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Choosing an LCG.


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#1 Atendarius

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Posted 27 April 2010 - 02:39 PM

 

 

I am in the process of choosing one of the current LCGs, the problem is I'm a major fan of all three settings. I have probably every HP Lovecraft story ever written, all of the Song of Ice and Fire books -Read multiple times- and sizable Warhammer armies along with a bunch of the novels and video games. -It's probably worth noting I am an absolute fluff nut.-

All three games look much funner than my current CCGs -MTG and Hecatomb- and I've fallen in love with the LCG format. (And of course FFG is one of my favorite companies for all my gaming needs.) I've also watched all three tutorial videos and read the three rulebooks. 

I don't know anyone else who plays an LCG, I'll be the one pioneering the concept to my gaming group. So any tips for choosing one of the games? Perhaps some reasons to choose one over another?



#2 The_Big_Show

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Posted 28 April 2010 - 06:17 AM

This is just my opinion on the three games so take as you will.

Call of Cthulhu is IMO by far the best game of the three. The mechanics are stronger, the flavour is there and I find it the mostr enjoyable of them. The only downside really is that the wording on some cards isn't great and FFG's idea of how those wordings work just seems flawed at times. But I still hold to this being the best of the three games.

A Game of Thrones is good but works better as a multiplayer game. However due to the mechanics I always find that essentially it becomes a game of Kingmaker. You may not be in a winning position but in pulling the current winner down you just set someone else up to take his place. It's frustrating and eventually the fun goes out of the game.

Invasion is good but the mechanics feel clunky and sometimes irksome in how they play. Some factions are far stronger than others at the moment. There are certain combos and cards that make one side or the other just too hard. It needs a few more battle packs out before it settles itnot it's niche I think.



#3 JerusalemJones

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Posted 28 April 2010 - 06:30 AM

I disagree with The Big Show. I play all three, and Game of Thrones is my favorite. Call of Cthulhu is fun, but games can often drag out forever as it can be dangerous to try and actually win stories, as it makes your characters unable to defend. I've played games that have drug out for over an hour.

Game of Thrones can also take a lng time to play, but there is so much variety to the game. The Plot mechanic is one of my favorites ever in any card game, and let's you control so much about how your deck is running. It really affects deck design as well, as certain plots can help you search out exactly what card you need at present (though in the current lcg format you give an opponent that same advantage). Also, with the three different types of challenges, there are many more ways to design and play your deck. Add in the fact that players go through their turns pretty much at the same time (marshalling and challenges being the exception), the game doesn't become so lopsided. usually. And being a fan of the books makes the game that much more enjoyable.

Warhammer, though, is fast and brutal and this is not a bad thing. Units don't "corrupt" to attack or defend, so games can get pretty intense. There are lots of resets, though for the "agressive" factions they tend to be "your turn" specific.

Obviously, I am in the GoT set, but I do play all three, and only Thrones "competitively." You might want to find out what palyers are in your area first, though, before you make a decision. Being the only Thrones player in a Warhammer area might be disappointing.



#4 evilidler

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Posted 28 April 2010 - 10:28 AM

Not having any knowledge whatsoever of the AGoT setting and its source material, I had the easy option of getting only the other two LCGs :)

I learned English from reading Lovecraft, so that was a natural start. The Warhammer world is my fave fantasy setting, so I couldn't resist that either. I'm one small pack from completing both collections (until the new asylum/battlepacks are in the stores), so beware. I dread starting AGoT collecting, as I know I'll try to get all of it if I like it :(

I recommend against AGoT because of that - you'll want the easiest to collect first, which is Warhammer:Invasion at the moment. You know you'll end up with all of them at some point, anyway...

 



#5 JonHook

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 01:03 AM

Also, if you are going to be the pioneer, then it will fall upon you to entice new players to join the game and teach them how to play. From that aspect, I think you will find Warhammer: Invasion to be the easiest to "infect" new players with, and it's a ton of fun to boot!  



#6 Atendarius

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 12:23 PM

Thanks for the replies.

I'm actually leaning away from Warhammer Invasion at the moment, it would probably be easier to get players into, but it seems to simplistic for my tastes. And I also don't like the Order vs. Destruction thing introduced into Warhammer. Is CoC or AGoT a more strategic game?



#7 evilidler

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 04:36 PM

CoC is definitely getting more strategic, with now several cards which allow you to completely stop arbitrary tactics without specific preparation. Naming cards to be sacrificed/unplayable really does mess up for someone investing heavily in triplicates or 8 sledge dogs ;)

W:I does have the bulk of "I WIN" cards in certain factions, rather than spread across everything, but the first cycle of battlepacks isn't even done yet. It'll get more strategic with time, I'm sure. I agree that it might be a tad simplistic if every player just plays orcs+skaven. The game needs a few curveballs like in CoC, but with a Warhammer twist of course.



#8 chrassos

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Posted 04 May 2010 - 03:32 AM

Atendarius said:

Is CoC or AGoT a more strategic game?

I dont know COC but i own and play(ed) many CCG´s before ... MGT, JYHAD, Battletech, MECCG,...

and what JerusalemJones said especialy about the plots is true.

i no other CARD games you can/must vary your strategy so much in your turns than in AGOT. you are able/you have to adapt your strategy each round.

Look.

you have a Housedeck with is the drawdeck like in other CCG´s were you draw your cards from. this is pretty random with cards you get.

BUT you also have a Plotdeck of 7 cards. from this 7 cards you search one on the beginning of each round, this card modifies the current gameround.

it could give your characters +2 Strength if your opponent has more chars then you on the field. wow

it could increase your impact on the enemy.

it can kill all characters!!!!

it could provide you with extracards

there are over 50 Plotcards!!! just imagine the deckbuilding possibilities.

ofcoures your drawdeck and plotdeck should form a synergy!!!

this, trying to findout is what makes the game truely a unique experience.

and there are guys/decks/houses that can win the game in round 2!!!

and not via pure luck!!!

 

even more

i played many games as i said before.

in no other game i know the action starts right in the first round.  you start with minimum 9 cards in round 1 and you can play 4 or 5 of them. (not all at once)

but how is it in other games eh? in many others you must first get enough resources (wich thake rounds) and then its clear which cards you play. you have no choice. you play them because you can play them!! not with this one my dear.

and which one to play is a critical decission.and nearly every choice or mistake is critical and will be punished!!!

 

in other words:

in the game of thrones there is no middleground. you win or die

 

 

 



#9 Guest_Not In Sample_*

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 03:57 PM

Atendarius said:

Thanks for the replies.

I'm actually leaning away from Warhammer Invasion at the moment, it would probably be easier to get players into, but it seems to simplistic for my tastes. And I also don't like the Order vs. Destruction thing introduced into Warhammer. Is CoC or AGoT a more strategic game?

 

Hi and welcome...

 

Sorry, but I'v to disagree... :)

Warhammer SEEMS simple. It's definitely not. Everyone playin' it for a couple of times thinks this thing about it, it's normal...But it's a lot of tactical depth, especially for the 3-zone management stuff.

Anyway, I do play Agot as well (and I used to play Cthulhu) and I've to say that it's, maybe the deeepest one from a "strategical" point of view (assuming we're using "strategy" as a long time term). :) Agot has lots of variables, complex turns and tough choices. Warhammer has them as well, but it's dfferent.

Warhammer is played a lot into single turns were players interact by a classic "action chain". Straight in the concept, pretty "solid" and obviously more "direct".

In Agot both players are essentially playin' simoultanously, alternating when game mechanics force you to do so. You have the awesome Plot and a great "combat" style, with 3 different challenges and 3 different type of consequences (gain power, kill oppo's character or discard cards from the oppo's hand).

In Warhammer turns are shorter and independent, in a Magic style, but (IMHO) with a lot more "mature" depth.

 

Cthulhu has a great mood and wonderful mechanics (possibly one of the best resource mechanic ever). It can be very short or insanely long, but with a particular feature: if you're losing, you'll probably lose. There are lots of powerful stuff (maybe difficult to cast and make work), but when it happens, it's probably over.

And when it's short, it's VERY short. This "sudden deaths" are the biggest reason why I quit.

 

Now it has changed a bit, but the risk is always there.

 

Warhammer has some suddent deaths RIGHT NOW, but things are going to change, with an incredible amount of different decks coming (control, combo, aggro-control, different ways to play each Race).

If you know a bit the game, here's a list of some effective decks, just to explain how deep and various it can be:

- Dark Elf pure control (hand destruction, board control);

- Dark Elf with Orc/Caos splash Damage deck (lots of damage, HP reduction);

- High Elf/Dwarves (or Empire or BOth) control-combo Thrower deck (lots of indirect damages in a few turns);

- Skaven stuff (more brutal with Orcs, controll-ish with Caos and DE) (now!);

- Aggro Empire (I seem calm, but I'm not);

- Empire/Dwarves control (If I build my defense, you're not gonna win);

- Dwarves Aggro (fat and brutal);

- Dwarves Control (fat and tough);

- Caos Units control (corrupt, damage...all happy thins!);

- Orc blitz (destroy everything...Me too!);

- Orc Aggro-Control (destroy everythig...awaiting for the big ones).

 

I've seen each one of these decks and they're good.

In AGOT you can ind lots of good stuff as well (just to give you a direction to look at):

- Lannister Shadow (board control with Shadow mechancic, that allows stuff to come out from an "out of play" zone with a "surprise" effect);

- Lannister Kneel (TAP everything);

- Targaryen Burn (characters control);

- Stark WInter (winter is a particular game status that "force" players to get less gold);

- Baratheon Summer (summer is the opposite of winter);

- Greyjoy Winter Aggro.Control (win fast while removing threats);

- Baratheon Shadows Aggro Control;

- Martell Control (I said NO!);

- Stark defense deck (big guys awaits you to the wall!!!);

 

Hope it helps!

Anyway, any choice will be great! :)

Remember



#10 Atendarius

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Posted 08 May 2010 - 03:14 PM

I settled on W:I, ordered the core set, assault on ulthuan and the five released battle packs. Why? Because it's the one drumming up the most interest in my group and I love the borderless cards. Plus it's only the first LCG I'm going to buy, I hope to pick up CoC and AGoT in the not to distant future. 

Question, how much skaven comes with those five battle packs? 



#11 facepalm

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Posted 08 May 2010 - 03:54 PM

Atendarius said:

I settled on W:I, ordered the core set, assault on ulthuan and the five released battle packs. Why? Because it's the one drumming up the most interest in my group and I love the borderless cards. Plus it's only the first LCG I'm going to buy, I hope to pick up CoC and AGoT in the not to distant future. 

Question, how much skaven comes with those five battle packs? 

1 copy of each?

Then... 16 i believe.



#12 facepalm

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Posted 08 May 2010 - 03:58 PM

facepalm said:

Atendarius said:

 

I settled on W:I, ordered the core set, assault on ulthuan and the five released battle packs. Why? Because it's the one drumming up the most interest in my group and I love the borderless cards. Plus it's only the first LCG I'm going to buy, I hope to pick up CoC and AGoT in the not to distant future. 

Question, how much skaven comes with those five battle packs? 

 

 

1 copy of each?

Then... 16 i believe.

just to clarify, i was asking if you were getting one of each, i didnt mean there are 16 different skaven, there are 10 different skaven, 16 cards in total, if you are getting one of each BP.



#13 Atendarius

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Posted 08 May 2010 - 04:34 PM

Yes, one of each pack, I'd rather have more variety than a full play set of each card. So 16 Skaven cards, less than I was hoping but not bad. Are High Elves really uncompetitive? They're my favorite race in the game so far. (I play them in WFB.)



#14 facepalm

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Posted 08 May 2010 - 05:29 PM

highelfs arent bad, at first they were not very competetive, but now that a few more BP's have come out they are a great deck to play.

I have played 7 games as them and won 5, so i think they are pretty good, they have also showed up in top 3's in several regional tournaments, so they are competetively viable now if they are comstructed right.

Glad to hear you'll be getting this game, hope you it works for you, it is a good game.



#15 facepalm

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Posted 09 May 2010 - 08:35 AM

Also, the preview of the upcoming BP, Arcane Fire, shows that we will have at least one more skaven that pack, it is a support card. I am also thinking their will be atleast one more unit, since this is the last pack of the cycle, they might as well have some sweet skaven.

My guess is that the picture on the front of skaven blight threat will show up as a card in this pack (it is the only cover to not have a card)

Probably 12-13 different skaven after the nest pack  is counted to.



#16 toastcrumbs

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Posted 07 July 2010 - 11:39 PM

Atendarius said:

I don't know anyone else who plays an LCG, I'll be the one pioneering the concept to my gaming group. So any tips for choosing one of the games? Perhaps some reasons to choose one over another?

Good luck with that. I'd love to hear back on how it goes.



#17 Keggy

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Posted 09 July 2010 - 08:35 AM

I'm a bit tempted to get into LCGs as well.  I've been leaning towards WI, but thats because I (and my group) are a bit more familiar with Warhammer than the others, and I've seen more explanation of WI than the other 2.



#18 MarthWMaster

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Posted 09 July 2010 - 03:42 PM

Which one is the most widely popular out of the three at the moment? Do any of them show any signs of stopping?

More importantly, I'd like to know if any of them are clearly going to be around for the duration. Cthulhu is the game I most want to play, but since I'm late coming into it, I don't want the game to end right when I've put a good deck together. Games have had a habit of doing that to me.


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#19 Darksbane

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Posted 12 July 2010 - 02:58 AM

Using the un-scientific forum activity as an indicator of the size of each game I'd say Cthulhu lags behind the other 2.


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#20 facepalm

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Posted 12 July 2010 - 11:43 AM

Not to mention Warhammer invasion is substantially newer, so considering the amount of posts and topics, it is a lot more active then the other 2.






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