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How big is the Bestiary in the core set of WFRP 3rd ed ?


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#1 Armrek

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Posted 21 August 2009 - 10:26 PM

I am asking this because I have notice a decline in Bestiary content when WFRP went from 1st to 2nd ed. So question is, are there:

Greater demons
Lesser demons
Zoats
Dragons
Gnomes
Fimir
Skaven
All sorts of undead like in the 1st ed

And are the descriptions good and heavy, because let's face it; the 1st ed beastiary was very good and thorough, take for instance the Skaven which is an importent part of the sinister setting in the warhammer world. 2nd ed was ok but very much reduced compared to 1st ed...



#2 Fabs

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Posted 21 August 2009 - 10:35 PM

Armrek said:

I am asking this because I have notice a decline in Bestiary content when WFRP went from 1st to 2nd ed. So question is, are there:

Greater demons
Lesser demons
Zoats
Dragons
Gnomes
Fimir
Skaven
All sorts of undead like in the 1st ed

And are the descriptions good and heavy, because let's face it; the 1st ed beastiary was very good and thorough, take for instance the Skaven which is an importent part of the sinister setting in the warhammer world. 2nd ed was ok but very much reduced compared to 1st ed...

Some of those have been removed from the Warhammer World (Zoats, FImir, Gnomes) so definatley won't be appearing.

I imagine the v2 version would be the minimum - I can't see them cutting the core bestiary any more than that. Especially the very Warhammer specific creatures like Skaven. I hope there is more, and that large creatures scale better than previously (sould do, as they really seem to be cutting the WFB apron strings now). I'll look forward to seeing a definative answer.

I hope they have the careers for creatures as well, just to make them easier to modifier 'on the hop'.



#3 Hellebore

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Posted 21 August 2009 - 10:38 PM

Armrek said:

 

I am asking this because I have notice a decline in Bestiary content when WFRP went from 1st to 2nd ed. So question is, are there:

Greater demons
Lesser demons
Zoats
Dragons
Gnomes
Fimir
Skaven
All sorts of undead like in the 1st ed

And are the descriptions good and heavy, because let's face it; the 1st ed beastiary was very good and thorough, take for instance the Skaven which is an importent part of the sinister setting in the warhammer world. 2nd ed was ok but very much reduced compared to 1st ed...

 

 

 

We don't know. There are 4 books in the core set. One is the adventure book, another is the tome of mysteries, the other is about priests and the other is for the GM (which I would assume has the bestiary in it). We don't know if all the books are the same size, some are smaller or larger, etc.

What you won't find in the books of this edition or any after are zoats, gnomes and fimir. The zoats and gnomes have not been mentioned for 15 years or more and although there has been oblique reference to swamp daemons ala fimir, I highly doubt they will reemerge.

I would put my bet on:

Goblins

Skaven

Orcs

Beastmen

Humans

 

Each with a boss version. We don't know if they will use the same combat abilities as the PCs, but I doubt it. I'd say they have generic and basic abilities leaving the PCs with special attacks and abilities.

They will no doubt release enemy expansion boxes with whole armies of the various bad races.

 

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#4 DagobahDave

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Posted 21 August 2009 - 10:58 PM

Hellebore said:

They will no doubt release enemy expansion boxes with whole armies of the various bad races.

Spread out all of the creatures by threat level -- Little guys of all kinds in the first expansion. Middleweights in the second expansion. Bosses in the third. FFG pnwz you.


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#5 Hellebore

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Posted 21 August 2009 - 11:04 PM

DagobahDave said:

Hellebore said:

They will no doubt release enemy expansion boxes with whole armies of the various bad races.

 

Spread out all of the creatures by threat level -- Little guys of all kinds in the first expansion. Middleweights in the second expansion. Bosses in the third. FFG pnwz you.

I doubt that very much. They can only release enemies in expansions, because they aren't all going to be in the core box. Thus, enemy expansion boxes is probably how they will be done.

 

Hellebore



#6 Foolishboy

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Posted 21 August 2009 - 11:08 PM

Fabs said:

 

Some of those have been removed from the Warhammer World (Zoats, FImir, Gnomes) so definatley won't be appearing.

Those races were omitted not removed, much like the Gods of Law. In fact in some publications the Career Compendium for example strongly hint at the existance of Fimir. The Fimir and Zoats may well make a comeback because they are so popular with the fans.



#7 Foolishboy

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Posted 21 August 2009 - 11:14 PM

The problem with the WFRPv2 Bestiary was that BI wanted to make some more money by not putting much in the Corebook frocing us to by a seperate Bestiary book and then they decided to scatter creatures all through the other books much like Careers, spells, skills/talents and everything else. Hopefully FFG will just make one good Bestiary section and leave it at that.



#8 Crazy Aido

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Posted 22 August 2009 - 03:28 AM

But both Skaven and Chaos were both interesting enough to warrant their own source books.

 

I love shadow of the horned rat. It really lets you evoke the idea of playing against a malignant evil race and you could sculpt a whole campaign around, better than an entry in a monster book, see where I'm coming from?



#9 N0-1_H3r3

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Posted 22 August 2009 - 04:18 AM

Foolishboy said:

Fabs said:

 

 

Some of those have been removed from the Warhammer World (Zoats, FImir, Gnomes) so definatley won't be appearing.

 

 

Those races were omitted not removed, much like the Gods of Law. In fact in some publications the Career Compendium for example strongly hint at the existance of Fimir. The Fimir and Zoats may well make a comeback because they are so popular with the fans.

On this note, the Fimir actually appeared for a chunk of the latest Warhammer: Time of Legends novel, though never named as such (the descriptions were a dead giveaway, though, as was the fact that the battle was against 'swamp daemons' in the marshes around what was the town of Marburg (which became Marienburg)...


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#10 Armrek

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Posted 23 August 2009 - 01:56 AM

Foolishboy, was that the Heldenhammer novel where the Fimir appeared?



#11 Mordenthral

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Posted 01 September 2009 - 07:06 AM

Foolishboy said:

The problem with the WFRPv2 Bestiary was that BI wanted to make some more money by not putting much in the Corebook frocing us to by a seperate Bestiary book and then they decided to scatter creatures all through the other books much like Careers, spells, skills/talents and everything else. Hopefully FFG will just make one good Bestiary section and leave it at that.

If they're going with consolidation of reference material into card decks that you can add to as they are expanded, wouldn't it make sense to have a Foe Deck for the GMs ease of use?



#12 Foolishboy

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Posted 01 September 2009 - 07:32 AM

Mordenthral said:

Foolishboy said:

 

The problem with the WFRPv2 Bestiary was that BI wanted to make some more money by not putting much in the Corebook frocing us to by a seperate Bestiary book and then they decided to scatter creatures all through the other books much like Careers, spells, skills/talents and everything else. Hopefully FFG will just make one good Bestiary section and leave it at that.

 

 

If they're going with consolidation of reference material into card decks that you can add to as they are expanded, wouldn't it make sense to have a Foe Deck for the GMs ease of use?

Unfortunately cards aren't really big enough to contain a good amount of information, so if they go that route the bestiary will probably just contain the bear statistics without any additional information.



#13 jackdays

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Posted 01 September 2009 - 09:12 AM

Is there any info how Bestiary is actually presented in the WFRP3? I mean, are they in the cards or just information in the books?

I didn't like how stats were created in the "Old World Bestiary". It could have had few more details (for example size and more different bonuses conserning that). But if they go to cards, it seem even worse...

My bet is, that Core Box will present stats of few basic Monsters (probably just those favorite Humanoid races with few variations, some animal stats, maybe few types of basic Daemons and MAYBE also few bigger monsters to get some taste). AND then there is going to be somekind of "Bestiary Expansion" with HUGE collection of monsters. Hopefully much more and better detailed than in "Old World Bestiary".We do know most of the Warhammer monsters. Most of them (not all, but most I would say) were presented in the various WFRP2 products. It would be nice that this "Bestiary Expansion" would feature most.

BUT it may not be so. You can easily have monsters divided to many boxes: Chaos, Greenskins, Skaven, Undead, Vampires, Lizardmen, Ogres...etc.

PS. Its funny how GnomesZoats and Fimir keep on coming back to these bestiary talks?! They ARE GONE from the Warhammer World and that is that. Yet, fans just seem to love them (well, maybe not the Gnomes). There are fan-rules, but why not bring the back to the world in official way?!


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#14 jadrax

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Posted 01 September 2009 - 09:19 AM

jackdays said:

Is there any info how Bestiary is actually presented in the WFRP3? I mean, are they in the cards or just information in the books?

Not that I have seen. It is one of the big reveals we are waiting for.



#15 Jaysin1414

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Posted 01 September 2009 - 10:17 AM

Foolishboy said:

Mordenthral said:

 

Foolishboy said:

 

The problem with the WFRPv2 Bestiary was that BI wanted to make some more money by not putting much in the Corebook frocing us to by a seperate Bestiary book and then they decided to scatter creatures all through the other books much like Careers, spells, skills/talents and everything else. Hopefully FFG will just make one good Bestiary section and leave it at that.

 

 

If they're going with consolidation of reference material into card decks that you can add to as they are expanded, wouldn't it make sense to have a Foe Deck for the GMs ease of use?

 

 

Unfortunately cards aren't really big enough to contain a good amount of information, so if they go that route the bestiary will probably just contain the bear statistics without any additional information.

They did mention that the Bestiary is in the GM book*  - so at the very least, there will be more than just monster cards.  I'm not quite sure that FFG has said that there are monster cards, have they?

 

* Tome of Adventure: A Guide to Game Mastery & Roleplaying
The Tome of Adventure contains additional rules and information for the player who will be running the Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay sessions as the GM. It includes suggestions and guidelines on managing long-term campaigns, handling character development, and creating adventures. The book also contains background and statistics for a variety of enemies to pit the players’ heroes against, as well as a complete introductory adventure.

http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?eidn=752



#16 Mordenthral

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Posted 02 September 2009 - 12:53 AM

Jaysin1414 said:

They did mention that the Bestiary is in the GM book*  - so at the very least, there will be more than just monster cards.  I'm not quite sure that FFG has said that there are monster cards, have they?

No, not at all. It's just that they have a career deck, for instance, so that all of your careers are in one place. Any new careers can just be added to the deck so you aren't searching across multiple books looking for a career reference (or waiting for a compendium.) I was just pointing out how good it would be if FFG does the same thing with the bestiary. If they release new monsters and denizens in later supplements, then the GM is back to searching across multiple books for the reference.

A monster deck would be great for random encounters too. Background information could be kept in the books, with relevant stats on the cards. This may have to be a home project though, since no mention of monster cards has been made.



#17 Cynical Cat

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Posted 02 September 2009 - 08:25 AM

Monster cards are handy.  One of the guys in our group used the D&D minatures (which come with stat cards) in a game he ran.  It made it very easy for him to consult monster stats because he had them right there, without having to crack open a single book.  1st edition Earthdawn did this as well and I've found in quite handy when running that game.



#18 RARodger

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Posted 05 September 2009 - 04:57 AM

You know, monster cards would be useful, especially if you had all the rules stuff on it and then a book and page reference. That way most of the time you would only need the card, but even if the monster was detailed in a supplement it would be quicker to find.






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