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Competitive Tournaments


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#1 schauhead

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Posted 23 August 2010 - 06:46 AM

From what I understand tournaments are probably going to be a team agaisnt the game and whiver team does the 'best' job of completeing the quest wins the tournament.  That sounds like it would work, but my biggest question with that would be how to stop cheating?  I would hope its not an issue in most groups but the higher level the competition the more this could be an issue.  If none of your opponents are at the same table as you, what's to stop you from cheating?  Having a judge watching every table doesn't sound feasable.

Its also possible to have a team that really doesn't understand the rules very well and may play with some kind of inadvertant 'house rule' that makes the game much easier for them.

How could you police this kind of thing with no opponent at your table?



#2 rings

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Posted 23 August 2010 - 10:44 AM

This is my issue with it.  Pretty much no way to police it other than a judge for every team.

As much as I am interested in the co-play (and demo'd at Gencon), I really think revised rules and minion decks along with 1v1 probably will happen someday.


Oh, King eh? Very nice...

#3 Darthvegeta800

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 11:31 PM

Personally I hope they leave the competitive tournie edge on the backburner.
This one should be first of all for casual fun. Coop. They have other LCG's better suited for traditional tournielevel play.
Though I suppose 'team' tournies may be interesting. With decks pitted against preconstructed decks.
Still it seems hard to pull off.

Not to forget that they haven't even figured out a multiplay ruleset for WH:I which shouldn't be that hard. Pulling of tournie acceptable rules will be far more difficult.



#4 vermillian

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 02:17 PM

 Competitive rules were in the rule book we had at the con... I, of course, had 98723239847 other things to do and kinda breezed over those... at least that's my excuse and I'm sticking to it.

I heard something about 2 2-player teams (4 people totals) playering the quest deck... team that wins best wins that round... i could be crazy...



#5 MichalKP

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Posted 25 September 2010 - 08:55 PM

I do not see this for a competetive tourneys that much as well, but if there was need it could be done like this:

Each team consists of 3 players. Each round, 2 players play a 1 watches another team. Change each round.

It's clumsy but it could work if need be (or you could sit the teams in such a fashion that a judge would be able to monitor more at the same time).



#6 dbeman

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Posted 28 September 2010 - 07:30 AM

Instead of teams competing against other teams why not just call it a "Lord of the Rings" game day and give out participation prizes? Or perhaps have each group decide amongst themselves who among them contributed most to the fellowship and award them something above and beyond?

Why must CCGers try to turn every game into a competitive tournament?



#7 Saintsman

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Posted 28 September 2010 - 02:18 PM

dbeman said:

Instead of teams competing against other teams why not just call it a "Lord of the Rings" game day and give out participation prizes? Or perhaps have each group decide amongst themselves who among them contributed most to the fellowship and award them something above and beyond?

Why must CCGers try to turn every game into a competitive tournament?

...because some people find competition fun?



#8 Hates_End

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Posted 30 September 2010 - 11:47 AM

dbeman said:

Instead of teams competing against other teams why not just call it a "Lord of the Rings" game day and give out participation prizes? Or perhaps have each group decide amongst themselves who among them contributed most to the fellowship and award them something above and beyond?

Why must CCGers try to turn every game into a competitive tournament?

because that's the Warlord way? ;)



#9 dbeman

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Posted 30 September 2010 - 01:58 PM

Saintsman said:

dbeman said:

 

Instead of teams competing against other teams why not just call it a "Lord of the Rings" game day and give out participation prizes? Or perhaps have each group decide amongst themselves who among them contributed most to the fellowship and award them something above and beyond?

Why must CCGers try to turn every game into a competitive tournament?

 

 

...because some people find competition fun?

Then again allow me to direct you to every other CCG on the market, including the other LCGs from Fantasy Flight.



#10 dbeman

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Posted 30 September 2010 - 01:59 PM

Hates_End said:

dbeman said:

 

Instead of teams competing against other teams why not just call it a "Lord of the Rings" game day and give out participation prizes? Or perhaps have each group decide amongst themselves who among them contributed most to the fellowship and award them something above and beyond?

Why must CCGers try to turn every game into a competitive tournament?

 

 

because that's the Warlord way? ;)

 

LOL...all 50 remaining players!



#11 Hates_End

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 01:44 AM

51 :)

Back on topic though, I think this game will be incredibly hard to have tournaments for unless you go with multiple judges or have some other way to prevent teams from cheating.  That being said, hell yes I want tournaments - it's the competition that makes games fun :)



#12 dbeman

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Posted 05 October 2010 - 06:37 AM

Hates_End said:

 

51 :)

Back on topic though, I think this game will be incredibly hard to have tournaments for unless you go with multiple judges or have some other way to prevent teams from cheating.  That being said, hell yes I want tournaments - it's the competition that makes games fun :)

 

 

But we're talking competition in a cooperative game? I'm not saying there isn't a way to do organized play but that conventional methods simply will not work. (nor will having multiple judges supervising multiple tables.)

I'm thinking more along the lines of (somehow) measuring each player's contribution to their game and have the top contributor(s) move on to team up with the top contributor(s) from other tables and keeping the cycle going. This way each table will police itself and each player will try his or her hardest to contribute. This should preserve the cooperative spirit of the game while still giving those who feel as though they need to prove they're better than everyone else a chance to do so.



#13 Hates_End

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Posted 08 October 2010 - 12:45 AM

dbeman said:

I'm thinking more along the lines of (somehow) measuring each player's contribution to their game and have the top contributor(s) move on to team up with the top contributor(s) from other tables and keeping the cycle going. This way each table will police itself and each player will try his or her hardest to contribute. This should preserve the cooperative spirit of the game while still giving those who feel as though they need to prove they're better than everyone else a chance to do so.

That my friend is going to be insanely difficult - how are you going to measure top contribution?  I think when we see the rules and/or cards (hint, hint FFG! ) then we'll have a much better idea of where/how they are going.



#14 ktom

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Posted 12 October 2010 - 08:24 AM

Another interesting possibility for "competitive" play or tournament play would be for FFG to put together an "enemy deck" (or whatever they call what the players play against in the co-op model) specifically for the event. Harder to cheat when you don't know what's coming and cannot prepare for it. Lots of flavor in that, too. You don't really know what you're going to encounter before the Fellowship leaves Rivendell.



#15 Hates_End

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Posted 13 October 2010 - 06:26 PM

ktom said:

Another interesting possibility for "competitive" play or tournament play would be for FFG to put together an "enemy deck" (or whatever they call what the players play against in the co-op model) specifically for the event. Harder to cheat when you don't know what's coming and cannot prepare for it. Lots of flavor in that, too. You don't really know what you're going to encounter before the Fellowship leaves Rivendell.

tbh, while that idea is really solid, the surprise factor will last ohhhhh....about the first tournament.  with the advent of the forums, email, facebook, etc. all you really need is about 2-4 people thinking up ways to dominate the "deck" and then it's done.  granted, it could be broken as all and you really, really need to get lucky to beat it, but it will happen sooner or later.

 



#16 Adam

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 06:59 AM

I don't have a clue as to how the game works yet, but it seems curious that there'd be a competitive form with seemingly no way to directly affect each other.  Is it that you create the enemy deck for your opponent's team so they don't know what's coming?  That could be pretty interesting, actually, though I still don't imagine a co-op game being hugely popular in a competitive scene.



#17 Toqtamish

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Posted 23 October 2010 - 01:07 PM

I think it will be popular as it will be something different. Will probably a pre made deck decided by FFG that everyone plays against and see who does the best. Besides people play cooperative stuff all the time, I mean any team sport is both cooperative and competitive at the same time.



#18 dbeman

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 11:35 PM

Hates_End said:

dbeman said:

 

I'm thinking more along the lines of (somehow) measuring each player's contribution to their game and have the top contributor(s) move on to team up with the top contributor(s) from other tables and keeping the cycle going. This way each table will police itself and each player will try his or her hardest to contribute. This should preserve the cooperative spirit of the game while still giving those who feel as though they need to prove they're better than everyone else a chance to do so.

 

 

That my friend is going to be insanely difficult - how are you going to measure top contribution?

Presumably by keeping track of each player's progress toward the overall goal (# of kills, # of resources gathered, # of quests completed, etc.)



#19 Narsil0420

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 10:40 AM

I don't think it will be that complicated, it will probably just be a points system similar to Race for the Galaxy where you get one point value at the end of the game by adding up certain factors.



#20 thorondor

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Posted 05 November 2010 - 12:06 PM

maybe there is a way that an opposing player takes control over the Enemy Deck and has the cahnce to play this "deck" to a certain degree.

so for example a team consists of 4 players, 3 of them play the regular game in a round and the forth is reponsible to play the Enemy Deck of the opposing team (and vice versa).






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