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Rule Precedence for Dark Pharoah


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#1 joebelanger

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Posted 04 January 2009 - 03:11 AM

Which takes precedence when playing with the Curse of the Dark Pharoah expansion: the monster limit or the Dark Pharoah Mythos cards asking to bring in a grip of monsters for one turn only?



#2 ColtsFan76

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Posted 04 January 2009 - 06:49 AM

I am not sure any cards bring monsters in for only a short while. I think you may be referring to cards that ask you to draw up to X amount of monsters, such as "Strange Ornithological Sightings," "Museum Haunted," and "Escape from Arkham Asylum!." 

All of these cards bring in monsters and have an effect that is limited - such as a reward for defeating the monsters - but the monsters themselves are not limited.  Once they are on the board, they stay on the board.  So they would affect the Monster Limits.

If I am overlooking a card, please let me know.



#3 joebelanger

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Posted 05 January 2009 - 01:37 AM

So if you're already at your monster limit, these cards would send the reward fodder directly to the outskirts?



#4 Tibs

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Posted 05 January 2009 - 02:27 AM

Yup. If you can't put all three Maniacs into the street with the Escape from Arkham Asylum headline, then there's pretty much no way to get the Exhibit item reward. Other expansions have probably introduced spells or items that can "defeat" monsters in the outskirts, but I can't think of any off the top of my head. Just keep the board free of monsters if you want the reward.

On the other hand, with the Ghost headline, you get an item for each Ghost you kill, so it's okay if one gets sent to the Outskirts.



#5 MrsGamura

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Posted 05 January 2009 - 04:52 AM

 Don't forget that thse Mythos cards remove the monsters after the next turn. So I always place them on the board regarless of montser limit due to this fact.

Allot of the the cards in CotDP are poorley worded so this could be the right way.

Note: The one that deals with flying monster leaves them there so I would count those monster towards the limit. Plus no reward for killing them.



#6 jhaelen

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Posted 05 January 2009 - 07:53 AM

MrsGamura said:

 Don't forget that thse Mythos cards remove the monsters after the next turn. So I always place them on the board regarless of montser limit due to this fact.
That's the way I've been playing them as well. The cards make more sense if these monsters are ignored when calculating the monster limit.



#7 joebelanger

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Posted 05 January 2009 - 10:24 AM

Thank you.  That's what I wanted to know.  Is the Monster Limit the ultimate line of demarkation iregarding monsters on the board or do these cards with their limited duration superscede the Monster Limit.  Thanks everyone.



#8 ColtsFan76

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Posted 05 January 2009 - 02:58 PM

MrsGamura said:

 Don't forget that thse Mythos cards remove the monsters after the next turn. So I always place them on the board regarless of montser limit due to this fact.

Allot of the the cards in CotDP are poorley worded so this could be the right way.

Note: The one that deals with flying monster leaves them there so I would count those monster towards the limit. Plus no reward for killing them.

No, I don't think these Mythos cards remove the monsters.  They remove the reward for beating them.  The monsters stay on the board and count against the limit.



#9 joebelanger

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Posted 06 January 2009 - 02:37 AM

There seems to be some confusion.  Is there a way to get a definitive answer?  From the rules, FAQ or someone attached to the design of the game?



#10 Tibs

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Posted 06 January 2009 - 03:20 AM

Probably. I'm sure a few of us have submitted this question before. However, I would play along with ColtsFan—there is no game precedent elsewhere or any reason to assume that the monsters leave the board on their own. All that expires is your opportunity to claim the prizes.



#11 MrsGamura

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Posted 06 January 2009 - 10:45 AM

ColtsFan76 said:

 

MrsGamura said:

 

 Don't forget that thse Mythos cards remove the monsters after the next turn. So I always place them on the board regarless of montser limit due to this fact.

Allot of the the cards in CotDP are poorley worded so this could be the right way.

Note: The one that deals with flying monster leaves them there so I would count those monster towards the limit. Plus no reward for killing them.

 

 

No, I don't think these Mythos cards remove the monsters.  They remove the reward for beating them.  The monsters stay on the board and count against the limit.

 

 

Your right they explenacy (no idea how to spell this word and my comp spell check can't even help me) do not say to remove the Monsters but they hint at it with this leave this card in play until then to indicate this.

Similar to how River Breaches the Levees hints that the Exhibit items are removed from the streets if it leaves play.

How do you guys play Plague of Insects and River Breaches the Levees? Only confusion they give me is with these lines Investigators that end their turns and end his turn there. I've been playing it as end you movement there.

 

 

 



#12 ColtsFan76

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Posted 06 January 2009 - 01:43 PM

MrsGamura said:

 

Your right they explenacy (no idea how to spell this word and my comp spell check can't even help me) do not say to remove the Monsters but they hint at it with this leave this card in play until then to indicate this.

Similar to how River Breaches the Levees hints that the Exhibit items are removed from the streets if it leaves play.

How do you guys play Plague of Insects and River Breaches the Levees? Only confusion they give me is with these lines Investigators that end their turns and end his turn there. I've been playing it as end you movement there.

 

Explicitly?  I think that was what you are trying to say and I am not sure I spelled it right either! 

The precedence is to leave monsters on the board.  Only the "A monster appears" allows for a monster to disappear after the fact.  Everything else places monsters and then the Mythos card goes away (think of all those Headlines that place 2 monsters in some street area as an example).  (Well, another exception is the Rumor cards but those don't usually place monsters on the board but instead on the card itself).

The "keep this card in play until the end of this turn" are part of a separate paragraph and link directly back to the "reward" of the mythos card.  So they dump monsters, then then give you a limited amount of time to collect a bonus for disposing of them, and then the reward goes away while the monsters remain.

As to the other questions, I hate getting into CotDP discussions: no won ever wins.  That's why I wish they would heavily edit it and release a version 2.

River Breaches the Levees - This is an environment card and it only lasts until the next environment comes out.  Some feel it was mislabelled and was probably intended to be a headline that only lasts for the turn.  There is also debate about what it means to take the Items.  Some say the first player grabs 1 and the other disappears.  Some think you are the first to either location and get both.  Others believe that the first to each location gets that respective item.  So even this card has ambiguity. 

"Ending your turn" is assumed that it is moving but it also might mean whoever stays there until the end of Phase 5.  We play that it means end of movement as that makes the most sense to us.  In addition, most other cards that are similar to this all have "end his/their movement" as the key phrase.

 



#13 joebelanger

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Posted 07 January 2009 - 01:26 AM

ColtsFan76 said:

Only the "A monster appears" allows for a monster to disappear after the fact. 

Doesn't that only apply in the Other Worlds?



#14 Tibs

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Posted 07 January 2009 - 02:50 AM

joebelanger said:

 

ColtsFan76 said:

 

Only the "A monster appears" allows for a monster to disappear after the fact. 

 

 

Doesn't that only apply in the Other Worlds?

 

 

Both Other Worlds and Arkham Encounters. But this effect only occurs during encounters. The rulebook does say that the monsters do not remain unless you claim them as trophies. Therefore this is the only way that you should assume that a new monster disappears, unless specifically told so. Escape from Arkham Asylum! and Museum Haunted do not say or imply that the monsters are removed.



#15 MrsGamura

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Posted 07 January 2009 - 05:38 AM

There is a exception to that rule "A Gate and Monster" appear. The monster stays!



#16 Tibs

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Posted 07 January 2009 - 07:05 AM

MrsGamura said:

There is a exception to that rule "A Gate and Monster" appear. The monster stays!

Good call. Though you don't actually fight the monster immediately, as is the case with the other encounters.






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