Jump to content



Photo

Finishing moves


  • Please log in to reply
15 replies to this topic

#1 Baradiel

Baradiel

    Member

  • Members
  • 188 posts

Posted 27 August 2011 - 01:10 PM

Ok, so I am sure we all played the Space Marine Demo by now.  I love how you gain health.

So I was thinking about using the following dynamic to adapt that idea into Deathwatch

Solo Ability:  Wrath of the Emperor's Chosen
Minimum Rank:1

When an enemy is reduced to zero or less health, the player may opt to invoke this power.  The enemy must be a significant challenge to the character (up to GM).  Doing so is a full action, and the player rolls to hit with Weapon Skill at -20.  As long as one point of damage is done, the enemy is killed.  Also, the player must suitably describe how his character is impressively ending his enemy's life.  Doing so causes the character to regain a fate point.  This may be done once per combat.



#2 Control

Control

    Member

  • Members
  • 33 posts

Posted 28 August 2011 - 09:39 AM

Regaining a fate point seems way too good, especially since a -20 WS test is practically nothing for any marine worth his salt in CQC.  Maybe they could just heal 1d5 wounds instead? It would reflect much better to the origin of the idea as well. They could even be temporary wounds to represent how the faith in themselves and the God Emperor has been reinforced.



#3 Baradiel

Baradiel

    Member

  • Members
  • 188 posts

Posted 28 August 2011 - 11:38 AM

 

Thing is, this gives me an excuse to throw even more nasty stuff at them.  But yeah, might go with just regaining D5.



#4 Kasatka

Kasatka

    Member

  • Members
  • 1,063 posts

Posted 31 August 2011 - 01:15 AM

 What about regaining cohesion, even above and beyond what is normally the max for the Kill-Team?

Justification could be the unit having worked well as a group to bring down a mighty foe, and the morale boost of one of it's number slaying a mighty foe improving their group dynamic and efficiency?


Only the insane have strength enough to prosper.

Only those that prosper may truly judge what is sane.


#5 Control

Control

    Member

  • Members
  • 33 posts

Posted 31 August 2011 - 03:24 AM

But the whole point of a finishing move is to show how awesome you are, not your group. If it was a tag team style take-down then I could see it working.



#6 Kasatka

Kasatka

    Member

  • Members
  • 1,063 posts

Posted 31 August 2011 - 09:18 PM

Control said:

But the whole point of a finishing move is to show how awesome you are, not your group. If it was a tag team style take-down then I could see it working.

And that is just out of character for marines.


Only the insane have strength enough to prosper.

Only those that prosper may truly judge what is sane.


#7 cogollo

cogollo

    Member

  • Members
  • 282 posts

Posted 06 September 2011 - 09:05 AM

Instead of regaining a Fate Point, you can have the Space Marine recover 1d5 Wounds... In the Space Marine Demo (the game is great, btw) you regain some life when you kill a stunned opponent.


JL


Hur-Nir ran to the aid of the beaten man, recovering in the process a handful of pennies the thugs had let fall in the man's boots during their hasty retreat. - from Nulner Blues campaign

 


#8 Narkasis Broon

Narkasis Broon

    Member

  • Members
  • 252 posts

Posted 07 September 2011 - 01:48 AM

Kasatka said:

Control said:

 

But the whole point of a finishing move is to show how awesome you are, not your group. If it was a tag team style take-down then I could see it working.

 

 

And that is just out of character for marines.

Space Wolves are forever trying to best one another in single combat, the only reason that the fenrisians respect the Emperor is because he beat Russ in single combat (and some other trials, but that is the important one :P) I can also think of pre heresy emperor's children and luna wolves sparring over who is the better in single combat, though admittedly both of those legions did turn out to be nuts



#9 Ten Tigers

Ten Tigers

    Member

  • Members
  • 13 posts

Posted 22 September 2011 - 07:49 PM

 

Okay, I am new to this game so take my suggestion with a grain of salt...

Talent Name: Death's Vigor

Prerequisite: Adeptus Astartes, All Out Attack

Benefit: When a character drops an opponent to 0 hit points or less with an All Out Attack, the player makes a contested Weapon Skill test (including the bonus from All Out Attack) against his enemy. If successful, the enemy is immediately slain and the Space Marine instantly recovers his rank plus will power bonus in non-critical hit point damage. At rank 5 the Space Marine also recovers one fatigue point.

 

 

No fate points. No limitations. At rank 1 you'll be recovering between 5 or 6 points per execution and by rank 8 you'll be recovering anywhere from 12 to 14 points per execution and recovering one fatigue point. I'm no expert with this system but that sounds fairly balanced for what it is and captures the feel of the videogame's execution system. Just like the game this ability leaves you vulnerable to continued damage from anyone still in melee or ranged combat with you as you can no longer parry or dodge.

I just have no idea what xp value to assign this talent.



#10 N0-1_H3r3

N0-1_H3r3

    Former Contributing Freelance Writer

  • Members
  • 3,306 posts

Posted 23 September 2011 - 12:01 AM

Ten Tigers said:

 

Okay, I am new to this game so take my suggestion with a grain of salt...

Talent Name: Death's Vigor

Prerequisite: Adeptus Astartes, All Out Attack

Benefit: When a character drops an opponent to 0 hit points or less with an All Out Attack, the player makes a contested Weapon Skill test (including the bonus from All Out Attack) against his enemy. If successful, the enemy is immediately slain and the Space Marine instantly recovers his rank plus will power bonus in non-critical hit point damage. At rank 5 the Space Marine also recovers one fatigue point.

 

 

No fate points. No limitations. At rank 1 you'll be recovering between 5 or 6 points per execution and by rank 8 you'll be recovering anywhere from 12 to 14 points per execution and recovering one fatigue point. I'm no expert with this system but that sounds fairly balanced for what it is and captures the feel of the videogame's execution system. Just like the game this ability leaves you vulnerable to continued damage from anyone still in melee or ranged combat with you as you can no longer parry or dodge.

I just have no idea what xp value to assign this talent.

Couple of comments - first, All-Out Attack is a combat action that everyone can do, so you don't need to list it as a prerequisite.

Secondly, this might perhaps be better-suited to being a Solo Mode ability rather than a talent. I've not got time to write up an example now, but I'll try to get round to it later today.


Writing Credits for Fantasy Flight Games: Into the Storm, Edge of the Abyss, Battlefleet Koronus, Hostile Acquisitions, Black Crusade Core Rulebook, First Founding, The Jericho Reach, The Soul Reaver, Only War, The Navis Primer and Ark of Lost Souls


#11 Ten Tigers

Ten Tigers

    Member

  • Members
  • 13 posts

Posted 23 September 2011 - 01:16 AM

The only reason I didn't write it up as a Solo Ability is those tend to be "once per X" abilities. I don't know if you've played Warhammer 40,000: Space Marine, but in that game the execution moves the OP was talking about can be used repeatedly. You put yourself at risk when you use them because executions do not render you invincible in the game. It is easy to continue to take more damage than health you receive if you commit to one at the wrong moment... Those were the primary attributes I was trying to convey.

Also, this strikes me as more of a non-exclusive heroic ability. It also feels like something any marine can have access to but not something every marine has access to. Does that make sense?



#12 N0-1_H3r3

N0-1_H3r3

    Former Contributing Freelance Writer

  • Members
  • 3,306 posts

Posted 23 September 2011 - 06:25 AM

Ten Tigers said:

The only reason I didn't write it up as a Solo Ability is those tend to be "once per X" abilities. I don't know if you've played Warhammer 40,000: Space Marine, but in that game the execution moves the OP was talking about can be used repeatedly. You put yourself at risk when you use them because executions do not render you invincible in the game. It is easy to continue to take more damage than health you receive if you commit to one at the wrong moment... Those were the primary attributes I was trying to convey.

Also, this strikes me as more of a non-exclusive heroic ability. It also feels like something any marine can have access to but not something every marine has access to. Does that make sense?

I can see your reasoning, though obviously I have my own preferences in this regard.  A once-per-combat Solo Mode ability (gained at Rank 3, and improving at Ranks 5 and 7) seems to strike a decent balance, IMO, given that the dynamics of combat in Deathwatch are still different to those in Space Marine - afterall, in Space Marine, it's the only way to regain health, while it would serve as one additional method amongst several in Deathwatch.

As an additional consideration, if you wanted to bring across more of the 'feel' of Space Marine, I'd suggest trying to implement a system mimicking the game's Fury Mode, allowing a character's accumulated kills to contribute to a renewable resource, allowing him to use Solo Mode abilities more often or gain other short-term bonuses.


Writing Credits for Fantasy Flight Games: Into the Storm, Edge of the Abyss, Battlefleet Koronus, Hostile Acquisitions, Black Crusade Core Rulebook, First Founding, The Jericho Reach, The Soul Reaver, Only War, The Navis Primer and Ark of Lost Souls


#13 Ten Tigers

Ten Tigers

    Member

  • Members
  • 13 posts

Posted 23 September 2011 - 10:02 AM

N0-1_H3r3 said:

Ten Tigers said:

 

The only reason I didn't write it up as a Solo Ability is those tend to be "once per X" abilities. I don't know if you've played Warhammer 40,000: Space Marine, but in that game the execution moves the OP was talking about can be used repeatedly. You put yourself at risk when you use them because executions do not render you invincible in the game. It is easy to continue to take more damage than health you receive if you commit to one at the wrong moment... Those were the primary attributes I was trying to convey.

Also, this strikes me as more of a non-exclusive heroic ability. It also feels like something any marine can have access to but not something every marine has access to. Does that make sense?

 

 

I can see your reasoning, though obviously I have my own preferences in this regard.  A once-per-combat Solo Mode ability (gained at Rank 3, and improving at Ranks 5 and 7) seems to strike a decent balance, IMO, given that the dynamics of combat in Deathwatch are still different to those in Space Marine - afterall, in Space Marine, it's the only way to regain health, while it would serve as one additional method amongst several in Deathwatch.

As an additional consideration, if you wanted to bring across more of the 'feel' of Space Marine, I'd suggest trying to implement a system mimicking the game's Fury Mode, allowing a character's accumulated kills to contribute to a renewable resource, allowing him to use Solo Mode abilities more often or gain other short-term bonuses.

Were I working that out with a GM I guess that would be reasonable. I would just want the amount of health to be more significant that what I came up with.

Ahh, Fury Mode... To bring it in line with the videogame THAT is something I'd rig as a solo ability. Once per combat you when you spend a Fate Point it's bonuses apply to any and all combat rolls for the duration of the player's turn. Gain it at rank 3 and the duration increases one turn at rank 5 & 7.



#14 Siranui

Siranui

    Member

  • Members
  • 1,717 posts

Posted 23 November 2011 - 12:06 AM

 Solo mode rules or special Talents seem a bit too faffy for my liking. And slowing down everyone's game for opposed WS checks is not sometihng I'd do.

I'd simply say:

You must be in Solo Mode and already in combat with the foe (who must be an Elite or better). Lose your Reactions and all additional attacks to make a single attack at -20. If you succeed, and take down your foe, you get back a single Wound.

Losing other attacks and reactions means that players won't be keen to do this too often, and that it should actually speed up the end of a fight, rather than slow it down.



#15 WittyDroog

WittyDroog

    Member

  • Members
  • 211 posts

Posted 23 December 2011 - 12:15 AM

 I'd agree with regain cohesion, not wounds. By performing a flourish you are invigorated, but you don't magically heal bullet wounds. It works in Space Marine because its a video game and there's no heal skill. Would you suggest that Deathwatch Marines can also heal up to full by just staying put for a couple seconds?

 

By granting cohesion, you are saying that the Marine feels rejuvenated and stronger of will, which is very important to cohesion and the opposite of cohesion damaging effects that break your will. Its not about your team getting a reward for your actions, its that you are rewarded with better ability to help your team.



#16 Arguyle

Arguyle

    Member

  • Members
  • 87 posts

Posted 01 January 2012 - 01:35 AM

SOLO MODE : Wrath of the Emperor's Chosen (kept your name hope thats ok)
 

the Adeptus Astartes are the finest warriors of the Imperium and are more than willing to show it to those foolish enough todare oppose the emperor. Once per combat the battle bother may attempt an assination of an equivlent (or better) foe whos wounds have dropped below its toughness bonus after adjustment for unnatural statsitic. this strike is in the place of a standard attack that cannot be dodged or parried, no damage is rolled however a relevant ability test(WS/BS/S/AG) is requirerd (type decided by gm and role playing of the kill). the target must pass an toughness test with no modfication from unnatural statistic with a penalty equal to the battle brothers degress of success on the skill test (in groups of -10, i.e. if the battle brother gets 3 degress of success on his agility test then the carnifex suffers a -30) , if the battle brother is a Death Watch Champion or weilding a toxic weapon (that the enemy is vunerable to) this test receives a further penalty of -10(stacks to a max of -20).   Successfull assinations yeild 1d5 wounds recovered and the battle brothers  rank in fatigue is removed.  finnally the kill adds .25(in all cases round down) coheision per battle brother that saw the glorious kil(in LoS), this amount may not exceed the cohesion cap, further if the kill is a stolen kill, then it may cause coheision damage in the same amount or other party strife at the gms discresion. 
 

this ability improves at rank 4  to .5 coheison per battle brother  in LoS and the heal improves to 1d5+ rank/2. at rank 7 1 coheision per battle brother in LoS and the heal improbes to 1d5+rank further this ability may now be used TWICE per combat.

failure to connect should result in the attack/ability being spent. if the target passes the toughness test it will become invigorated seizing the innitative by taking a turn immedately and gaining wounds equal to the total of the battle brother attempting the attack, not to excceed its starting total.

tried do a full write up like a book to add legitimacy. let me know what you think. 

 

 

witty i dont know how your table plays out but at mine theres been a consistent problem of under whelming or extreme hits on the players forcing a "just hide till anything with a good gun is dead" attitude. this solo mode i think will help the flow of wounds stay favorable toward the players and encourage them to engage in more ways than "get behind that rock and spray bolt rounds at the big guy!"






© 2013 Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc. Fantasy Flight Games and the FFG logo are ® of Fantasy Flight Publishing, Inc.  All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Contact | User Support | Rules Questions | Help | RSS