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#1 Mestrahd

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 01:35 PM

So, the other day I played a few games with the decks from "4 decks from core x2" on cardgamedb.com and I have some issues before I start investing myself.

I noticed that once you get a lead, either in character count, hand size or power, it's very hard to come back from that. The game seems to flow downhill so to speak with the rich getting richer.

In one game, Baratheon vs Targaryen, the Bara player was down in character count 4-2 so used Valar Morghulis as his plot, but quickly found himself down 2-1 with the low income on that card. The Targ player just used both his characters to military challenge, producing a lock basically, as Targ's board could grow, but Bara's was limited to one or two with most characters costing 3 or 4. The final score was 15-0.

I did have a close game Lannister vs Stark, with Stark winning 16-13, but only 8 of their power was on the house. Eddard and Jon Snow made up the rest.

I think one of the biggest culprits is how the game determines initiative. It seems the more powerful the plot effect, the lower the init number. So one person (Joust) could have control of initiative most of the game if the other is playing those power plots. I haven't seen any cards that manipulate the init number but I'm sure they must have them.

So I guess my concern is, if I start buying into this game, am I going to find that most games end up with one side steamrolling the other like my Bara/Targ game, or is there actually parity like the Lanni/Stark game? It's entirely possible I missed some key rule(s) but I think I played pretty close to them. I'm primarily interested in 2-player action, but like the idea of multiplayer being better.

So, any opinions on the Joust capability would be appreciated. I know it's technically a "variant" of the game rules, but many people have recommended AGOT over W:I as a better 2-player game.



#2 Darksbane

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 02:14 PM

Mestrahd said:

So, the other day I played a few games with the decks from "4 decks from core x2" on cardgamedb.com and I have some issues before I start investing myself.

I noticed that once you get a lead, either in character count, hand size or power, it's very hard to come back from that. The game seems to flow downhill so to speak with the rich getting richer.

In one game, Baratheon vs Targaryen, the Bara player was down in character count 4-2 so used Valar Morghulis as his plot, but quickly found himself down 2-1 with the low income on that card. The Targ player just used both his characters to military challenge, producing a lock basically, as Targ's board could grow, but Bara's was limited to one or two with most characters costing 3 or 4. The final score was 15-0.

I did have a close game Lannister vs Stark, with Stark winning 16-13, but only 8 of their power was on the house. Eddard and Jon Snow made up the rest.

I think one of the biggest culprits is how the game determines initiative. It seems the more powerful the plot effect, the lower the init number. So one person (Joust) could have control of initiative most of the game if the other is playing those power plots. I haven't seen any cards that manipulate the init number but I'm sure they must have them.

So I guess my concern is, if I start buying into this game, am I going to find that most games end up with one side steamrolling the other like my Bara/Targ game, or is there actually parity like the Lanni/Stark game? It's entirely possible I missed some key rule(s) but I think I played pretty close to them. I'm primarily interested in 2-player action, but like the idea of multiplayer being better.

So, any opinions on the Joust capability would be appreciated. I know it's technically a "variant" of the game rules, but many people have recommended AGOT over W:I as a better 2-player game.

 

Well like with any game with this amount of player interaction and randomness in them you are going to have games where it is close and where one person just kind of runs away with it. It is similar in MtG and Warhammer if you draw dead or mistime your plays or the other player just gets really lucky then blowouts can happen. I can say they are not the norm and there is normally a good give and take in the game. Moreso in multiplayer, but plenty in well built joust decks. The 2x core decks definately have some limitiations by the small card pool though so keep that in mind when playing them. Valar can be a risky move too, ideally you want to time it when you have little to lose or you see your opponent will have a hard time recovering (due to lack of cards in hand or to you having a large resource pool and full hand or you having the ability to save a number of characters).

As to the Stark vs Lanny it isn't uncommon for quite a bit of your power to be on characters. Especally in Baratheon decks.

Initiative is part of the strategy too. Since you build your plot deck you have to balance gold vs initiative vs claim vs effect text to see what matters most to your deck.


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#3 Mestrahd

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 02:50 PM

I was actually hoping you might respond Darksbane, since I'm using your build lists.

I'm glad to hear that most games are a give and take. So far, two of my three games were blowouts, but I know for a fact I was playing the first one wrong. I'm certainly still willing to give it a chance. It's good to hear there's more parity with an increased card pool as well.



#4 Toqtamish

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Posted 23 May 2011 - 03:12 PM

I am surprised Bara lost in your game. My Bara always win. I won a game in two turns with my Asshai deck in a 3 player game. Bara have an easy time getting power fast, however as it is mostly on their characters with renown it does leave them vulnerable to kill effects which Targ is good at.



#5 Darksbane

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Posted 24 May 2011 - 04:08 AM

 Yeah Toqtamish, I agree.

Mestrahd, usually when playing the houses if there is going to be a quick blowout type of game Baratheon is the one doing it. They are typically the "rush" house, and with luck they can win turn 2 sometimes or turn 3 quite a bit. The core set cards aren't quite that fast but they still can grab alot of power very quickly. It can be hard for their rush builds to pull through in the long game since if they don't get the win early they tend to peter out and can't keep up the pressure. 


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