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DOOM 4 coming out for PC


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#1 Interceptor

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Posted 14 November 2010 - 10:00 AM

I read in this month's issue of Gamepro that ID Software is actually in the production stages of DOOM 4.  I thought I read once that ID Software had folded or sold the rights or something, but that does not seem to be the case.  ID Software, the designers of the original DOOM games through DOOM 3, are currently at work on DOOM 4 (see Gamepro, December 2010 issue).  This is awesome news for the computer game, but I would really hope that FFG could get on-board with this as well and produce more products for the FFG DOOM boardgame. 



#2 shnar

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Posted 14 November 2010 - 10:26 AM

Firstly, FFG would need to go into another licensing agreement, since their original one is expired. Secondly, this probably won't happen until long after Doom4 is released. Thirdly, it will probably be a Doom4-only license, which would mean a new game and not any kind of expansions for the existing board game. There is a possibility the license will include all Doom products, but that's between FFG and Id.

In other words, don't hold your breath, if anything happens it will be a long time from now and probably won't be anything we can incorporate into our existing Doom games...

-shnar



#3 Steve-O

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 02:50 AM

shnar said:

Firstly, FFG would need to go into another licensing agreement, since their original one is expired. Secondly, this probably won't happen until long after Doom4 is released. Thirdly, it will probably be a Doom4-only license, which would mean a new game and not any kind of expansions for the existing board game. There is a possibility the license will include all Doom products, but that's between FFG and Id.

I agree that any kind of Doom 4 board game would most likely be a stand-alone product - especially if FFG didn't bother with renewing the license to print the original Doom BG and so the base game we currently have would remain OOP.

However, since FFG owns the game engine they developed, it would be a simple matter to design such a "sequel" game with the same or slightly altered mechanics, to the point that a new game would be effectively compatible with the old one.  As such it would likely function as an expansion for those of us who have the original game, or at the very least, could be kitbashed into one with a few house rules.

This is not to say I expect such a game to be made (though I would be elated if it did.)  I gather that the expiry of the original license was somewhat abrupt, so I don't know if there's still bad blood running around or not which might prevent one or both parties from seeking/agreeing to such a renewed effort.  Only time will tell, I suppose.  It'd be great to see, but I won't be holding my breath.

 



#4 Interceptor

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 11:51 AM

The thing about Doom is that from the original Doom back in the 90s through Doom 3, the basic story has not changed...heck, the monsters even stayed the same...they just got a new make-over in Doom 3.  Assuming Doom 4 maintains the same concept (space marines verses hellish creatures in haunted, futureistic corridors), it certainly would not take much to make an expansion to the already existing Doom boardgame.  Release a "Doom 4" expansion with some new floor tiles and some new creatures from the new game, and you're ready to go.  I agree...I don't see this really happening, but you never know.  I'm sure ID Software has a lot of new members in management since Doom 3 came out in what, 2005?  If they want to hype their game and gain the interest of PC gamers as well as boardgamers, what better way to promote their product than to allow a boardgame crossover?  Either way, I'm excited...anything that keeps the Doom mythology alive is OK in my book. 

Hail and kill!



#5 Steve-O

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Posted 25 November 2010 - 01:52 AM

Interceptor said:

The thing about Doom is that from the original Doom back in the 90s through Doom 3, the basic story has not changed...heck, the monsters even stayed the same...they just got a new make-over in Doom 3.  Assuming Doom 4 maintains the same concept (space marines verses hellish creatures in haunted, futureistic corridors), it certainly would not take much to make an expansion to the already existing Doom boardgame.

It's really not a question of how "hard" it would be to make a Doom 4 BG.  The main issue would be whether or not FFG and Id are willing to enter into a new legal agreement to publish a Doom 4 board game after the way things ended for the previous board game.

Doom tBG might not be the biggest seller on the block, but it seems to have done well for itself.  Either the profit margins weren't good enough to keep making the first game or there was some sort of disagreement between FFG and Id (details are regrettably few) but given that the first license apparently wasn't worth maintaining to one or both parties, I think it's unlikely they'll agree to start a new one (or revitalize the old one) for what is essentially the same proposition.  Whether we're talking about a new expansion or a whole new game, something about the first attempt just wasn't good enough for the people looking at the bottom lines.

Don't ask me what that something was.  As a consumer I was thoroughly impressed with Doom.  No complaints that couldn't be fixed with house rules.



#6 shnar

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Posted 25 November 2010 - 05:16 AM

Considering the Holiday Sale last year, here's what I think happened:

 - The original Doom came out, and after some time it did indeed sell out, requiring a 2nd Printing (with better dice).
 - Expansion came out, and as with all expansions, it didn't sell as well (no 2nd Printing)
 - 2nd Printing never sold out, so FFG feels the market has pretty much been tapped.
 - With sales down and not really going anywhere, FFG felt there was no profit in renewing the license with Id.
 - 2009 Holiday Sale comes around, FFG tries to clear out their back stock, they successfully clear out the Expansions, but not all base game, however sales are not terrible, so maybe there's still a market?
 - 2012 comes around, Doom 4 is released, there will be some interest in creating a new license.

Hard to say if there actually will be a new license or not, since the original game didn't sell through 2 printings. Descent, a larger more complex game (the general thought being that is should be a more niche market) has gone through what, 4 printings? So the execs may feel that there's not enough interest in Doom to pay for a license agreement.

-shnar



#7 Tyroki

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 10:27 PM

shnar said:

Considering the Holiday Sale last year, here's what I think happened:

 - The original Doom came out, and after some time it did indeed sell out, requiring a 2nd Printing (with better dice).
 - Expansion came out, and as with all expansions, it didn't sell as well (no 2nd Printing)
 - 2nd Printing never sold out, so FFG feels the market has pretty much been tapped.
 - With sales down and not really going anywhere, FFG felt there was no profit in renewing the license with Id.
 - 2009 Holiday Sale comes around, FFG tries to clear out their back stock, they successfully clear out the Expansions, but not all base game, however sales are not terrible, so maybe there's still a market?
 - 2012 comes around, Doom 4 is released, there will be some interest in creating a new license.

Hard to say if there actually will be a new license or not, since the original game didn't sell through 2 printings. Descent, a larger more complex game (the general thought being that is should be a more niche market) has gone through what, 4 printings? So the execs may feel that there's not enough interest in Doom to pay for a license agreement.

-shnar

 

Guess we just have to wait and hope, right? :P



#8 shnar

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 05:14 AM

Tyroki said:

Guess we just have to wait and hope, right? :P

And in the meantime, I can try to get that damn Advanced Campaign done :P

I was working on an ArtsCow deck to see if I could fill one 54 card deck as a 'beta'. I'm about 20 cards shy, mainly the Encounter ones (Encounters, Locations, and Encounters In Hell). Still got a lot of work ahead of me...

-shnar



#9 Jakews

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 05:34 AM

That is a great analysis. I think you hit the nail on the head. Unbelievable that Decsent did so much better than doom.

 

shnar said:

Considering the Holiday Sale last year, here's what I think happened:

 - The original Doom came out, and after some time it did indeed sell out, requiring a 2nd Printing (with better dice).
 - Expansion came out, and as with all expansions, it didn't sell as well (no 2nd Printing)
 - 2nd Printing never sold out, so FFG feels the market has pretty much been tapped.
 - With sales down and not really going anywhere, FFG felt there was no profit in renewing the license with Id.
 - 2009 Holiday Sale comes around, FFG tries to clear out their back stock, they successfully clear out the Expansions, but not all base game, however sales are not terrible, so maybe there's still a market?
 - 2012 comes around, Doom 4 is released, there will be some interest in creating a new license.

Hard to say if there actually will be a new license or not, since the original game didn't sell through 2 printings. Descent, a larger more complex game (the general thought being that is should be a more niche market) has gone through what, 4 printings? So the execs may feel that there's not enough interest in Doom to pay for a license agreement.

-shnar



#10 shnar

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 05:57 AM

Jakews said:

That is a great analysis. I think you hit the nail on the head. Unbelievable that Decsent did so much better than doom.

 

I think it's two reasons: 1) Since Descent continued to have expansion after expansion released, that alone encourages people (at least I know it encourages me) to take a more serious look at the game. With so many expansions, then it has to be a decent game, right? and 2) Fantasy seems to do better in general than Sci-Fi, let alone Sci-Fi Horror. I think gamers like dungeon crawls, swords, armor, spells, etc, more than guns and hellish invaders.

Too bad too, I kind of wonder how the sales would have gone had say a 2nd Expansion been created...

-shnar



#11 Tyroki

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 09:41 AM

shnar said:

Jakews said:

 

That is a great analysis. I think you hit the nail on the head. Unbelievable that Decsent did so much better than doom.

 

 

 

I think it's two reasons: 1) Since Descent continued to have expansion after expansion released, that alone encourages people (at least I know it encourages me) to take a more serious look at the game. With so many expansions, then it has to be a decent game, right? and 2) Fantasy seems to do better in general than Sci-Fi, let alone Sci-Fi Horror. I think gamers like dungeon crawls, swords, armor, spells, etc, more than guns and hellish invaders.

Too bad too, I kind of wonder how the sales would have gone had say a 2nd Expansion been created...

-shnar

 

Probably a darn sight better than had the game been balanced better from the get go :P

Not everyone is a fan of house ruling, unfortunately.



#12 Steve-O

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 02:06 AM

Jakews said:

 

That is a great analysis. I think you hit the nail on the head. Unbelievable that Decsent did so much better than doom.

 

 

I think a big part of Descent's success was because it was their own IP. They didn't have to pay another company royalties, which means they didn't have to sell as many units to make the whole shebang profitable for them. This in turn allowed them to crank out expansions sooner and more frequently.  Which, in turn, helped to boost sales, as Shnar was saying.

Tyroki said:

 

Probably a darn sight better than had the game been balanced better from the get go :P

Not everyone is a fan of house ruling, unfortunately.

 

 

"Balance" is a subjective term.  I think Doom is very well balanced without any house rules.  It's hard as **** for 3 marines to win, but it wouldn't have the same horror/suspense atmosphere otherwise.  If the win ratio were closer to 50/50 I wouldn't have enjoyed this game half as much as I do.

Descent's win ratio is closer to 50/50 and perhaps that's part of the reason it's done so much better than Doom among the plebes, but its rules are also much messier and more complicated.  Doom is quick, clean and hard, hard, hard.



#13 Julia

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 03:43 AM

shnar said:

I think it's two reasons: 1) Since Descent continued to have expansion after expansion released, that alone encourages people (at least I know it encourages me) to take a more serious look at the game. With so many expansions, then it has to be a decent game, right?

That's very true. I was a little skeptical about this kind of games. The reason I play Doom is because of Tibs. Nonetheless, even after I started playing Doom (occasionally at first; more often in these days - boys, I love it!), I continued being a little skeptical about Descent. But as Shnar said, the fact that the game is so appreciated / supported and many people I know do play it and are happy about it, I decided to give it a try. And I'm not the only one.


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