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4-Player Game Houserule: switch Greyjoy for Tyrell


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#1 eriktheguy

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Posted 30 December 2011 - 11:18 PM

 A lot of people have been noting that Baratheon has too easy a time rolling through the south in 4 player games and suggested replacing house Greyjoy with Tyrell. I'd love to start a discussion with anyone else who has tried this.

I've tried it and think it makes the game a little more balanced.

Lanister has some immediate relief in that they are no longer surrounded on every side, which seems to be a major issue for them when Greyjoy is in play. The presence of Tyrell means that the Lanisters cannot simply expand to the south for an easy win, so they come off only a little bit ahead. I still suggest placing the 3-player Greyjoy neutral token on Pyke so that it cannot be captured.

Meanwhile Baratheon  has to contend with Tyrell and is much harder pressed for fortresses. When we played, the two houses conquered most of the southern continent and the result was about 5/6 strongholds for each of them from turn to turn (depending on exhchanges with the other players).

Stark gets a clear advantage if no one puts pressure on them, but Lannisters will probably want to press North anyways, and Baratheon has the option for naval assault in a pinch, so it seems to work out.



#2 Mecandes

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Posted 04 January 2012 - 04:56 PM

 I've just played once so far tonight, and while we were learning the game, everyone was hesitant to attack another player... and in fact, Baratheon ended up conquering 7 strongholds/castles in the south before anyone had even challenged another player in battle... 



#3 eriktheguy

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Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:46 AM

 Yes, the Baratheon advantage is especially noticable with new players. More experienced players recognize that Baratheon has an advantage from the start and will not simply let him default-win. This usually involves Lannister keeping Baratheon on the ropes and Greyjoy agreeing not to interfere.

I'm curious to see if the advantage dissapears entirely in 4 player games with more experienced players, which is why I've posted here.

So even if you haven't tried out this houserule, feel free to comment about how 4 player games have gone for you, and what your level of experience is.



#4 leajen

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Posted 07 January 2012 - 03:05 AM

 My play group noticed the same problem on our first play through. On our second play  we lock some of the southern regions so they could not be taken which forced the Baratheons further north toward the Lannisters which did work to a degree but it left some of the map lock which I didn't like. For our next play I will suggest we switch the Greyjoys for Tyrell as i think this may work better and leave the whole map to play for, I'll comment back how well this works out for us after we have tested out.



#5 Kurbutti

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Posted 26 January 2012 - 12:03 AM

The system is fundamentally broken no matter how you switch Houses. Lannister, Tyrell, either way someone is going to have easier time annexing every castle in the South. The fact that they can be captured is more of a problem, rather than the actual position of the Houses. Make most of the castles/strongholds in Dorne and Reach uncapturable. That way Baratheon won't have any incentive to go for the auto-win option.

In any case, all these "alterations" are going to cause problems because there just aren't enough neutral force tokens to balance it out.



#6 SexyMike44

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Posted 26 January 2012 - 10:04 AM

 

the only 4 player game I have played so far was the only game of this 2nd edition I have not enjoyed so far.  IMO there were a few reasons for this.

1. I was lannister.

2. all the other players had never played a game before, not even 1st edition.  So what ended up happening was they all attacked only lannister because "they are the inbreeders from the books".  I was very frustrated with the stark player.  he asked teh same qeustions repeatedly and refused to go after baratheon.

3. I didn't try going south right away, i tried to fight with greyjoy for a land right next to my home early. 

So i chalk this upto new players and the fact that next time I will go to highgarden asap with lannister.

 

hopefully I'll get another chance to try this out and see how different strategies work better.



#7 Stalker0

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Posted 26 January 2012 - 06:57 PM

What is certain castles were simply removed in the 4 player game, would that help?

I'm pretty saddened that with a remake of a game that is virtually identical to the first and it has such horrible balance in 4 player.



#8 Coys

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Posted 28 January 2012 - 10:12 AM

 We changed the game a bit the way we play at lunch. What we do is if someone is attacking a neutral faction then we draw a Tides of Battle card on behalf of the neutral faction and then resolve the combat from there.  There's often a lot of cheers around the table when a skull turns over on the card!!



#9 jhagen

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Posted 13 February 2012 - 12:57 PM

4 players are fine.

remove greyjoy and barratheon from play and make their home territories invulnerable to attack. everything then opens up. stark comes down in the east to fight martell and south through seagard to advance on lannister.tyrell faces off against martell and keeps him in check. played it 2 times now. forks fine. leave all regions open except for 6 player startup.



#10 SerJordah

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Posted 13 February 2012 - 05:18 PM

I might want to try this variant w/o Greyjoy or Baratheon. One question, Jhagen:

Would you still place neutral force tokens in The Eyrie, King's Landing, and Storm's End (Riverrun, too, perhaps)?



#11 Dolus

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 06:33 AM

We played over the weekend, 4 player, and Baratheon was stopped by Stark from the North, Lannister from the West, and Greyjoy from the South. This was an interesting approach that I never anticipated. Greyjoy went by sea down South and took Martell's lands, and this spread out the four houses enough to make it more of a real battle mid to late game, and not a race to stop Baratheon.



#12 jhagen

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 09:38 AM

SerJordah said:

I might want to try this variant w/o Greyjoy or Baratheon. One question, Jhagen:

Would you still place neutral force tokens in The Eyrie, King's Landing, and Storm's End (Riverrun, too, perhaps)?

the only neutral forces placed on the board are those for a 6 player setup. and since greyjoy/lannister arent used at the same time, no need for the riverrun garrison.

 



#13 eriktheguy

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Posted 26 February 2012 - 07:15 AM

Stalker0 said:

What is certain castles were simply removed in the 4 player game, would that help?

I'm pretty saddened that with a remake of a game that is virtually identical to the first and it has such horrible balance in 4 player.

Are you the same stalker0 whose house rules I use when I'm playing 4e DnD?



#14 Joeyk1985

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 12:21 PM

 Hello everyone, I have played my first unofficial 4p tyrell variant yesterday on vassal and the boys seemed to be familiar with it as if it was an official variant… (That's what I thought). I tried to play today again with other ppl and they said "no such thing as official tyrell variant"… It turned out it was a set of rules that those players knew and agreed upon previously…

Anyway, the changes were as follows - (I was playing lanni):

- Tyrell instead of GJ of course

- Most of the south was locked except Oldtown and Dormish Marshes

- I'm not sure about Three Towers

-Pyke was closed

- Only Neutrals were King's Landing and Eyrie

-Riverrun musters 1 point only instead of 2

-All seas were open

-Except Sea of Dorne which I wasn't sure about

 

This is a reconstruction (more or less) basically due to the questions that came up today when I tried to setup the variant again and other players were questionning this setup…

Gameplay in brief : Stark went rogue while tyrell and bara were ganking me and raiding my support in stoney sept,  I was holding 5 castles most of the game (lani, RR, seaguard, Harenhal, Flints finger) while they all had 3 castles… Bara and Stark kept fighting for Narrow… Tyrell had easy time farming pt and had sword most of the game which was annoying and raven/throne btw him and bara. Game ended when tyrell rage quit after lost 3 ships in sunset at round 9… Bara was in white harbor and lost KL to Tyrell. I had lost seaguard… 

 

Any ideas ? Do you agree on this setup ? Any comments on these rules ?

 



#15 nob0dy

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 06:50 AM

Hello all,

 

this is my first post on this forum.  my friends and i startd playing the 2nd edition of GoT last year.

we try to get a game in at least once a week, but due to friendships lost and not everyone having the same schedule we have been forced to play 4 player more often than 5 or 6 (which i really like).  after watching the people that play Stark lose interest after the GJ comes and kicks in the backdoor or Baratheon comes up north we decided to try a different battle, a southern battle.

we knock out GJ and Stark and play w/ the 4 southern families cutting off anything Seaguard and the 2 northern territories near the Fingers.

it makes for a fun battle filled game that lasts usually 10 full rounds and keeps everyone's heads in the game and a lot of fun.

anyone else try this or think it is a silly idea, or great idea??



#16 nob0dy

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 06:53 AM

a note from the above post, we also count the sea spots between the golden sea, and whatever that is next to it as 1 space as to not have to waste another move order for moving through a sea space that does nothing.






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