but did not find place for them. Westfold Horse-breaker is good to ready Dúnhere for another go against the staging area, and he readies Imrahil as well. Eagles of the Misty Mountains is a great ally, I feel, it just seems too expensive to fit here, I like cheap decks. Swift Strike could combo well with the Spearman or in general but I dislike the art. Stand Together is a similar thing, good card to have, did not fit.

Thoughts appreciated.



#2 booored

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Posted 27 February 2012 - 06:29 AM

I'm really not a fan of Descendant. The ability to drop 2 dmg on the staging area seams a little weak, especially when you have dunhere around and borimir who is raising your threat. We were talking about Borimir in another thread and I think that he is not a particularly good hero choice in general.

My main problem with your deck is that it seams to be a bit all over the place... a bit of ally discard for prince, threat gain for borimir and threat reduction for dunhere. I believe you might want to look at splitting your decks. Focus on a single "core" effect. Maybe move Borimir to your partners deck allowing yours to focus on rohan discard allies and questing, dunhere to attack the staging and leave the threat gain and monster bashing to your partners.... alternatively, move dunhere and get your partner to run the discard ally cards for readying prince and then you have prince and borimir on the one side for multiple attacks per turn. This means you could go deeper into tactics with a 2nd tactics hero. Allowing you to explore the "attack deck" angle deeper, like more eagles.

Still I seams like a fairly solid deck, I just think it ids trying t be a lot of things at once, kind of like a solo deck, when your partners deck could be covering some of its angles leaving your deck to be more focused and powerful in a single area.


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#3 lleimmoen

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Posted 27 February 2012 - 07:54 AM

Thanks for the thoughts.

I have seen the Boromir's thread(s), I believe you are in the minority there as the majority thinks he's great. That is not a point to discuss but I would advise you to try him out a bit more, you might enjoy it a great deal as others do. And then you might not... but trying is learning. For my money, right now he's far and wide the best Tactics hero even though Legolas may get much stronger with more Silvan updates (but Boromir gets stronger with pretty much every general attachment).

Well, I care a big deal about theme, so another Tactics hero is out of the question here as they are Dwarves or an Elf, I have tried Brand, he was good but sucked compared to Dúnhere. It also sucked that I had no Spirit resources and all three Spirit cards work wonders in the deck.

I do not want to argue for the sake of arguing, as I said I appreciate your comment, but I feel like I shall defend the deck, it is by no means all over the place, it is very focused, and few minutes ago it helped us to beat Massing at Osgiliath with three players, which I think is no small feat. Again, I would advise you to try it out so you know what I am talking about, that is my main point now. Or we can compare some quest results, and thus learn that perhaps our ideas are relative towards a certain strategy or scenario.

From what you said, I will consider the Descendant. I really wish he were of cost 3 instead of 4. He does seem a bit expensive at times.



#4 booored

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Posted 27 February 2012 - 09:28 AM

lleimmoen said:

I have seen the Boromir's thread(s), I believe you are in the minority there as the majority thinks he's great. That is not a point to discuss but I would advise you to try him out a bit more, you might enjoy it a great deal as others do. And then you might not... but trying is learning. For my money, right now he's far and wide the best Tactics hero even though Legolas may get much stronger with more Silvan updates (but Boromir gets stronger with pretty much every general attachment).

Oh I have experimented with him a lot, and he dose have a place in a few decks. I think he is one of the only real choices for a single hero deck for example. As I said in the other thread I just do not like the way he sacrifices end score for his effect. I find it is much better and more satisfying to build answered into the deck rather than relying on a single ability so much of the time, an ability that directly worsens your score every time you use him.

lleimmoen said:

Well, I care a big deal about theme, so another Tactics hero is out of the question here as they are Dwarves or an Elf, I have tried Brand, he was good but sucked compared to Dúnhere. It also sucked that I had no Spirit resources and all three Spirit cards work wonders in the deck.[/quote]

Yeah, theme means little to me. I prefer to make strong decks. LoTR is such a lame setting anyway that the theme has never grabbed me. I really like the game and the mechanics but I find it hard to get excited about such a boring setting. Still many people like to make theme decks, and not just in this game in many card games. The defining thing in a theme deck is that you sacrifice card text to force the theme. Like in CoC you are building a "serpent" deck... but you now what .. a deep one would go great in here, but you can not use it as it breaks the theme... Like there is nothing wrong with theme decks.. get what ever pleasure you like form the game.. but they are inherently weaker than "real" decks.

Well, all your spirit cards can be cast by your partners there is no reason for them to be in your deck. This is what I am talking about as non-focused. Your deck is designed for multiplayer, but it is still trying to cover many bases, when your partners can be doing that for you. The real "want" is to make a deck.. but it takes a while to work out that when you are playing multiplayer you are in fact playing "one" deck, that all of you control. So there is no need to force sphere choices on any player as your partners can cast that sphere.. leaving you to specialize.

IMO, brand is one of the best heroes in the game at the moment for multiplayer, his synergy with Legolas, untapping him and then legolas getting a 2nd attack + progress tokens and Berovor (card draw) is extremely powerful. Allowing the dwarf god to defend and then untapping him to turn on his effect again... multi attacks with dunhere.. scrying the encounter deck many times with Denathor.. the list is just endless.. the tap effects are powerful and his ability to untap with out having to dig a card up is extreme to say the least.

lleimmoen said:

I do not want to argue for the sake of arguing, as I said I appreciate your comment, but I feel like I shall defend the deck, it is by no means all over the place, it is very focused, and few minutes ago it helped us to beat Massing at Osgiliath with three players, which I think is no small feat. Again, I would advise you to try it out so you know what I am talking about, that is my main point now. Or we can compare some quest results, and thus learn that perhaps our ideas are relative towards a certain strategy or scenario.[/quote]

Maybe you should have titled your thread "here is my deck do not comment if you do not like it" I am not arguing but discussing pros and cons. Trying to give constructive criticism. Also just so you know.. Massing is well knows as one of the worst scaling quest in the game, as in the more players the easier it gets, and massing gets WAY WAY easier as more players are added. This is because the main hurdle in massing is the starting few rounds during the scout invasion, more players make that easier to deal with even with the added scouts. Then more allies each turn makes dealing with the mods easier.. and so one as it snowballs until you have so much questing power and allies tha you are in little trouble... beating it with 3 players is nothing to brag about.

lleimmoen said:

From what you said, I will consider the Descendant. I really wish he were of cost 3 instead of 4. He does seem a bit expensive at times.

Yeah, I really find Descendant to be a weak card. The 4 cost doesn't worry me much anymore with Ziggy kicking about, the main problem is that it only effects cards in the staging area...


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#5 lleimmoen

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Posted 28 February 2012 - 12:06 AM

You say Massing is easier with more players. Wow, we have totally different opinions then. Massing is obviously much easier solo if you choose the right deck. I used to beat it about 60 or 70% of time with my Rohan deck (starting threat 25 and Dúnhere dealing with the staging area). But it gets much harder with more players with all the surges around. Also, the third stage when you have to sacrifice a hero or a ranger to quest, obviously, in solo it is easy to have a ranger already, with three players even when you have two rangers, they might not be with the right player. I really wonder where you find bases for this claim.

It is really not that I dislike constructive criticism. I have said before I enjoyed your comments. When I feel you are saying something wrong though, I write it, as did you. It is funny that you seem to blame me for it.

And yes, this software sucks if you are not patient enough to edit your post after you make some mess.



#6 gone questing

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Posted 04 March 2012 - 10:03 PM

lleimmoen said:


A Light in the Dark

Can work as Feint, one can wait after the shadow card is revealed, and combos perfectly with Dúnhere.




I thought the same until more recently.
I had asked FFG a question in regard to Wandering Took and it's action during combat. Basically, the action and Took's location didn't affect how combat played out.
In regard to A Light in the Dark... I feel it is similar. Whether or not the enemy is in the staging area is only really relevant when making engagement checks. Past that, I couldn't find anything in the rule book that says moving an enemy to the staging area ends combat. :(
 






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