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Ship Option - Bridge of the Eternal Vigil


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#1 venkelos

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Posted 13 February 2012 - 04:09 AM

So, a certain amount of chatting, regarding the Light of Terra, from Lure of the Expanse, has been circulating. Lookiong at it, but also stepping back a bit, I was wondering how a particular piece of tech from the Light might work, if one was willing to incorporate it in their own ship; that is, the Light's Bridge configuration.

Archeotech Component - Bridge of the Eternal Vigil
This ancient bridge design is viewed by many with more fear than awe, as the very idea that the ship's Lord-Captain would be permanently interred, never to again leave his command throne, is terrifying to consider. Only the largest, most powerful ships are likely to receive this upgrade, and only if an individual willing to be forever merged within their ship can be found. To the willing recipient, radical procedures are performed, removing many of their internal organs, and replacing them with powerful cybernetic devices, which will be able to carry them on through the centuries. They are permanently anchored into place, becoming immobile, but their connections to the ship allow them to perceive, and to manipulate almost any system from the bridge, as if the vessel, itself, was an extension of the Lord-Captain's body and senses.
Man in the Machine: The ship's Lord-Captain, who has been integrated into the bridge, gains Machine (4), though this trait does not affect the recipient's mind, in this case. Their Movement permanently becomes 0.

Hull: Cruisers and up | Power: 3 | Space: 1 |  SP: 2

Now, I know full well that this is not an upgrade that any player would likely want for their own ship; the LC is likely the Rogue Trader, who is not going to give up a career adventuring. Looking past this fact, however (it could make for an interesting upgrade, certainly for NPCs, like it did for Roth and the Light of Terra, but also maybe for a bigger ship in the RTs fleet. What else might one do to augment it? If the captain is hard-wired into the ship, what other advantages might he receive, due to his direct interface?



#2 ItsUncertainWho

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Posted 13 February 2012 - 07:16 AM

venkelos said:

...What else might one do to augment it? If the captain is hard-wired into the ship, what other advantages might he receive, due to his direct interface?

I would have the Captain gain 1d10 insanity undergoing the process and gain 1 point of insanity every time the ship takes critical damage.

One option:
The Captain is always watching.
Permanently reduce Morale by 5 points. From now on, due to the speed at which the Captain can respond to any problem and give orders or inspiration to the crew, any crew or morale loss will be reduced by 1d5 points to a minimum of 0.

 



#3 Sna

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 11:58 PM

Nice idea! Captain Erwin Ramas of the Gothic-class cruiser Drachenfels from the two Battlefleet Gothic Novels Execution Hour and Shadow Point was severely injured by an Eldar attack on his command bridge prior to the conflict and underwent a similar procedure. His 'Command Shell' was described similar to a Titan, deep in the bowels of the ship (I imagine close to the Machine Spirit).

None the less, he is an interesting character throughout the books, a staunch ally of Captain Semper of the Lord Solar Macharius. It would not be very suitable for the players, though.



#4 Red Bart

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 01:39 AM

Since the captain is acutely aware of everything that is going on in the ship he is bound to, he can respond better to enemy threats such as boarding actions. Because of this any Command test to repel boarders gets a +10, even if he isn't personally in charge of the action but just assisting (i.e. supplying information).



#5 voidstate

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Posted 17 February 2012 - 01:23 AM

 This would be a great idea for when a group prefers not to have one player, as Rogue Trader, having higher status than the rest. Just make the Rogue Trader ionterred in the bridge and have them handle the other roles aboard ship.


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#6 Cobramax76

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Posted 27 February 2012 - 07:43 PM

Nice ideas so far and i am intrigued by the idea of this particular bridge type....But as for the bonuses/penalties...id be more inclined to go with the following:

Bonuses:    

1) Repelling borders- Automatic success after 1d10+2 rounds

Reason:

As part of the ship with access to ALL its sensors inside and out you can simply lock all the accessways off sealing off the sections of the ship with crew in them and then disengaging all safety interlock protocols for all airlocks and VENT ALL the enemy boarders into the void before they can do jack squat.  It elimanates the need to fight the repelling actions normally

2) I would give a bonus to all piloting / maneuver and navigation checks as well as ballistic tests ( perhaps from +5 to +10 )

Reason:

A actual human brain that has consciousness as such is superior to a lobotomized servitor for all these said actions..and can respond better, faster, and more accruately than a servitor can...thereby granting bonuses to said actions since the ships captain will be hardwired into ALL of the ships systems and better able to work every system of his new body better than any servitor could

Penalties:

1) I definitely agree that to undergo the procedure automatically gains at least 1d10 insanity points ( difficult test for HALF the amount) and another challenging test each time the ship sustains a critical hit or gain 1 insanity point ) Any associated talents taken to reduce the IPs or ignore the tests or alter their difficulty ratings take full effect

Reason:  

As one with the ship you will feel its pain and feel it as if it was you..this bridge is no different than the special sarcophogi used by the titan legios princepts                                                                                                          



#7 venkelos

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Posted 28 February 2012 - 11:25 PM

Wow, I'm really happy, and a bit surprised, that this thread has gotten as much response as this; I half-expected the "no players would use it, so who cares" cop out, so thanks. Anyway, it might do well for me to sum up the component, again, using various ideas to compile it, though it might seem like a lot for a single component:

Archeotech Component - Bridge of the Eternal Vigil
This ancient bridge design, which borrows from that of the most powerful land-based war machines, the Titans, is viewed by many with more fear than awe, as the very idea that the ship's Lord-Captain would be permanently interred, never to again leave his command throne, is terrifying to consider. Only the largest, most powerful ships are likely to receive this upgrade, and only if an individual willing to be forever merged within their ship can be found. To the willing recipient, radical procedures are performed, removing many of their internal organs, and replacing them with powerful cybernetic devices, which will be able to carry them on through the centuries. They are permanently anchored into place, becoming immobile, but their connections to the ship allow them to perceive, and to manipulate almost any system from the bridge, as if the vessel, itself, was an extension of the Lord-Captain's body and senses.
Man in the Machine: The ship's Lord-Captain, who has been integrated into the bridge, gains Machine (4), though this trait does not affect the recipient's mind, in this case. Their Movement permanently becomes 0. They also gain 1d10 Insanity points, due to the initial broadening of their senses, and an additional 1 Insanity point each time the ship sustains a critical hit (a Difficult (-10) Willpower Test can negate this, as the Captain has become more fortified by his condition).
The Walls Have Eyes: The Lord-Captain's insertion into the ship's systems gives him unprecedented observation and interaction with his crew. While this can make for a much more smoothly running vessel, it can also grate on the crew, who quickly learn that there is no place on the ship, their home, where the Captain is not watching and listening to them. Permanently reduce Morale by 5 points. From now on, due to the speed at which the Captain can respond to any problem and give orders or inspiration to the crew, any crew or morale loss will be reduced by 1d5 points to a minimum of 0
One With the Hull: The embedded Lord-Captain has senses, and control, over almost every inch of the vessel. When this ship is the victim of a Hit and Run action, he treats the opposed Command Test as a Routine (+20) Command Test, rather than the usual Ordinary (+10) difficulty.
One With the Weapons: His union of sensors, skill, and weapons grants the Lord-Captain's ship increased accuracy. All Ballistic Skill tests to fire the ship's weapons conducted by the Lord-Captain gain +5.

Hull: Cruisers and up | Power: 3 | Space: 1 | SP: 3

Still not really an upgrade for a player character, but a nice NPC option. It does a whole lot of stuff, more than one upgrade probably should, but the improvements are spaced out, and don't really stack together, so it shouldn't be too bad. Add to that the loss of a character, and the need to have a ship of the right size, able to carry archeotech, and it seems a pretty nice deal. If one were a fan of things like Andromeda, an NPC second could be slaved into this post, instead, giving the Lord-Captain a shackled AI, of sorts, ala Rommie, EDI, Melfina, or numerous other sci-fi examples (Cortana?). While the Imperium has a very real fear of true AI, this human-based super cogitator might be acceptable, and an accomplishment any AM rep would be proud to claim they accomplished. The Captain would retain mobility, and the First Officer would make the ship even more of a character, while freeing some other players to do other things, or assist in tasks the AI can already do. If you just say "no PC ship could have this", then it doesn't really matter that it's an over-the-top upgrade, while if you did let them have it, the options are awesome, IMHO.



#8 Cobramax76

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Posted 02 March 2012 - 11:09 PM

I like the new setup..it actually amazes me how alike we are in our thinking for things...Before i read the thread here i had designed something similar ( given my refference to the titan legios princepts modification into a sarcophagi type apparatus in order to pilot the titans..it seemed...a natural progression that the Admech would offer favored captains of the fleet.   I do like your components size/weight though...better than my system by far..lol...The only ship i currently have any version of the design in is a unique battleship.  Its originally a desolator class that was lost in warp transit and crash landed on a necron tombworld ( into the side of one of their subterranean caves impacting their dormant monolith...The accident caused the ships hull to become infested with necron nanites..giving the ship the same regeneration rates..after a millenia+ in the warp the planet emerged and the ship was found by an enterprising rogue trader family with direct ties to the Inquisition. ( Ordo hereticus ) So they vaguely recognized the chassis after all the time spent planetbound....and began a salvage operation ( The planet was in the deep expanse area ) During the salvage some of the Tau were ambushed in a nearby system and their distress call was heard by the Inquisitors retinue and they responded thinking it was an imperial ship under attack from the foul xenos pirates ( the tau were using imperial codes intentionally to get a response as they knew they were already in the area ) Once there the Inquisitor realized theyd been duped...but,,not wanting to pass up a chance to annihilate some eldar raiders.....The rogue trader and his contingent opened fire on the 2 raiders before they realized what happened it was over thanks to long range lance fire...Then attentions were turned to the tau ship..damaged and unable to effect any escape...they opened communication with the Inquisitor by thanking him for saving them and defeating the pirates and asked if he would assist them in getting back to their outpost in liu of obliterating them on the spot.  After discussing with the rogue trader ( the inquisitors direct relative ) They agreed to do as requested IF the tau would agree to assist them in their operation under the stipulation that that group of tau would Not attempt to attack or settle on imperial planets or ships they would help to destroy the pirates once the new capitalship was fully disenterred and remodeled using new systems and refitted.  the tau agreed.  They were grateful enough and trustng enough over the operation that they allowed the rogue trader to have several batteries of their capital class rail guns ( salvaged from crippled/dead tau ships that the tau could no longer use ) By the end of it the ship was fully redesigned and the exterior was reshaped ( partially due to the necron nanites ) and the ship was christened the Shadow Warscythe ( and yes i have a pic of it complete with weapons diagram overlay and she is black as night with red tinted lighting :P )

The captain is fully interred on the command bridge but just as a titan legios pilot is able to leave the cockpit..so too is the captain...though it takes some time and several tech-priests and servitors to do so...to help give the captain a chance to rest and actually sleep still...as opposed to being constantly awake...

As for the component and its design..i recommend reading the same book..Dan Abnetts "Titanicus"  it fully lays out the setup they use for the sarcophogi the legios pilots use.  It might help your creativity with things as it did with me.



#9 venkelos

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 08:43 AM

You know, it's a simple thing, but I never really gave it much thought that the Captain could get back out of it. L-C Draken Roth was a part of his bridge, permanently (in the grim, dark future, nothing ever seems fair, or easy), and I thought more of a Dreadnought pilot's internment, then how a Titan Princeps integrates, but this is very intriguing, as it could free the upgrade up for a PC ship and crew, without costing a whole character. It might be a bit too good, if the Captain also maintains his freedom of mobility, but Rogue Trader is all about getting the best, so why not. At the least, however, I would have to hope that, while not racking up Insanity each time they uplink, there should need to be some time delay, as the Captain and the Ship synch up, or down, which you account for.

As for your ship, Coveted Battleship Hull + Tau + Necrons + Inquisition + your party = . I would very much like to see a stat block of it, sometime, and the pic.



#10 Cobramax76

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 10:05 AM

The Sarcophogus of the titan legios princepts by no means give him "mobility" in the normal term...Hes permanently stuck in a aerated fluid filled tank/vat in the shape of a large sarcophagus with all the leads and connections all throughout ( think a cross between a large coffin and the tanks they used to keep the humans in Matrix ) with all the leads attached throughout his body..his movements become the titans movements..the titans pain becomes his pain..where he looks. the titans sensors look etc...But..there is another particular with it as well...The former princepts spirits are a part of the machine manifold matrix on each titan...lending bits of their insight etc to the current user....( think of it like memory ingrams imprinted onto the data lattice circuitry ) that the current pilot can access given time and effort to help them with choices sometimes....( the ablity to replay ALL the history and contacts/battles that titan has EVER fought in as a mental memory ).  The pilot cannot get out and "walk around" and is able to be put into a chemically induced sleep cycle to speed recovery/regeneration under the watchful eye of the mechanicus Magos that are required for this to be maintained...Sorry if i gave the idea that they could actually "unplug" and move around like Neo can in matrix...because they cannot...once in the sarcophagus..they are there permanently until dead ( or they royally piss off the magos and get yanked out...lol )which would make the captains personal Magos a key player in a ships mutiny if the ruinous powers ever got their claws into the Magos...could easily and instantly cripple the ship that way making a takeover that much easier...



#11 venkelos

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 02:07 AM

Ah good, I like that  more, so it's like there is a sacrifice to having such an advantageous ship upgrade. I have only seen a few pics 1, 2, of princeps, and they are always up and walking, wearing long coats. I haven't read the book, but assumed that they either used a single MIU at the base of the neck, like Robotech from my childhood, or a number of them, like the Matrix reference you mentioned. Because of that, I imagined what you described as something more like that. However, I am more pleased with its lack of mobility, even if it does smack of not being good for PC groups. While having to plug in various nodes, and wait for systems to synch up could be enough to warrant this tech, the idea that it's not so easy to thoroughly merge with such tech, and then step away, and go back to being just a person, is very important to me; otherwise, Space Marines would have found a way to make more Dreadnought-like mechs, something akin to a Grey Knights Dreadknight, to use in their epic battles, rather than waiting for one of theirs to suffer mortal injury, prior to permanent internment in a sarcophagus, bound for a stasis tomb, or a dreadnought.

Glad you also went the route of permanent upload, over synchronizing pilot. As an extra, I think I already know what the first Elite Advance I would want to grabafter becoming this kind of character, if I didn't have it ahead of time, orthoproxy.



#12 venkelos

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 03:32 AM

So, I wa spoking around Dark Reign, and I can't seem to fnd the page with special weapons, i.e. the Tau Railguns. Might someone more proficient with that site assist me in this? Thanks.



#13 Cobramax76

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Posted 05 April 2012 - 01:53 AM

If you want the tau weapon stats email me ( so i can make sure to have the email addy ) and ill send you a copy of what i have for it.



#14 venkelos

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 01:47 AM

Sent you the email; this is just in case the junk filter caught me. Thanks!



#15 Cobramax76

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 01:35 PM

no i got the email and sent you back the copy of tau AND eldar weapons files i got off dark reign site



#16 venkelos

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 02:24 AM

Gotz the email, and thanks. As I have looked at this again, it makes me wish I could easily whip up something; in the sci-fi- program Andromeda, there is a ship referred to as the Balance of Judgment, a Siege-Perilous class Destroyer, a ship-killer, if you will. This ship was rather a bit smaller than the "average" Highguard Ship of the Line (ala the Andromeda Ascendant), able to be operated by its AI, alone. My problem is that, along with fitting the size well (I suppose it could get away with being a Light Cruiser, but 40k ship's scale is so wanky compared to practically anything else), the ship is, predominantly, a missile destroyer, and torpedoes have a limited placement on ships, while the BoJ would have two front-mounted launchers, carrying a considerably larger compliment of torpedoes, using its shorter-range AP cannons as almost more a Turret rating, or a big punch for things that actually close with it. It's rather sad when the figuring out how to portray the character of Michael Shanks (Gabriel/Remiel) on the ship is actually easier than the doing the ship. Oh well, it prevents us from nasty crossovers.



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#17 venkelos

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 05:33 AM

So, the most recent variant of this Ship Component now reads:

Archeotech Component - Bridge of the Eternal Vigil
This ancient bridge design, which borrows from that of the most powerful land-based war machines, the Titans, is viewed by many with more fear than awe, as the very idea that the ship's Lord-Captain would be permanently interred, never to again leave his command throne, is terrifying to consider. Only the largest, most powerful ships are likely to receive this upgrade, and only if an individual willing to be forever merged within their ship can be found. To the willing recipient, radical procedures are performed, removing many of their internal organs, and replacing them with powerful cybernetic devices, which will be able to carry them on through the centuries. They are permanently anchored into place, becoming immobile, but their connections to the ship allow them to perceive, and to manipulate almost any system from the bridge, as if the vessel, itself, was an extension of the Lord-Captain's body and senses.
Man in the Machine: The ship's Lord-Captain, who has been integrated into the bridge, gains Machine (4), though this trait does not affect the recipient's mind, in this case. Their Movement permanently becomes 0. They also gain 1d10 Insanity points, due to the initial broadening of their senses, and an additional 1 Insanity point each time the ship sustains a critical hit (a Difficult (-10) Willpower Test can negate this, as the Captain has become more fortified by his condition).
The Walls Have Eyes: The Lord-Captain's insertion into the ship's systems gives him unprecedented observation and interaction with his crew. While this can make for a much more smoothly running vessel, it can also grate on the crew, who quickly learn that there is no place on the ship, their home, where the Captain is not watching and listening to them. Permanently reduce Morale by 5 points. From now on, due to the speed at which the Captain can respond to any problem and give orders or inspiration to the crew, any crew or morale loss will be reduced by 1d5 points to a minimum of 0.
One With the Hull: The embedded Lord-Captain has senses, and control, over almost every inch of the vessel. When this ship is the victim of a Hit and Run action, he treats the opposed Command Test as a Routine (+20) Command Test, rather than the usual Ordinary (+10) difficulty.
One With the Weapons: His union of sensors, skill, and weapons grants the Lord-Captain's ship increased accuracy. All Ballistic Skill tests to fire the ship's weapons conducted by the Lord-Captain gain +5.

Hull: Cruisers and up | Power: 3 | Space: 1 | SP: 3
Hull: Battleships          | Power: 5 | Space: 3 | SP: 3 (apparently, Battleship's stuff is a lot bigger)

So, I rather like how that all works out, but is there anything else the Mechanicus might do to the Captain, to further aide him in his eternal vigil on the bridge? Might they give him the Logis Implant Talent, or a rare, GQ Cortex Implant? Any other cybernetics? Might he benefit from Prosanguine/Autosanguine? I'm not saying more is needed, but sometimes, people can go overboard, and I wonder what other boons the recipient might receive, for being anchored to his ship for all eternity. Any ideas would be nice.



#18 Cobramax76

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Posted 22 November 2012 - 03:57 PM

I would say that the captain should automatically gain the pro/autosanguine talents as a result of the extensive cybernetic conversion and immersion in amniotic fluid..

On an interesting sidenote that did come up…The battleship i have that is fitted with it  also has the regenerative hull trait…The ship tests ( using the Captains Toughness trait ) to repair the damage so it can regenerate quite quickly ( same as regeneration trait ) instead of waiting longer to begin and taking longer to regain the points.






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