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Legends rules?


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#1 Mestrahd

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Posted 18 June 2011 - 05:04 AM

I haven't gotten my copy of the Legends expansion yet, although I'm drooling for it. Is there a rule insert of any kind in there?

My question is, do Legends count as Units? Based on the wording of Warhounds "reveal a Legend or unit", they would appear to be 2 separate card types. Also, it would really suck to lose your Legend from one of the thousand unit removal cards. Of course that means they wouldn't get any beneficial effects either, but they hardly need them.



#2 Titan

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Posted 18 June 2011 - 10:32 AM

Having received mine yesterday, I can tell you that there is a rule insert. To quote " Legends are their own card type and are not affected by card effects that target unit, support, or tactic cards."
 
Therefore, unit removal cards do not affect legends. And, in fact, there aren't any legend removal cards on this expansion. Once they're in play, they are there for good, unless they are defeated in combat. Not even the controlling player can remove his own legend from play. If anyone can think of any effect I missed, I'm sure they'll correct me.



#3 Mestrahd

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Posted 18 June 2011 - 01:29 PM

Thank you. That makes a lot of sense.



#4 Doc9

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Posted 18 June 2011 - 01:37 PM

What I would like to know is, does a Legend defend a zone only if the Legend is being attacked directly? Or, does a Legend defend a zone even if it is the capital being attacked and not the Legend?



#5 Nate Holmes

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Posted 18 June 2011 - 11:48 PM

Doc9 said:

What I would like to know is, does a Legend defend a zone only if the Legend is being attacked directly? Or, does a Legend defend a zone even if it is the capital being attacked and not the Legend?

This is somthing that isnt explained very well in the rules, we read it through several times and still couldnt find the answer



#6 Titan

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 04:27 AM

Doc9 said:

What I would like to know is, does a Legend defend a zone only if the Legend is being attacked directly? Or, does a Legend defend a zone even if it is the capital being attacked and not the Legend?


 

The very last paragraph in the insert says: "Also, it is important to note that a defending legend contributes the power it has (as damage) in the zone to the battle."

I take this to mean that a legend could use whatever power he has in that zone not only to defend himself but to defend the capital if the player so chooses. But that's only my take and it may not mean so.
 

I have some questions myself that were not addressed. For example if a player attacks a legend, kills any defending units and kills the legend itself, what happens to any leftover damage? It is assigned to the section of the capital he attacked through? Or is it ignored? 

Can a legend be attacked through a burning zone? I guess it can, since there is nothing in the rules saying a player cannot attack a burning zone, there simply is no point in doing so without a legend. If this is the case, I assume leftover damage is ignored since the zone is already burning.
 

Can indirect damage be assigned to a legend? It would make sense if you could, but the rules only specify units and sections of a capital as targets for it. This may be outdated, as it was probably written before legends were conceived, but it is a valid question. 

I've sent the first two questions to FFG and will post any answers I receive.



#7 Entropy42

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 08:08 AM

I can tell you for sure that the leftover damage when attacking a Legend does not go onto the capital.  I'm not going to bother to look up the other stuff since I'm sure Lukas will get back to you with official answers quickly anyway.



#8 Budmilka_fr

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 08:54 AM

By the way, I have a quick question about legends and Counterstrike.

When a legend attacks and my opponent defends with unit(s) with Counterstrike, does this keyword affect the legend ? The rules says that legends can deal and receive combat damage just like units but cannot be targeted by card effects who targets units. Counterstrike doesn't target, and it is a card effect with the exception that it deals combat damage. So I think Counterstrike works on attacking legends.

Am I right ? Thanks.



#9 Entropy42

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Posted 19 June 2011 - 11:31 AM

That sounds right to me.  I see no reason it wouldn't work against Legends.  The rules even specify "attacker" rather than "attacking unit".



#10 Titan

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Posted 21 June 2011 - 02:40 AM

For anyone interested, here's Lukas Litzsinger"s answers to a couple of my questions: "Whenever a legend is attacked and destroyed, any excess damage will not be assigned to that zone or anywhere else. It is ignored just like any damage that is assigned to an already burning zone. You can also attack a legend through a burning zone."

I've also sent in the question about indirect damage and will post that answer, as well.



#11 saldo

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Posted 21 June 2011 - 02:42 PM

Any response on if a Legend can defend the capitol?  If not being attacked directly.



#12 Titan

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Posted 22 June 2011 - 08:12 AM

Another small addition, Lukas has ruled that legends can indeed be designated as recipients for indirect damage.



#13 Entropy42

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Posted 22 June 2011 - 09:13 AM

Good info in here, putting it up in the Rules Summary.



#14 saldo

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Posted 22 June 2011 - 01:18 PM

Got a response from Lukas and legends cannot defend a capitol.  They only defend an attack on them.



#15 tako

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Posted 23 June 2011 - 08:24 PM

Noob here, let me try to understand this:

For attack, Legends behave like units, can attack opponents zone or a Legend through a zone and contribute the power icons they have 'mapped' to the battlefield (upper part of the Legend card). Defending units can assign damage to an attacking Legend just like they would assign it to an attacking unit, i.e. it is not necessary to assign enough damage to other attacking units first before a defender can assign damage to a Legend.

In defense, Legends can only defend when they are attacked directly (i.e. in lieu of a zone).  They cannot defend a zone (only themselves). Legends contribute the power icons 'mapped' to the zone through which they are attacked to assign to the attackers. Attacking units need to assign enough damage to defending 'frontline' units guarding the zone before any damage can be assigned to a Legend. Excess damage assigned to Legends does not spill over into the zone through which they were attacked.

Is this correct?

 

 



#16 Mouse_PL

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 12:44 AM

tako said:

Noob here, let me try to understand this:

For attack, Legends behave like units, can attack opponents zone or a Legend through a zone and contribute the power icons they have 'mapped' to the battlefield (upper part of the Legend card). Defending units can assign damage to an attacking Legend just like they would assign it to an attacking unit, i.e. it is not necessary to assign enough damage to other attacking units first before a defender can assign damage to a Legend.

In defense, Legends can only defend when they are attacked directly (i.e. in lieu of a zone).  They cannot defend a zone (only themselves). Legends contribute the power icons 'mapped' to the zone through which they are attacked to assign to the attackers. Attacking units need to assign enough damage to defending 'frontline' units guarding the zone before any damage can be assigned to a Legend. Excess damage assigned to Legends does not spill over into the zone through which they were attacked.

Is this correct?

 

 

Noob ? self-esteem problems ? ;)

Yes, you are correct.

Legends also contribiute power to zones wich affects your resources and amount of cards you draw. You can only field a legend on capitol that matches its race.



#17 tako

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Posted 27 June 2011 - 05:56 PM

yes, still a noob with less than 10 games under the belly. Difficult to find players here in JP...



#18 Mestrahd

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 04:37 AM

I had a thought.

How does Tyrion interact with units like Dreamer of Dragons and Thyrus Gorman? Since they say "take damage" would it still be redirected by Tyrion? Because at some point that taken damage gets dealt. And If it does get redirected, in the case of DoD, is it still uncancellable at the other end, to be usable against Toughness units? And how would DoD's power work with that? Would she get 2 power for only 1 damage?

Of course, if "taken" damage isn't considered "dealt" then render the rest of the questions moot. I guess I'm just hoping for a favorable answer for a deck idea.



#19 Entropy42

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 06:10 AM

"Take damage" doesn't mean anything special in W:I.  It generally indicates something is damaging itself, but even that is not always true.

However, if you redirect damage, then that damage is not dealt (or taken), and won't trigger abilities that key on damage dealt.

As for redirecting uncancellable damage, I would suspect its still uncancellable, though I've never seen that question before.  Combat damage remains combat damage, even after being redirected, so I would assume uncancellable damage maintains its type as well.



#20 Mestrahd

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 08:25 AM

So basically, you're saying I could use Tyrion to keep Thyrus around indefinitely and use self-damaging characters as a free one-point of direct damage per turn. It's just that any abilities like gaining power/counterstrike and destroying attachments would not trigger off the redirected damage.

Thank you. I'll work on the deck today!






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