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Spell and Red and Yellow dice?


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#1 grouik

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Posted 16 August 2011 - 04:08 AM

Hello,

 

do yuo think you can put Red or Yellow Dice on a Spell to keep for another player?

Because on the rules it is clear : Each die added by either a Common or Unique Item remains in
the pool until it is set aside after failing to complete a task or it
is used to complete a task. In any event, the die is removed from
the dice pool at the end of the active player’s turn.

But with a spell : A die may remain on a Spell card for any number of turns
before being used. The active player may always use a die on a
Spell card to complete a task regardless of who played the Spell.

Any ideas?



#2 pumpkin

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Posted 16 August 2011 - 04:43 AM

grouik said:

Hello,

 

do yuo think you can put Red or Yellow Dice on a Spell to keep for another player?

Because on the rules it is clear : Each die added by either a Common or Unique Item remains in
the pool until it is set aside after failing to complete a task or it
is used to complete a task. In any event, the die is removed from
the dice pool at the end of the active player’s turn.

But with a spell : A die may remain on a Spell card for any number of turns
before being used. The active player may always use a die on a
Spell card to complete a task regardless of who played the Spell.

Any ideas?

I think by the rules, this is valid, and it's similar to my thread on dice proxys.

I think the response to that is a sound one though and the theory is that yes you can put red/yellow dice onto a spell, but the number of red/yellow dice provided with the game is an inherent limit, so while that die is on a spell, an item (for example) that granted use of that same colour die could not be played until that spell was used...

This must surely be the case, otherwise from looking at the rules, you could easily end up needing to roll many red/yellow dice, yet having the single die provided with the game tied up on either a task card, or a spell (or even via focusing or assisting)

 

 



#3 grouik

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Posted 16 August 2011 - 06:10 PM

Yes I understand the question was more that you could not keep a red or yallow die from one round to the next.



#4 Deprivo Deviante

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Posted 09 October 2011 - 01:48 AM

The description of Spells (page 10) says that the dice "may" remain, which is conditional. It may remain, and it may not.

The description of the red dice (page 9) is not conditional. The die "is" removed from the dice pool at the end of the active players turn.

So, during your turn you can play a card that lets you roll the red die, and play a spell. After rolling, you can then put the red die on the spell to use in a later test in the same turn, but at the end of the turn the red die is removed and the spell goes away.

That would be my way of interpreting the rules. It makes the red and yellow die useable for only the active player, which seems to be the intention.

However, if you don't like that, how about this house rule. You can store the red or yellow dice on a spell, but in order to use their result on a later players turn, the active player has to use the appropriate card to add the die to their dice pool.

So player A would play a Unique Item, and a Spell Card, then rolls, and puts the Red Die on the Spell. Completes or fails the tasks and play passes to player B. In order for player B to use the Red Die result in their turn, they also have to play a Unique Item card, putting the Red Die into their Die Pool.

But I would say that the rule book isn't clear on the interaction between red and yellow dice and Spells.



#5 Avi_dreader

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Posted 12 October 2011 - 09:23 AM

Deprivo Deviante said:

The description of Spells (page 10) says that the dice "may" remain, which is conditional. It may remain, and it may not.

The description of the red dice (page 9) is not conditional. The die "is" removed from the dice pool at the end of the active players turn.

So, during your turn you can play a card that lets you roll the red die, and play a spell. After rolling, you can then put the red die on the spell to use in a later test in the same turn, but at the end of the turn the red die is removed and the spell goes away.

That would be my way of interpreting the rules. It makes the red and yellow die useable for only the active player, which seems to be the intention.

However, if you don't like that, how about this house rule. You can store the red or yellow dice on a spell, but in order to use their result on a later players turn, the active player has to use the appropriate card to add the die to their dice pool.

So player A would play a Unique Item, and a Spell Card, then rolls, and puts the Red Die on the Spell. Completes or fails the tasks and play passes to player B. In order for player B to use the Red Die result in their turn, they also have to play a Unique Item card, putting the Red Die into their Die Pool.

But I would say that the rule book isn't clear on the interaction between red and yellow dice and Spells.

I would add that that would make the red die lock card not work...  So...  I'd be inclined to assume that you can't store yellow and red die results on spells.



#6 Byga

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Posted 12 October 2011 - 08:26 PM

My interpretation on this (based on the wording used around in the manual) is that with "dice pool" it is intended the dice available to the player to roll.

So when a die is put on a spell (or on focus or assist but in this case it can be stored only until a success/failure in the active player's turn) it's removed from the dice pool: indeed, while the stored (unchangeable) result remains available, you can't reroll it again by any means. Until it's used by someone the die stay there which can be an advantage or a disadvantage: in effect you have a "soft locked" die, so it all depends on the tasks available on the adventure cards in play (Think to the adventures with arrows forcing the order of task solving: they tend to show up too much in my games ) .

But I think this it's correct with spell nature in Mythos settings: they give you power, but always at your own risk and with a cost, the more you ask, the more you pay!

As per Avi's concern manual under Locked Die Icon section (p 11) states: "...He must place the die on that icon even if the die was on a Spell card or Investigator marker but he cannot move a die that is already locked on another card or marker..."

As usual the Mythos powers don't think twice before to take back what they gave to you if this fit their purposes...

 

 

 






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