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"Op Fire" question


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#1 San

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Posted 02 January 2012 - 08:10 PM

In the Rulebook it's said, that "A unit may only engage in an Op Fire attack if the active enemy unit has just moved into a hex within range and LOS".

1) Is it legal to launch an "Op Fire" attack if  the active enemy unit has just moved  into a hex within range and LOS from another hex within range and LOS?

2) Is it legal to launch an "Op Fire" attack if the active enemy unit has just moved into a hex within range and LOS from another hex within range, but not within  LOS?

Thanks a lot.



#2 TheKaiser33

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Posted 03 January 2012 - 05:50 AM

The main thing to keep in mind is that the enemy unit has to have just moved into the hex that you are about to attack with op fire.  You can only attack the unit if it is in range and LOS.  It doesn't matter where the unit moved from, so long as it has just entered the hex you have in range and LOS.



#3 RayGuns

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Posted 03 January 2012 - 11:57 PM

Yes and Yes.

Basically, you can Op Fire at the enemy unit anytime you want, but you can only attack the enemy unit if it just moved into a hex that is in range and in LOS.



#4 San

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Posted 23 January 2012 - 02:32 AM

 And yet another question.

The Rulebook states, that a unit in Op Fire mode may attack the active enemy unit immediately after the  active unit moves into a hex within range and LOS of the Op Fire unit. Let's imagine, that the active unit moves straigt towards the Op Fire unit.

 Is it correct, that the Op Fire unit may attack at long range distance with half of its power, jr it can wait till the active unit moves into the normal range distance and then attack with full power, or not attack at all? 



#5 TheKaiser33

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Posted 23 January 2012 - 04:59 AM

You do not half firepower for long range, but instead you would roll your normal dice but only hit on "6".

Basically, as the enemy unit moves into a hex within range (close, normal, or long) and LOS of the op fire unit, then player who is moving would ask you if you wish to use your opfire.  You have the option of 1) waiting, 2) firing.  The other play may continue moving their unit after 1) you have done nothing (or) 2) the opfire has been resolved.

If you did not attack the unit, and the enemy decides not to move that unit any further, then you have lost your opfire oppurtunity for that unit.  But yes, sometimes it is better to wait if you believe that the enemy unit is going to continue advancing. 

For instance, an enemy unit moves into LOS of your opfire unit, however, that enemy unit is at long range, so you decide to wait.  The enemy unit then advances another hex closer and is still in LOS of your opfire unit.  However, since they moved closer, they are now at normal range so you decide to use your opfire and fire at that unit.  Now you will score hits on that enemy unit on "5" and "6" (normal range) instead of just on "6" (long range).



#6 San

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Posted 23 January 2012 - 07:17 PM

TheKaiser33 said:

You do not half firepower for long range, but instead you would roll your normal dice but only hit on "6".

 

Oh,sorry, of course.

 

 

 

TheKaiser33 said:

...For instance, an enemy unit moves into LOS of your opfire unit, however, that enemy unit is at long range, so you decide to wait.  The enemy unit then advances another hex closer and is still in LOS of your opfire unit...

Do I have the opportunity to use my OP Fire attack on every hex, or only that one that on the border of range? For example, my Op Fire squad is normal infantry squad. The enemy squad is moving straight towards my squad. It moves into the eighth hex counting from my squad (the farest border of long range). I decide not to resolve my Op Fire attack. The enemy squad continues moving. Am I allowed to resolve my Op Fire attack on the next, seventh, counting from my squad,  hex? Or, as far as I missed the moment of entering into long range,  do I have to wait until enemy squad reaches the  border of normal range?



#7 Grand Stone

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Posted 24 January 2012 - 12:17 AM

You can use "OP Fire" whenever a enemy unit enters a hex. When you want to use it is up to you. So you can wait until he moves out in the open, or fire emiddetly. However, if you fire immediately, you will not have the opportunity to fire at the squad later.

 

However, I have a question of my own (which probably is covered by the rules, but here it goes). If order a unit to do an action, do you declare what action it is going to do before moving it? Or can you change your mind in the middle of the move and use a fire & move action instead of a regular move? The question is, do me (the defender) know wether the unit I'm fireing at is going to take an regular move, assault or an fire & move mentaction before using op-fire?

 

 



#8 San

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Posted 24 January 2012 - 12:34 AM

Grand Stone said:

However, I have a question of my own (which probably is covered by the rules, but here it goes). If order a unit to do an action, do you declare what action it is going to do before moving it? Or can you change your mind in the middle of the move and use a fire & move action instead of a regular move? The question is, do me (the defender) know wether the unit I'm fireing at is going to take an regular move, assault or an fire & move mentaction before using op-fire?

The Rulebook states, for instance: 

"A player who declares a Fire and Movement action may decide not to have the active unit attack during the activation, but the unit still receives the movement point penalty."

"A player who declares an Assault action may decide not to have the active squad engage in an assault attack after its movement, but the squad still receives the movement penalty."

The fact of taking such penalties means, that your opponent must know your plans before you actually act.



#9 Grand Stone

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Posted 24 January 2012 - 03:44 AM

I agree.

 

So, this means that you dont know exactly what your enemy is up to, but have an general idé.



#10 San

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Posted 24 January 2012 - 07:43 PM

Grand Stone said:

So, this means that you dont know exactly what your enemy is up to, but have an general idé.

I think you do know exactly your enemy action, because he has to declare it previously in order to give you an opportunity to control penalties.



#11 Grand Stone

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:06 AM

Not exactly. You do know that the unit is only moving, but you dont know to where he is moving :D



#12 San

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:44 AM

Grand Stone said:

Not exactly. You do know that the unit is only moving, but you dont know to where he is moving :D

I do know exactly the action - it's moving. It's clear enough. 



#13 neu.descolado

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 03:55 AM

In Op Fire situation, I don't like this rule that say "you must declare your action before...". I don't declare my action before act. Fog of war is great!



#14 TheKaiser33

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 05:50 AM

You do need to declare what type of activation you are doing when you activate the unit.  However, if you are doing a fire & movement there is nothing that says you have to declare how far you're going to move.  So:

1) You declare a fire & movement action.  You have the squad fire at an enemy squad that is in op fire mode and try to pin it.  Your attack fails so you decide that your squad will not move any hexes, thus denying the enemy unit a chance to op fire you.

2) You declare a fire & movement action.  You advance into a hex that is in LOS and range of an enemy unit that is in op fire.  Then enemy decides not to attack you with the opfire in hopes that you will move closer.  You decide that's as far as you will advance and fire from there, thus avoiding enemy op fire.



#15 neu.descolado

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 06:37 AM

You declare a ADVANCE action. Looks like a inofensive action. Ok, go ahead!

You declare a FIRE & MOVEMENT action. Hmm... Looks like a dangerous action... Let me see your possible target hex...

You declare a ASSAULT action. Ops...STOP! I will attack!



#16 RayGuns

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 12:56 PM

neu.descolado said:

 

You declare a ASSAULT action. Ops...STOP! I will attack!

 

 

Not if the squad making the assault is already adjacent to the hex it tends to assault. In this case, then you cannot perform Op Fire.

But yes, when you choose to Op Fire is somewhat important at times, and tricky. If you wait to long, you might loose your opportunity to fire. Also, if you fire to soon, an enemy unit taking a Fire and Move action might just get a range one attack on you.

Tactical Hint:
Placing units in Op Fire is usually a good tactic - especially for MGs because of their Rapid Op Fire ability - but there will be times Op Fire will be a bad choice because those units will only be able to fire if the enemy actually move.

For example, let us say the British move first in the Action Phase. As a result, the German player would like to place their anti-tank gun in Op Fire because it has LOS on a British tank, and wants to fire at it when it attempts to move out of LOS. However, if the British tank does not move, the German anti-tank gun will not be able to attack it. The British tank on the other hand might get a free shot at the German anti-tank gun as long as the British tank does a Concentrated Fire action, or a Fire and Movement and fires before it moves. The latter being the more risky of the two because if the attack does not take out the German anti-tank gun, it will no doubt fire at the British tank when it starts to move.



#17 RayGuns

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 01:09 PM

TheKaiser33 said:

You do need to declare what type of activation you are doing when you activate the unit.  However, if you are doing a fire & movement there is nothing that says you have to declare how far you're going to move.  So:

1) You declare a fire & movement action.  You have the squad fire at an enemy squad that is in op fire mode and try to pin it.  Your attack fails so you decide that your squad will not move any hexes, thus denying the enemy unit a chance to op fire you.

2) You declare a fire & movement action.  You advance into a hex that is in LOS and range of an enemy unit that is in op fire.  Then enemy decides not to attack you with the opfire in hopes that you will move closer.  You decide that's as far as you will advance and fire from there, thus avoiding enemy op fire.

This is where the historical tactic of "Overlapping Fields of Fire" come in handy. This will take care of situation #2.

As for situation #1? Well, you got the drop on them, or they couldn't get a good fix on your position fast enough, or there wasn't enough time to focus on the target after being fired at, or the fire from you unit was just enough to cause them flinch for a second. Remember, if those moves are carried out in Action Turns, it sorta all happens at once. If your opponent really wanted to attack your unit before it dove into cover or out of line of sight, then they should have made sure they won the initiative so they could take their action turns first.






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